Swashbuckler 1700

I am not sure is this any real value but I would say anything handy like boarding pikes, axes, cargo hooks, ofcourse cutlasses and firearms as clubs (when they were fired) and just teeth, fists or kicks. I think not much weapons would be needed so I think that they would carry only few weapons. I could quote Gordingly here but I have little bad aftertaste of his quotes so it can wait.

I am not saying that all pirates used fine clothing often but it seems that it happened occasionally Here is some period description of pirates I have found these from here (forums) or from books and good websites and they should all be real and there is no dougth of it. From The Memoirs of Pére Labat 1693-1705 “[Filibuster] Daniel kept the most valuable portions of the cargo [of an shipwrecked English vessel], such as silver, gold fringes, brocades, ribbons, Indian silks, etc., etc., for his own ship, not counting loot that the crew had taken for themselves. The men dressed themselves up in all kinds of fine clothes, and were a comical sight as they strutted about the island [Avis Island, to the leeward of Dominica according to the ms.] in feathered hats, wigs, silk __ stockings, ribbons, and other garments. They discovered [learned] from the slaves that some cases of valuables and silver had been buried [by the English crew of the wrecked ship], so an inventory of all the cargo that had been found was shown to the supercargo [the person hired by the ship’s owner to manage, buy, trade and sell the merchandise on the ship] of the wreck and compared with his bills of lading. The two lists showed that many valuable articles were missing, and our quartermaster told him that if the lost goods were not found at once that filibusters knew the way to make him open his mouth. Fear made him disclose everything.” one victim of pirates in 1720s described what happened when pirates found his wig: "I could not refrain laughing when I saw the fellows, for they had, in rummaging my cabin, met with a leather powder bag and puff, with which they had powdered themselves from head to foot, walked the decks with their hats under their arms, minced their oaths, and affected all the airs of a beau with an awkwardness that would have forced a smile from a cynic." Captain Samuel Cary's ship, the Samuel, is 13 July 1720, the Boston Newsletter Reported That "[t], they first thing the Pirates did was Thurs strip Both Passengers and Seamen of All Their Money and clothes ... with a loaded pistol to every one's breast ready to shoot him down Immediately to the WHO did not give an account of Both, and Resign Them up. "(Sanders, 113) In 1721, a pirate appropriated all the clothes of John Wingfield, the Royal African Company factor aboard the Hannibal, and for a week paraded in front of the factor in all his finery purloined. A passenger, who sailed aboard a vessel seized by Captain Low, submitted an advertisement to the Boston Newsletter, published in the 18-25 June 1722 issue, that listed a variety of garments the pirates took: …one scarlet suit of Clothes, one new gray Broad Cloth Coat, 1 Sword, with a fine red Velvet Belt…nine Bags of Coat and Jacket Buttons, a considerable quantity of sewing Silk and Mohair, Shoe Buckles…one Scarff of Red Persian Silk, fringed with black Silk…one Beaver Hat bound with Silver Lace… (British, v. 1, 287) This is by Snelgave: " Amongst my Adventure of Goods, I had in a Box three second-hand embroidered Coats. One day the three Pirate Captains…enquired for them, saying, “They understood by my Book such Clothes were in my Ship.” I told them, “They were in a Box under the bed place in the State-room. So they ordered them to be taken out, and immediately put them on.” But the longest Coat falling to Cocklyn’s share, who was a very short Man, it almost reached as low as his Ancles. This very much displeased him, and he would fain have changed with Le Boofe, or Davis: But they refused, telling him, “As they were going on Shore amongst the Negroe-Ladies, who did not know the white Mens fashions, it was no matter. Moreover, as his Coat was Scarlet embroidered with Silver, they believed he would have the preference of them, (whose Coats were not so showy) in the opinion of their Mistresses. The Pirate Captains having taken these Cloaths without leave from the Quarter-master, it gave great offence to all the Crew; who alledg’d, “If they suffered such things, the Captains would for the future assume a Power, to take whatever they liked for themselves.” So upon their returning on board next Morning, the Coats were taken from them, and put into the common Chest, to be sold at the Mast" This is new addition When HMS Swallow’s surgeon boarded Roberts’ Ranger to tend the wounded he found the villains dressed in “white shirts, watches, and a deal of silk vests.”

