Atlantic Enchantress Posted November 9, 2004 Share Posted November 9, 2004 does anyone else here ever fantasize/romantisize about living in the days when pirates sailed the seas, when life was much simpler; no cars, phones, computers.... When a man ran his household and the woman stayed home to take care of her husband and children AND liked it! No worrying about credit card bills, mortgages, car payments, electric bills, insurance..... I guess I just need an escape from reality once in awhile! My best way is to read some historical romances, especially ones involving pirates! I just finished an amazing one, where a rogue pirate captured a beautiful woman who was swimming in the sea near her castle, even though she was told to stay away from the waters because of pirates. The pirate captain was intoxicated by her beauty, and wanted her more because of her resistance towards him. After much back and forth and adventure, the pirate finally takes his captive's virginity by force, but in truth, she was as much enamoured with him, and wanted him as much as he wanted her... To be honest, I have really learned alot about history, terms, etc from these types of books. Aside from being a great escape from reality sometimes, they are also....educational! If anyone can recommend some good historical romances, I would appreciate it! I'm due to begin another book LOL! The sound of the Mermaid's song shall calm the raging sea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christine Posted November 9, 2004 Share Posted November 9, 2004 What is the name of that book you read? You got me curious about it now! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlantic Enchantress Posted November 9, 2004 Author Share Posted November 9, 2004 The Flame and The Flower by Kathleen Woodiwiss (My mistake, this wasn't the book where she was swimming in the sea, she was captured on the streets of London by the Captain Brandon Birmingham's men....) GREAT BOOK! The sound of the Mermaid's song shall calm the raging sea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Pirata Posted November 9, 2004 Share Posted November 9, 2004 Lasses and those dern romance novels. I wonder if they had romance novels back the golden age? If not then that's probably a favorable time to dream about living in.... Pushing the limits means getting out of my comfort zone and giving more when I don't think I have any left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarborMaster Posted November 9, 2004 Share Posted November 9, 2004 No worrying about credit card bills, mortgages, car payments, electric bills, insurance..... Well I dunno about all of that., I do know however the "Mortgage" has been around a very very very long time. I am not Lost .,I am Exploring. "If you give a man a fire, he will be warm for a night, if you set a man on fire, he will be warm for the rest of his life!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt Grey Posted November 10, 2004 Share Posted November 10, 2004 Let's see: - the majority of the population were not the landowners; they worked all their lives for the landowner and had little to show for it - women were chattel and had no rights whatsoever - there was little room for love in a marriage; it was a contract between a man and a woman that granted sex to the man and (hopefully) protection to the woman - women often died in childbirth - children who lived to see their second birthday were about 3 out of 5 - there were measles, mumps, small pox, plague, lice, and fleas (and the illness borne by lice and fleas) - bathing was not routinely done - life was hard and people were considered "old" at 40 Sorry lass, I don't care what they show in the books. I much perfers the 21st century. Captain, we always knew you were a whoopsie. Rumors of my death are entirely premature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nomadicalpirate Posted November 10, 2004 Share Posted November 10, 2004 fleas, rats and disease aside. at least in those times a handsome, strong, but "Formally" uneducated fellow, like myself, would at least have no trouble finding a woman and work. I've oft pondered the bathing thing. though the richer folk must do as fashion dictates. couldn't the poorer folk jump about in water whenever they damned well felt like it? (assuming water was available) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarborMaster Posted November 10, 2004 Share Posted November 10, 2004 I am 43 Does this mean I am dead as pirates go? Now I am despondant! i just wanted to have a little fun before I died HarborMaster I am not Lost .,I am Exploring. "If you give a man a fire, he will be warm for a night, if you set a man on fire, he will be warm for the rest of his life!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyBarbossa Posted November 10, 2004 Share Posted November 10, 2004 Nay... just well aged to perfection like a fine bottle of wine or good barrel of rum! I think it's always a good/bad with this era & then. Granted in this era.. we've become rather... complicated & over stressed. I'd rather be like a Jimmy Buffett song.Which is pretty much like most us pirates.. even the fictional ones like Jack Sparrow.. drink in hand, will sleep on shore! Tempt Fate! an' toss 't all t' Hell!" "I'm completely innocent of whatever crime I've committed." The one, the only,... the infamous! