trowsers

[blackbeard the 2nd]

ive always wondered if pirate reinactors, fans etc wear tight pants or baggy ones

i know its a wierd question but im a wierd person

[Rumba Rue]

Depends on who you want to impress.

Rumba Rue

** **

[Christine]

Yup, it definitely depends on that-lol!

[Lady Seahawke]

according to position on the crew...and when/how you went on the account.

for instance a captain most often, from my reading, wore a bit tighter then the regular jacks as they were often privateers before becoming full pirates. Also, was he a regular jack elevated to captain or was he prior an officer that mutinied. Those that mutined would have his officer uniform which would have been tighter breeches then those that were under him.

Regular jacks wore the looser fitting ones for ease of movement climbing the rigging etc.

Hope that helps

[Chevalier de Roziers]

It all depends on the time period, the social status of the person, his rank, and what the hell he was wearing at the time before he became a pirate.

But first to answer your question "ive always wondered if pirate reinactors, fans etc wear tight pants or baggy ones."

Since very few of the people who do pirate impressions are what I would call actual reenactors, you see a whole plethora of leg coverings, from knee breeches to slops to sweatpants to kilts. Noone has any standards and if you try to point that out they probably just stare at you in slack-jawed incomprehension or find some suitably "pyratical" thing to say like "yarr...me wears whatever me wants, yo ho me hearty, eh what?" So in other words: wear whatever you damn well want and no one will care one way or the other.

Now having said that, if you want to be accurate that requires a little research. Pirates had no uniform. Hell, the most navies had little or no uniforms for common seamen until well into the 19th century. As such pirates and seamen wore essentially nautical civillian clothes. For simple seamen back to the middle ages, most of them wore what we call 'slops' of very very loose fitting breeches or trousers that were most usually made of canvas or leather and often worn over nice, under breeches. This was to protect the nice breeches from stains, tears, etc. As the 18th century progresses breeches themselves become more and more fitted as waistcoats become shorter and frock coats more cut away to reveal the legs. Earlier in period the legs close by means of ties, later on in period they close with buttons, although styles varied widley from country to country.

On ships shoes became useless and as such were quickly abandoned along with stockings resulting in sailors often going about barefoot, though they would presumably change back into shoes and stockings when not on board the ship.

Of course, this is directed at the more working-class level seamen. Officers such as surgeons, navigators and so on who were not required to do as much manual labor could often wear fancier clothes and could keep their shoes. Hope that helps.

[crimsoncrow]

Answering for myself, semi loose breeks. I have two pairs, one as an extra. The main pair are of a semi coarse / loosely woven material. I use the high boots. (Comes in handy just in case I decided to go the "highwayman" route instead.) Tight pants are fine, I guess.....but, face it, spandex did not exist back then and I am NOT in the service of the Crown, so semi-tight white britches are out.

[Captain_MacNamara]

It depends on what I'm doing... If I'm fighting, I wear sweats. My *normal* pants are full length and baggy (for the moment). My *work* pants (when I'm setting up camp or other dirty work) are "poor-mans" knee breeches, which are basically an altered pair of modern semi-baggy slacks.

Course... I'm not what ye'd call a re-enactor either...

[Patrick Hand]

This is from "The Wooden World an Anatomy of the Georgian Navy"

"Though there was no uniform for ratings in the Navy, seamen wore extremely distinctive cloths which marked them at once from any other trade. They themselves spoke of their 'short clothes' and the landman's 'long clothes'. Men ashore wore long coats and waistcoats reaching nearly to the knee, over tight breeches and stockings. Seamen wore short 'bum-freezer' jackets, generally blue, red waistcoats and checked shirts with a scarf or handkerchief loosely knotted round the neck..... Instead of breeches they wore a garment then quite unknown to landmen, ...'Trowsers, a sort of loose breeches of canvas worn by common sailors" For boat work they sometimes wore a canvas 'petticoat' or divided 'petticoat breaches'

...Except for disguise, seamen scorned to wear landsmen's clothes"

I snipped a few bits... but that gives a good idea of what sailors wore.

[Capt. Flint]

For pirate re-enacting, I usually wear a pair of pants that have a little room in them. They feel good with the outfit and look good with the outfit. I only wear my fitted pants with my other ren. gear. It's a personal preference for me, but, when I look at a lot of pictures and historical clothing, I can usually find both types of pants for the time period. Although the looser ones I see much more for the time frame that i dress for.....

[Nigel]

I have long since retired my now world-famous tights.

[Rumba Rue]

Baggy pants are always good for roaming female hands.