You talk like it's a foregone conclusion that a new reenactor would start with basic sailor garb. Having watched many new pirate reenactors appear at events, I can tell you that that's not what many of them start off thinking. Even 'serious' reenactors sometimes start with long jackets with brass buttons and piping, tricorns with feathers, ornate trim and so forth. Why shouldn't they? Even period drawings from the general history show this sort of thing. Like the ones below (many of which have been recently posted on this forum): Bart Roberts (hand colored in gaudy tones) Edward Teach/Blackbeard: Henry Every/Avery Stede Bonnet Jack Rackham I just found it interesting that in this thread the idea of dressing like a common sailor seemed almost a bit novel when it first came up. (Although it had been mentioned on this forum before that, just never debated on this scale from what I can tell.) It was neat insight into how the conversation has developed over time and it raises points we discuss even still. I know that many persons don’t give any regard to Ghop or its illustrations. I don’t like that and I think that they are not so bad at all. For example one new book “Pirate the Golden Age” made by Angus Constam and David Rickman railed against those GHoP pictures as bad and “too imaginative”. While it is possible there are little or little bigger errors here and there (since picture maker had not seen those persons) but to me it seems really absurd that all or even most of the stuff in those pictures is false and incorrect. Since I cannot agree with those critics I don’t mock those images as bad evidence and that is one reason why I boycott that book and its too harsh arguments.

Aye, but themes from this thread are oft repeated. This thread answers so many questions that are asked again and again, but where Twill is concerned, we tend to agree that the basic sailor is the least arguable in any debate over interpretation. If you have basic sailor kit then you're accurate for historical Interpretation and acceptable for all other interpretations. Also, there were more sailors than captains, so the basic seaman discussion answers the 'Too Many Captains' issue which has come up again and again. The basic sailor interpretation also becomes the answer to such questions as 'Where do I start?', 'What kit should I focus on?', 'What did they wear?', 'How did they live?', 'How were they paid?', and so many other questions like footwear, head gear, shirts, weapons, etc. Focus on exotic additions and interpretation can sometimes paint over the basic little things like sewing palms, fids, sailor's knives, monmouth caps, and every other simple thing a working man would keep aboard ship. (I am not actual reenactor but) I think that we should advertise sailor clothing as pirate clothing since it is at least accurate. But occasionally finery can be used if it makes even little sense like in shore... For starters I would say sailor's cap, breeches and jacket and for captain small/ medium brim hat( not musketeer style) or occasional tricorn with jacket or coat and small tied shoes or buckled ones to all who use shoes..... But those are just my thoughts

i agree that all TWs are great and thanks for seeing my partial point? ( I think ? )...have you played Napoleon? i haven't, been thinking about it for a while. Napoleon is good but not much different than other. Yes I have it an it is nice...

This is actually the first time I have sat down and read the whole thing. It was a good, spirited discussion. And I thought your moderation was spot on, sir. There when needed, but not so heavy it killed the discussion. But has anyone anything new to say? since there is pretty much same evidence as always and it is all matter how you/ we interpret it. like how much we think that stuff like Snelgrave's coat affair or Labat's writings of pirates can be applied to casual pirate look. I personally think that mainly pirates looked like sailors but there could have been and was exceptions like situations like shore parties or people like Bonnet or Roberts..