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pynch Posted November 10, 2004 Share Posted November 10, 2004 Personally...much as I love a life at sea...I am somewhat enamoured with toilets, modern dentistry, and deoderant. "Show me a man with a tattoo, and I'll show you a man with an interesting past." ~Jack London Life is a Circus, and I am the Human Cannonball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Charlotte Savvy Posted November 10, 2004 Share Posted November 10, 2004 does anyone else here ever fantasize/romantisize about living in the days ... when a man ran his household and the woman stayed home to take care of her husband and children AND liked it! No. "Pirates ... were of that old breed of rover whose port lay always a little farther on, a little beyond the skyline ... if they lived riotously let it be urged in their favor that at least they lived." ~ John Masefield Those who live by the sword, get shot instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coastie04 Posted November 10, 2004 Share Posted November 10, 2004 I long for those times almost every day. Heck with the disease and filth, there'd be quite a bit less stress. Also, it would be so much easier to escape the law. Coastie She was bigger and faster when under full sail With a gale on the beam and the seas o'er the rail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenny G. Posted November 10, 2004 Share Posted November 10, 2004 WOW! There are sure alot of negative people out here! Fantasize or romantisize means just that, the postive, carefreeness of it. I don't know anyone who fantasizes about filth, disease of lice, etc. I think that all y'all negative nellies should go and read yourself a good old historical romance book LOL! We all need a little excape from reality now and then! Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Charlotte Savvy Posted November 10, 2004 Share Posted November 10, 2004 WOW! There are sure alot of negative people out here!Fantasize or romantisize means just that, the postive, carefreeness of it. I don't know anyone who fantasizes about filth, disease of lice, etc. I think that all y'all negative nellies should go and read yourself a good old historical romance book LOL! We all need a little excape from reality now and then! Cheers! I know what you're saying, and you're absolutely right -- it's just my taste in imagining myself in the piratical days of old never involved a fantasy wherein my dashing pirate captain husband sets off once more to sea while I remain at home with our eighteen kiddies to clean the house, milk the cow, churn the butter, weave the wool, tend the gardens, beat the servants, give birth to the nineteenth kid, etc etc etc. It's not the wishing-for-days-of-old that bugged me, it was what parts of the days of old were being wished for. I have a passionate loathing of romantic novels, historical or otherwise: After much back and forth and adventure, the pirate finally takes his captive's virginity by force, but in truth, she was as much enamoured with him, and wanted him as much as he wanted her... This (besides the bit about wanting to stay at home with the kids while the husband has a life) is what really bothered me. I read in a psych textbook once that the majority of rape scenes (and that's what this is, because "sex by force" is the definition of rape, okay) in romantic stories are portrayed as forced and violent -- but the woman enjoys it anyway. Oddly enough, ACTUAL rape incidents are enjoyed by 0% of the victims. (Actual statistic. Believe me.) I'm not trying to be negative ... I suppose there's nothing wrong with liking a story like this. But it really bothers the heck outta me. I don't dream of the days when a husband could go off and see the world while the woman stayed at home and raised the children, and I don't like glorified rape scenes. The very idea offends me. *climbs off of soapbox* Okay. Sorry. I'm done now. This is just one of my biggest pet peeves of all time (I take my literature seriously), so I couldn't help it. Sorry to all you romantic literature readers out there if I offended you. I didn't mean to offend anyone; I'm just venting about the genre itself, not its readers. Feel free to take a pot-shot at the formulaic approach of every heroic fantasy novel since Tolkien's "Ring" series if it'll make you feel better. (You wouldn't get any arguments from me on that subject anyway.) "Pirates ... were of that old breed of rover whose port lay always a little farther on, a little beyond the skyline ... if they lived riotously let it be urged in their favor that at least they lived." ~ John Masefield Those who live by the sword, get shot instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crimsoncrow Posted November 10, 2004 Share Posted November 10, 2004 Sorry lass's......But I prefer to stay with authors of more substance....Alexander Dumas, Patrick O'Brian or the more modern Dan Parkinson. Now don't get me wrong, a bit of mush here and there is not a bad thing, but when it takes over the plot's course it becomes nerve wearing.....at least for myself. Birds of Prey by Wilbur Smith held much promise until he decided to try to cram involvments with three different women into the mix and seemed pressed to do so. Just my opinion, mind you......To each his or her own. Privateer & Commander of "Finnegan's Wake" Faodaidh fearg sealltainn a strigh air cridh an duine ghlic, ach comhnaichdh i an amadain. (Anger may look in on a wise man's heart, but it abides in the heart of a fool.