Rumba Rue

** **

[Sealegs Constance]

Aye Rumba is right loose fitting is better fer the roaming hands. Tight fitting does nothing fer me.

[Hawkyns]

Depends on what period you're doing. I do mostly Elizabethan/Jacobean, so I wear either baggy slops or baggy venetians, as were worn at the turn of the 16th/17th century. When I move up to Golden Age, the slops don't change so much, but the breeches do. They get tight in the leg but very baggy in the seat. If they look like you're carrying a load, then you're on the right track. All of my breeches are French fly with a 2-3 inch waistband and a tied adjustment gusset in the back.

I don't do any period late enough to wear trousers. They start to appear in the 2nd half of the 18th century, but mostly in a military setting. They don't become common for everyone until post Rev War.

Tights are pre-period, mostly 15th, early 16th century. I have a couple of pair for when I do a War of the Roses scenario, but they are made of sewn linen, not any modern stretch fabric. They do have a sewn in codpiece flap and are more properly referred to as joined hose. Not something I ever wear for the pyracy impressions.

Hawkyns

[blackjohn]

I don't do any period late enough to wear trousers. They start to appear in the 2nd half of the 18th century, but mostly in a military setting.

Actually, they appear earlier... I snipped this from a topic I posted elsewhere...

"One of the witnesses against Bonny and Read was Dorothy Thomas, who had been captured and made prisoner by Rackam's crew. She claimed that the women 'wore Mens Jackets, and long Trouzers, and Handkerchiefs tied about their Heads, and that each of them had a Machet[e] and Pistol in their Hands.'"

Quoted from Rediker.

[Hawkyns]

This is one of those items that shows up every so often as an argument on the 18th C lists. I've seen 'documentation' on both sides. Slops could be anywhere from knee length down to nearly the ankle. The woodcuts I've seen of Bonney and Read seem to show mid calf, but I'm not sure how accurate that is.

There are some broadsheets of 16th century Dutch sailors with ankle length slops.

I guess that it can be said that they did exist, but I can not find any evidence that they were common in the early 18th c. Certainly the written evidence and woodcuts and engravings of the period do not indicate any great numbers. More like they were written down because they were the exception and therefore noteworthy.

As i said, I've seen this booted about by far better costume experts than I, with no conclusions reached. For me, based on what I know of my persona's time and place, I can't accept them in a 1720's scenario.

Your mileage may vary.

Hawkyns

[Bloody_Mary_Bonney]

i tend to just wear dresses but me boyo wears baggy pants (he's never very acurate)

[Stynky Tudor]

Baggy pants are always good for roaming female hands. 

Rumba-Rumba, You're naughty.

[BoneHunterLane]

Baggy pants are always good for roaming female hands. 

Rumba-Rumba, You're naughty.

No, no... Stynky... she's *intelligent*.... :)

(I'm surree that's the word I'm looking for...)

<heh heh>

[Rumba Rue]

I couldn't have said it better, thanks BoneHunterLane!!!!

Rumba Rue

** **

[Bloody_Mary_Bonney]

Baggy pants are always good for roaming female hands.

Rumba Rue

** **

seeing as i'm the group pick pocket i'll have to agree *thinks: its always so nice of me boyo to keep lots of treasures in his pockets*

[Diego Santana de la Vega]

Loose fittin fer me is me breeches of choice, with just enough room for interest to be of concern! Baggy seat fer ease of movment and extreme positioning fer certs. Impressions in the minds eye: and a sash to tie around the waist band to hold'em up. I hates it when I wake up and they're around me ankles I do.

[Hrothgar Addams]

I don't think RumbaRue was thinkin' 'bout pockets--

[Merrydeath]

I hates it when I wake up and they're around me ankles I do.

Really??

How interesting..

makes note.

[Capt. Lucinda Waters]

Seein' as I could group meself as a re-enactor bein' a part o' GLMF, I can tell ya I have my own personal pattern that is both: the waist is fitted and as ye go down it gets looser...wow...that sounded really bad! and it's fitted again right below the knees. I do a lot of fightin' on stage during the swelterin' month of July, and I can tell ya I have enough movement to fight, but not so much fabric swayin' around to get yer self tangled in.

And while "baggy" may be fine for roamin,' ya haven't felt anything until ya have a handful of a lord in tight velvet leggins'! ...not that I know anything about accostin' the lords....

[Patrick Hand]

And while "baggy" may be fine for roamin,' ya haven't felt anything until ya have a handful of a lord in tight velvet leggins'! ...not that I know anything about accostin' the lords....

Is that another way to say.....

"When ya got em by th' balls...thier hearts an minds will follow......"