I find interesting that in Gaop both English navy and army had reddish outfits.... I think that reenactors (if they want to be accurate) should look much like sailors. But few can well have nicer clothing but then it should be casual and that kind of clothing that could get in pirates hands like fine coats (evidence) wigs or nice hats but not odd stuff like riding boots. Truth is some where in the middle of "pirates always looked just like sailors" and "pirates were dashing rogues". There is some evidence To support both visions (GHoP, Snelgrave, Labat etc.) but I think the guess that they looked more like sailors is more closer

Paper one is in this book ( in book there is some errors but it is quite good (there is no perfect books) see preview. It is quite early in it http://www.amazon.com/Pirate-Eyewitness-Books-Richard-Platt/dp/0756607132 This is telescope from 1661

I know that in Gaop some spyglasses that were made out leather/ wood. One was from 1660s. I need to find a pic of it. Some spyglasses were also made from paper. sounds odd but there was one from 1690s. I try to find pics. That spyglass did not seem to be very old. I would say mid1800s. but I am not real expert so...

Critisims is welcome but if it is only like " picture makers did not known anything and make bad pics" let it be . Please I have heard that too many times.... We must accept that there has never been or never will be 100% accurate images . But in any case pictorial evidence cannot be dissmised 100% but we should always have critisim to those pics (I am not that naive) but when we compare them with other sources like writings and pictures made by different artists we can get really good information out of them.... Sorry if I was rude to someone..... Now is good time to say this sorry for funny writing errors but I have written my posts casually and English is not my mother language anyway. Some are funny though like "fur cat" and I was supposed to say "fur cap"

Look at that flag! It's more fanciful than the ones most reenactors have come up with. (And that's saying something.) Perhaps people in Gaop had better imagination. I like that flag very much. Picture sharing time Some can be familiar with these but... Blackbeard circa 1725 in GHoP, apparently used in some later editions as well. same man from same book but from 1724 note what the silly combination fur cap and palm trees make. perhaps that was the reason why hat was changed... same guy from same book from later 1724 edtition or/ and from one 1726 edition (sources differ but it is certainly from mid 1720s.) Bart Roberts from 1724 edition or one of the later mid 1720s editions. see this is colored version and note flags. http://jcb.lunaimagi.../what/Artifacts, industry, and human activities/Pirates/where/[Amsterdam];sort:Normalized_date%2CCreators%2CPublisher%2CTitle;lc:JCB~1~1,JCBBOOKS~1~1,JCBMAPS~1~1,JCBMAPS~2~2&mi=12&trs=22 In this pic native American man is shot by European soldiers or buccaneers. It is from circa 1700 or before that. Like many can understand european view of indians was not too accurate since they just look like naked Europeans.

Is the term 13 colonies accurate here? And if I count privateers can I put the Pasific as well (there were those Manila galleons)?

I cannot say that I agree totaly. But all Tws are great

Done ( and same I fixed some spelling errors as well) I hope others can find even more. Thanks

Are you sure that you mean ETW it is not cartoonish . I can not say that I agree. I mean this game and I don't see cartoon style Comparing it with other games like anno 1404, Setlers or Age of Empires it is far more realistic Age of Empires

interesting stuff from from Johnson's book: " I had an Account given me of one of these merry Tryals, and as it appeared diverting, I shall give the Readers a short Account of it. The Court and Criminals being both appointed, as also Council to plead, the Judge got up in a Tree, and had a dirty Taurpaulin hung over his Shoulders; this was done by Way of Robe, with a Thrum Cap on his Head, and a large Pair of Spectacles upon his Nose: Thus equipp'd, he settled himself in his Place, and abundance of Officers attending him below, with Crows, Handspikes, &c. instead of Wands, Tipstaves, and such like. " that will make me think were glasses so expensive... This is picture from late 17th century: man selling glasses

I say Long John Silver, and he has no protestic att all. Often I hear that it is error why he has no wooden leg but see that 18th century sailor has missing leg but see no woodenleg at all. Perhaps Stevenson saw that pic and it inspired him....

