Littleneckhalfshell

First, thank you Hurricane, for some reason I did not think the brace was period, I guess you can't believe everything you think you read. Second, JohnnyTar, the pictures of braces you gave a link to are definitly braces, but very modern, the old ones didn't have mechanical chucks, I 'know' (at least I hope I know, I am not doing very well in that realm right now ) that a mechanical chuck is way post period. Here is what I have, now, let me know if I could safely bring it as a carpenter's mate to a historical gathering and pass muster. Littleneckhalfshell - Photobucket for those interested further, here is a closeup of the chuck (dual for flat taper and pyramid taper) and a close up of the spoon bit with a flat taper. http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/li...vstwistbits.jpg http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w132/li...l/dualchuck.jpg Also note that I have included some long borers that I think may not be period, the ones with the screw leads I feel definitly are not, but what of the one with out the screw lead? Also in the first posted picture, note the gimlet style bits, star bit, and is that one a 'spade bit' possibly?

(""here's one for you. on period hand saws the front of the blade (not the teeth, the sheet itself) is curved with a notch a few inches back from the end of the blade. whats it for?"") I don't know, and from what I have read, no one does for sure, some suggest that it is to make the starter notch (slide the smooth back of the saw against a thumb and then when it comes to the end the notch nicks the wood where you want to cut) Anyway, I have some saws from my grandfather that have that little oddity on the end and I am sure that they are not from the GAOP, my grandfather was not that old I would be intersted in a picture of your period brace, but what period? my understanding is that the brace, even with integral bit (not removable) was post GAOP I will see if I can post a picture of my antique brace. I have read that though the ones that were all wood with metal side supports are the early pattern for woodworking, that Shipbuilding braces were often made of iron. Just not fully clear on the timeline. That is sort of what I have been looking for in starting this thread, a good timeline, with pictures or drawings, of when various tools came to be.

Thanks for the reply. Adze and draw knife I have as well as a lot of 18th and 19th cent. tools I have a beautiful wood and iron brace with the square socket, a set of gimlet type bits for it as well as a few spoon bits and a lot of twist drills with screw pilots, but from what I can tell, the iron brace is more 19th cent. I could make a good Civil War period kit, but not GAOP. I do some blacksmithing, (have lots of those tools) so I could maybe make anything I needed, but don't have really any good idea of what it should look like. My understanding is that many of the tools in existance in the GAOP 1680-1720 were still in existance in the 18th century, but that their 'style' or 'form' was different, they had 'evolved' if you will. So a 17th cent thing-a-ma-bob will do the same job of a 18th cent. one, but just look different. Just like you recognize a model A as an automobile, but it looks a lot different from a Chevy from the 1950's. I have the Roy Underhill books and a number of other tool related books, but they are often more in tune with the Colonial (Rev.war) to civil war periods. The reason I found the Port Royal info, is that what was sunk there, was the time period I am looking for tools from.

""When merchant ships traveled, there was a person on board who represented the company and who performed all trade negotiation. I came across the title for this person in one of the books I've read and now I can't remember it and don't have the book. (It was a curious title, which is why I vaguely recall it. For some reason I keep thinking of the term "supercarrier" but that's not it."" Could 'supercargo' be the term ye be searching for? "Supercargo From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Supercargo is a term in maritime law (adapted from the Spanish sobrecargo, one over or in charge of a cargo) that refers to a person employed on board a vessel by the owner of cargo carried on the ship. The duties of a supercargo include managing the cargo owner's trade, selling the merchandise at the ports to which the vessel is sailing, and buying and receiving goods to be carried on the return voyage. He or she has control of the cargo unless limited by his contract or other agreement. Because a supercargo sails from port to port with the vessel to which he is attached, he differs from a factor, who has a fixed place of residence at a port or other trading place."

For Merchants, this resource might be helpful, unfortunatly it is an unpublished manuscript, it is however on file at the University of the West Indies in Kingston, Jamaica. (if someone gets down there, maybe they could make a copy for the pub?) Anyway, it is a Doctoral Thesis by William A Claypole, titled "The Merchants of Port Royal 1655 to 1700" It is said to be a valuable historical interpretation of the community of Port Royal at the end of the 17th Century.