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Hearted Pearl Posted November 10, 2004 Share Posted November 10, 2004 What I fantasy about is having no demands. No kids needing to get homework done, no bills to pay, no husband to satisfy (oops, did I say that out loud?) Just me and my boat sailing on the open water, pulling up to a dockside restaurant and having a steak dinner. Damn, guess I need the husband to pay for the boat and steak dinner. Guess he'll want some kids, so popped a few out for him. Rotten teachers...homework should be against the law. ~Black Hearted Pearl The optimist expects the wind. The pessimist complains about the wind. The realist adjusts the sails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt Grey Posted November 11, 2004 Share Posted November 11, 2004 Well part of the interpretation of "do you want to live in the old days" is being historically accurate - which several topics on this site deal with. To be historically accurate you have to include the lice, fleas, dirt, hard work, etc. Now if the question was phrased "Don't you wish you could live the life of a hero/heroine in a romance novel?" then we would know it concerned a fantasy world. Captain, we always knew you were a whoopsie. Rumors of my death are entirely premature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PirateQueen Posted November 11, 2004 Share Posted November 11, 2004 does anyone else here ever fantasize/romantisize about living in the days when pirates sailed the seas LOL! Most of us here on this forum, otherwise we wouldn't be here! I know what you mean, and since I'm just interested in pirates in general, I do read the occasional pulp romance novel. I can recommend a few: Anything by Laura Renken. She wrote a trilogy, I think the first one was called My Lord Pirate, the second Night Shadow, and the third, Heart of the Condor. Good stuff. King of the Pirates by Stef Ann Holm was a nice bit of fluff. Honestly, I think Lifetime Network should make some of the better romance novels like this one into movies. I think they'd be great. Don't forget to try the "classic" historical romances like Captain Blood by Raphael Sabatini or Frenchman's Creek by Daphne du Maurier! I have really learned alot about history, terms, etc from these types of books. Aside from being a great escape from reality sometimes, they are also....educational! I would caution against relying on pulp romance novels for historical accuracy. I've run across lots of inaccuracies in many a one! (Example, one was set in the early 1600s, but in one scene the heroine stumbled across some photographs--yikes!) Melusine de la Mer "Well behaved women rarely make history." - Laurel Thatcher Ulrich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piratelassie Posted November 11, 2004 Share Posted November 11, 2004 Cheers! I know what you're saying, and you're absolutely right -- it's just my taste in imagining myself in the piratical days of old never involved a fantasy wherein my dashing pirate captain husband sets off once more to sea while I remain at home with our eighteen kiddies to clean the house, milk the cow, churn the butter, weave the wool, tend the gardens, beat the servants, give birth to the nineteenth kid, etc etc etc. It's not the wishing-for-days-of-old that bugged me, it was what parts of the days of old were being wished for. I have a passionate loathing of romantic novels, historical or otherwise: This (besides the bit about wanting to stay at home with the kids while the husband has a life) is what really bothered me. I read in a psych textbook once that the majority of rape scenes (and that's what this is, because "sex by force" is the definition of rape, okay) in romantic stories are portrayed as forced and violent -- but the woman enjoys it anyway. Oddly enough, ACTUAL rape incidents are enjoyed by 0% of the victims. (Actual statistic. Believe me.) I'm not trying to be negative ... I suppose there's nothing wrong with liking a story like this. But it really bothers the heck outta me. I don't dream of the days when a husband could go off and see the world while the woman stayed at home and raised the children, and I don't like glorified rape scenes. The very idea offends me. *climbs off of soapbox* Okay. Sorry. I'm done now. This is just one of my biggest pet peeves of all time (I take my literature seriously), so I couldn't help it. Sorry to all you romantic literature readers out there if I offended you. I didn't mean to offend anyone; I'm just venting about the genre itself, not its readers. Feel free to take a pot-shot at the formulaic approach of every heroic fantasy novel since Tolkien's "Ring" series if it'll make you feel better. (You wouldn't get any arguments from me on that subject anyway.) I completely agree! I worked at the Gilbert Stuart Birthplace (the guy who painted GW on the dollar bill) and had to dress up in colonial costume and guide people around demonstrating the stuff in the house. I don't care how much hard work builds character, those irons were heavy. And women really didn't have much of a life back then, as you said. Oh, for a book that is serious and literary as well as romantic, involving, not pirates sadly but whaling and a woman at sea, I would definitely recommend Ahab's Wife. And if you're still looking for historical fiction with a bit of romance, Pirates! by Celia Rees is good. Lots of adventure, enough romance to satisfy those who are looking for romance, and a pretty quick read, despite its 300 some odd pages. Pretty well written for YA stuff too. well that's me tuppence worth on the topic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt Grey Posted November 11, 2004 Share Posted November 11, 2004 I stand corrected. Thank