I am pretty sure that there is no proper tread for this Let's face one thing. In Golden age there were no naval uniforms ( I think most of you know that) (I mean mostly Royal Navy here) But let's take a look to period Officers' look and colors. It seems that slop clothing colors like red and gray (or pre 1706 blue) were not dominat in officers' wardrobe. This tread focuses in naval officers look in general and also colors in this period. Here is some pics Admiral Russel who lived in this period Three admirals here: Russel with Admiral John Benbow and Admiral Sir Ralph Delaval (blue and brown are colors there) here is one blue admiral from 1710 cica 1735 early 1700s from this period late 17th c or really early 1700s. Here is 1703 print of admiral (at sea note that) (it is english admiral in Dutch illustration) Hmm it appers that admirals are easiest to find.... I am digging up captains and post captains alike.....

Stede Bonnet's Death made 1725 for Dutch edition of GHoP same book's title bage http://jcb.lunaimagi...~2&mi=26&trs=69 Pic from Buccaneers of America from 1740s edition http://jcb.lunaimagi...2~2&mi=3&trs=41 same here http://jcb.lunaimagi...~2&mi=29&trs=41 and also this from same time http://jcb.lunaimagi...~2&mi=30&trs=41 Morgan from same work http://jcb.lunaimagi...~2&mi=14&trs=41 Title bage of BoA 1744 http://jcb.lunaimagi...~2&mi=16&trs=41 Morgan from 1736 edtition of GHoP http://jcb.lunaimagi...~2&mi=22&trs=41

Happy easter! I may not be need for peg leg pics or do you? ( are you already dealt with those?) here is some pics still http://www.metmuseum...n+Rijn)&pos=128 soldier from early 17th century http://www.aucklanda...982_1_2_158.jpg I afraid that these are not good there is one and he is sailor bit later period but... http://www.eco-action.org/dod/no10/books_hydra.htm

Those two images are from an interesting book called (believe it or not) An historical account of all the voyages round the world: performed by English navigators; including those lately undertaken by order of His present Majesty. The whole faithfully extracted from the journals of the voyagers. Drake, undertaken in 1577-80; Cavendish, 1586-88; Cowley, 1683-86; Dampier, 1689-96; Cooke, 1708-11; Rogers, 1708-11; Clipperton and Shelvocke, 1719-22; Anson, undertaken in 1740-44; Byron, 1764-66; Wallis, 1766-68; Carteret, 1766-69; and Cook, 1768-71. Together with that of Sydney Parkinson ... and the voyage of Mons. Bougainville ... To which is added, an appendix. Containing the Journal of a voyage to the North pole, by the Hon. Commodore Phipps, and Captain Lutwidge. The original four volumes contain some reprints of the actual accounts, in addition to narrative commentary by the book's publisher and quite a few pictures. However, as SB1700 noted, there are clearly factual errors in the book like Cook apparently time-traveling to meet Alexander Selkirk. So caveat emptor when reading it. You can find pdfs all of these volumes (separately) on-line by searching for "An historical account of all the voyages round the world." I highly doubt that the author was trying to infer that Captain James Cook of the Endeavour time traveled to meet Alexander Selkirk, odds are t'is a very simple spelling/typo mistake... as ye both are forgetting about Edward Cooke who was on the Dutchess and wrote his own account of the Rogers' expedition to the south seas. But he was not captain, or was he?

That I have learned the hard way and I almost drived myself mad with it. You could not be more right in this matter.

Hi lets list areas where western pirates were active in GAoP circa 1680- 1730 feel free to add places Middle America ( the Caribbean) - the Bahamas -the Turks and Caicos islands - Caymans - Honduras - Florida - Lesser Antilles ( especially: Martinigue and Barbados ) - greater antilles (especially: Jamaica, Cuba and Hispaniola) North America Colonies (E.G. ) - Carolinas - New England -Newfounland -Virginia -Maryland South America - Brasil - and other southern and east- western regions Africa - the Gold coast - Madagaskar India and East - Malabar - the Red sea

certainly Indeed I have found errors in every book that I have read wholly....( don't mean Foxe's Every book but every book that I have read got it?)