Great set of Draughts, now just how do I go about building it on a side note, Mission, you mentioned "Stephen Bown states in his book Scurvy: How a Surgeon, a Mariner, and a Gentleman Solved the Greatest Medieval Mystery of the Age of Sail," An early reminder International Scurvy Awareness day is May 2nd, a Friday this year. http://www.limestrong.com/about.htm Here's to the Mercury, (the Brig Sloop, not the medical use) and to stamping out Scurvy.

don't forget 'bright' or unfinished, polished steel or iron as an acceptable finish

was researching period correct tools and came across this "masters thesis" "Wrought Iron Hand tools in Port Royal, Jamaica: a study based upon a collection of the tools recovered from archaeological excavations and on tools listed in the probate inventories of colonial port royal c. 1692" http://nautarch.tamu.edu/pdf-files/Franklin-MA1992.pdf did you know that claw hammers are period correct?! Anyway, does anyone have other books, sites, info on period correct tools? examples of what I am looking for - you don't want to show up with a 'twist drill', from what I can tell, it would have to be a spoon bit, since twist drills were not invented yet.

""The only problem being, does not stain like actual blood does.. "" Hey, if you need real blood, check in at an oriental market, the one by me here in NJ has refrigerated bags of beef blood and bags of pork blood available for sale. I am not sure what it would be used for, but they have lots of other things that I don't understand either.

Mission, what are the fancy loop things on each top end of the saw? Thumb loops? The picture of the saw does not look sand cast to me, it is a fine job if it is in steel or iron, but that is what it looks like to me. Do you know the material of the saw in question? Some old tools, even wood working tools of the period show a craftsmans love of detail and decoration. They took real pride in their work. I believe the saw to be just the fine art of a toolmaker. Saw is thumbscrew wingnut tightened from the looks of it, the only thing throwing me is those fancy loops up top.

thanks for the picture, but it unfortunately is of the English Pattern 1720 and later, It is the kind of gun carriage you usually see, but from what information I can find, it is not correct for the earlier GAOP era. For GAOP, especially if it were a captured spanish or french gun, there should be a solid base of wood beneath the side cheeks. (see the other pictures posted for the difference) On the 1720 and later English pattern, they dispense with the base and only support the gun tube with the side pieces and some strategically positioned cross pieces, plus the axles instead of the base plate.

Yeah, Rusty Barrels, the Southbend Replicas catalog picture that I looked at online shows the side cheek english pattern construction that only became popular starting at 1720, you can identify it by the 'curved' area between the trucks. What I am looking for is what CaptSkinner provided in his two photos taken aboard the Susan Constant at Jamestown. Thank you CaptSkinner, those pictures should help a lot. Now if I can just come up with a cutting template. I have some Big Red Oak that I chainsawed into slabs a number of years ago and I think they will work for the three large pieces of wood I will need. (english and american tended to use 'built up' cheeks mortised together, but the earlier spanish and french patterns I believe used a single solid piece for the cheeks and bottom bed. Thanks again CaptSkinner.

sorry, the gun carriage picture is of the Wasa, not the MaryRose, I have been running through google looking for info till my eyes are sore, so one ship seems like another.

In another thread on the weight of naval gun carriages, Black John noted that around 1720 there was a transition from solid bed gun carriages to side cheek only carriages. Notably I have read that this was more prevalant among the english, and that the french and spanish held on to the solid bed carriage longer, but anyway, since GAOP is mostly prior to 1720, I wanted to see about putting together a 'solid bed gun carriage. Most of what I see out there are the english pattern post 1720, Round shot and Rammers has a nice drawing of this type carriage. Basically a solid bed carriage has a bottom board that the sides sit on. (example from the MaryRose, scroll to the bottom of this page for a picture of a solid bed gun carriage http://www.dimacleod.co.uk/history/ecwshots.htm) What I am not sure of from the pictures, is how the axle was positioned or designed. Anyone know a a drawing that shows the breakdown of the parts of a solid bed naval gun carriage? Or a book that shows it?