you, Pirate Queen. Guess I needs t'be gettin' some specticles sos I kin read. Captain, we always knew you were a whoopsie. Rumors of my death are entirely premature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenny G. Posted November 12, 2004 Share Posted November 12, 2004 Wow! Some of you women out there are pretty bitter! You must have really been wronged by some guy.... Do you knock those of us here who attend festivals and reenactments? Would you have us have fleas and disease for that? Should we reenact as it were exactly? I would imagine then that there would be no Renissance festivals and such then. And for the one who posted about rape, OBVIOUSLY no woman would want that, but then again, no one would want to be abducted by aliens r/t , but there are many groups and novels that are all about that, do you knock them too for having fantasies? What about all the fantasy forums on the internet, do you knock all of those people as well? For many this is a "safe" escape from reality. I am guessing that if you don't agree with them, you don't visit the site. Luckily we, at least I, live in a free country. GOD BLESS THE USA! A fantasy is exactly what the fantasizer chooses, not anyone else. There are all types of romance books out there, obviously there is a demand for them. Obviously in r/t, Fabio is not going to come and wisk me away, so do you think it is wrong to fantasize about that too? Sorry for carrying on so, but I get offended when people critisize others. It is our different beliefs, whether they be r/t of fantasy that makes the world go 'round. Our differences make us doctors, lawyers, teachers, plumbers, mechanics, entertainers, writers, etc. I believe the original post here referred to a romance novel, and simpler times. The poster also wondered if others shared the same fantasizes, ones of a life long ago, in a kinder and simpler world, NOT if you didn't. ANd for the poster who said she should ahve referred to her post as a historical romance novel times, why get so technical when you know what tie idea is? Why be negative and nit-pick just to nit-pick?! Again, I'm sorry if I seem, well, angry, I guess I just am angry at any prejudices. Perhaps I would do well to keep quiet..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piratelassie Posted November 12, 2004 Share Posted November 12, 2004 Jenny, I definitely see your point, and agree that it is a good thing to imagine and fantasize about history. That, in some form or other is why we're all here. However, I think that it is important to realize that there is a fundamental difference between the history that there actually was and the history that many people wish there was. That said, as long as you don't mistake the romanticised for the real, which was often drudgery and completely unromantic, I say fantasize all you want. I know I do. I don't think anyone here was meaning to knock anyone, I know I wasn't, so calm down. put up yer cutlass and have a glass to friendly debate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloody_Mary_Bonney Posted November 12, 2004 Share Posted November 12, 2004 At times i wish i could go back to the time where chivolry was respected. But still i would miss so much out my life to much But why is the rum gone? Save a horse ride a cowboy! Take me away and take me farther, suround me now and hold me like holy My toes are getting pruney Also my head is round that window is square.... My name is Micheal J Kabous and i eat babies! Your toast has been burned and no amount of scraping will remove the black stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_MacNamara Posted November 12, 2004 Share Posted November 12, 2004 Chivalry as such was rarely what it is portrayed to have been... The Ideal of Chivalry is an honorable thing to seek, and I live by my own code of Honor, which I do not take lightly. But still... even the "Chivalrous" men of yore were not always so honorable. And I have to agree about the "glorified rape" scenario... especially in these days and times when children are oft raised without an ounce of respect or moral value, and often read things in books, or see them in movies and then decide to go and try them because their parent(s) don't take the time anymore to teach the child right and wrong, and almost any form of discipline these days is wrongfully construed as "abuse". And no, I am not blaming movies and books for our children's anarchy. I blame the CPS, who can take a child away from a loving home because said child recieved a spanking, and then let a known abusive drunk of a father murder his 3 month old child after repeated reports of abuse. I also blame the parents. But even still... ANY form of rape scenario should not be "glorified" in ANY *fantasy*. Just my 2 shillings... Captain of the Iron Lotus It is the angle that holds the rope, not the size of the hole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt Grey Posted November 12, 2004 Share Posted November 12, 2004 Jenny G., no one were criticizin' no one. We just be pointin' out that "real life" in the old days were a lot different than them books speak o' it. Seems like we hit a nerve, lass. Many people here participate in Ren Faires and other re-enactments. That is why we appreciate being born in this century. Have a pint on me and let's keep this discussion friendly, eh? Captain, we always knew you were a whoopsie. Rumors of my death are entirely premature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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