Well a toast then to Jamaica Rose for launching the good ship Pyracy Pub, and also to those who have kept her afloat for the last 5 years. She may take on water now and then, and need the bilge pumped (no reference to Bilgemonkey there) But any good Pub takes a good deal of its reputation from those who choose to occupy the premises. Drinks for all, to celebrate 5 years!

I just realized that it has just been over 5 years that I have been dropping in here for a dose of all things 'Pirate'. The Pyracy Pub has grown and gone in many directions, evolved if you will to what it is today, but how did we get here? I am a little foggy on even how I stumbled in, (maybe too much rum? naw, that couldn't be it I seem to remember getting an invitation, not sure from who, or what the connection was, but glad that I did. From my post information it says I am member #4, and I know there is a member #3 but no sign of members One or Two. Does anyone know who and how this fine establishment was opened? We have been here for over 5 years now, and maybe it is time to put a little History primer together regarding how we got here.

Or I guess it could have been a clip on the show from Captain Memo's Pirate Cruise which a response to the article on the sinking said was the original 'pirate cruise ship' that the sinking ship had copied it's idea from.

I am not so sure about the black Power cannon. I just caught a Travel Channel show, (the ten best beaches in Florida) and they had a clip that showed a 'pirate ship' that looked a lot like the one in this thread, one of the shots was of a crew member shooting what looked like a small lanyard pull shotgun blank signal cannon out the gangway opening.

http://www.sptimes.com/2008/03/09/Neighbor...ship_sink.shtml Mock pirate ship sinks The Treasure Seeker, a tourist attraction at the Pier, sank during its owners' attempted move to the Virgin Islands. The Treasure Seeker, formerly the Lady Betsea, was moored at the St. Petersburg Pier for almost two years until last month.

Oh, yeah, and one that says it for the Garage

Hey, I need one of those signs on every room!

Paper size, so difficult to nail down for GAOP, I have gotten dizzy from trying to figure it out. Octavo = ??? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octavo_(book) ""The modern general use of the term refers to books which are between 8" and 10" (20-25 cm) tall, the most common size for modern hardbound books. More specific sizes can be denoted by: Foolscap octavo (6¾" by 4¼") Crown octavo (7½" by 5") Demy octavo (8¾" by 5?") Royal octavo (10" by 6¼")"" Foolscap = http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foolscap_folio ""Foolscap was named after the fool's cap and bells watermark commonly used from the fifteenth century onwards on paper measuring 17 × 13½ inches (432 × 343 mm) or a subdivision of this into halves, quarters and so on. The earliest example of such paper that is firmly dated was made in Germany in 1479."" Rag Paper was expensive, so I would guess that 'smaller' would be more common than the relatively large papers we are familiar with in these days of cheap wood pulp paper.

The Black Fox said: ""my brother in Maryland (the next state below us) just got his. . . almost three weeks after the mailing. . ."" Maybe it took someone at his post office three weeks to read it

L. Silver said "i'll drink to that! the worst hangover i ever had was drinking cheap hatian rum all night in port a prince." Twice I guess his Port-a-Prince hangover gave him 'double vision'

related info on ships stove cauldron cover. link is food related (revolution period) but still somewhat applicable since things changed slowly in the navy. But Whydah is mentioned. http://www.navyandmarine.org/ondeck/1776salthorse.htm ""Because all of the sailors’ food was boiled, ship’s cauldrons, or ‘coppers,’ were necessarily very large. Thomas Dring estimated that the cauldron of the Jersey prison ship, formerly a 64 gun ship-of-the-line, held two to three hogsheads (120 to 180 gallons) of water. That of the Defence, an American privateer brig excavated near the Penobscot River in Maine, held 68 gallons of water. To make them useful in a ship, the cauldrons were square and fashioned from copper. It would sit in a frame supported by the firehearth, which was constructed of brick and filled with sand. These cauldrons could be covered with fitted lids that had holes or indentations in which kettles could sit for boiling water for tea or cocoa. Such a kettle, specially designed to sit in the lid of a ship’s copper, was found in the excavation of the Whydah, the only documented pirate ship-wreck ever discovered.""