dasNdanger

yeah, that's what I was afraid of...dang. I know there are swordsman gloves - big-arse things that pirates would not wear. But I was wondering if they wore some sort of vibration/shock absorber, and when I saw that one on Jack, I though that - PERHAPS - it was an 'accurate' piece, considering the swordmaster's experience who taught the cast to fight. If there IS a term for it, I'd like to know what it is. Glove seems wrong, and 'palm protector' sounds like a prophylactic, or something... das

I can't think how to describe it, so I will use Jack Sparrow as an example - what is the fingerless protective thing he wore on his sword hand called?? Is that a common thing - and/or period? das

I have a Laguiole-style knife, with that little "bee" on the top of the blade spring on the back of the knife. But that knife, as I understand it, only dates back to the 19th century (though the style is much earlier, I believe). Here's a fella making reproduction knives (not cheap) based on French clasp knives found at Fort Michilimackinac... http://www.tichbourneknives.com/new.htm (go to bottom of page) Another site with 'historical' knives...but no authentic period examples to verify the styles: http://www.ragweedforge.com/HistoricalKnif...talog.html#paki The navaja, a Spanish clasp/folding knife also dates back to the 17th century. http://www.geocities.com/thalaric1/artncul.../sevillian.html http://www.antiques-arms.com/catalog/produ...products_id=445 das

LOL, Rumba perhaps! It just seems so unusual - I've never associated such an exercise or sport with sailors...it seems so out of place. Anywho...I suppose no one knows what these 'slippers' are?? Guess I'll have to do me own research...blech. das

First - I'm just testing to see if Foxe ever sleeps... Second, in my search for Frogs in Boots, I came across this little tidbit - and I have a few questions from it (quotes from various sources)... "Savate, translated the old shoe or boot, traces its origins as far back as the 17th century to the streets and seaports of France. As a form of exercise, French sailors practiced stretch-kicks during their long ocean voyages. These kicks were later incorporated into a form of foot fighting called “chausson,” which was used by Napoleons army as a form of punishment to miscreants." "This method was initially called 'Chausson', the name of a sailor's deck shoe, or slipper, although it was also known as jeu marseillais (sport Marseilles)." "It was the French Navy who developed Chausson (pronounced Shoh-sohn) as a gymnastic game of fencing with the feet. The term actually means 'slipper' and referred to the sailor's espadrilles. It became a local street game about Marseille, Aubagne and Toulon." "In 17th century France, two specific forms of street fighting evolved. Chausson Marseillais, as one style was named, depended almost exclusively on the power of kicking. The other style was called Savate, and it involved using a combination of open handed hits and low kicks." "Savate, translated the "Old Shoe" or "The Boot," traces its origins as far back as the 17th century to the streets and seaports of France. As a form of exercise, French sailors practiced stretch-kicks during their long ocean voyages." Okay - so here are my questions. 1. Is there any evidence that this style of exercise/fighting ever made it onto pirate vessels? Wow - if so, all that swashbuckling in film may have been for naught! LOL! Van Damme instead of Depp in the next pirate flick - what say you?? 2. Does anyone know the actual beginnings of this activity - most sources say the 17th century, but it wasn't fully developed until Napoleonic times. 3. Although it took well over a century to develop into a 'sport' with rules, etc...would these sailors' 'slippers' that became associated with the sport have been worn in the 17th century (powder slippers or something else??)?? Or were they more of a 19th century thing? das

I have an observation about boots based on the info I've been able to find. As has been said, during the GAoP it seems boots had fallen out of fashion in general, and were replaced by shoes. However, we are focusing primarily on English fashion. What about the French? I ask this because of a very silly little thing - Puss in Boots. Written by a Frenchman and published c. 1697, dear Puss is definitely sporting boots, and certainly not for riding. Why? Well, in a nutshell, the underlying theme of that story was that the clothes make the man. So, could the French have favored boots a bit longer, and if so, could that be why some artists later toyed with the idea of GAoP pirates in boots? This is all just guesswork, but it is curious to me that a Frenchman would have written a tale about a cat in boots if boots were totally out of fashion by that time. So - here's your mission, Petee, if you choose to accept it: see what you can come up with on Frenchie's in boots. Perhaps some were influenced by the army boot (from the Army museum) seen on this page http://www.costumes.org/history/100pages/17THSHOE.HTM . If French naval officers happened fancy that boot, perhaps 'officers' (used loosely) aboard a pirate ship followed suit. OF COURSE, we have no proof in the form of documentation or art work...YET... das - just stirring the pot again

Oh, she's simply beautiful!! Thanks for sharing...let us know how she sails!! das

Well, I found Danger Island on e-bay, and now I sit here watching it, giggling like a silly kid again! It brings back such fond memories!! (The way it's filmed reminds me of Scrubs...maybe that's the reason I like that show so much, too.) Anywho - back to me show!! das

I suppose, like Foxe suggested, that some of his effects had been privately disposed of...but I would still think that a shaving/toilet kit would have been a rather significant thing to have go missing. (In comparison, the old silk drawers might not have been missed.) The idea that the bottles were for the rum - well, that might be...but in a small trading vessel, would they have tolerated that much space taken up by empty bottles? Any more thoughts on these bottles? das

Here's an old account, no mention of Neptune, though... Earliest Eyewitness Account by an English Sailor, 1708: Woodes Rogers, an English Privateer and later the Governor of the Bahamas. Sept. 25. This day, according to cuftom, we duck'd thofe that had never pafs'd the Tropick before. The manner of doing it was by a Rope thro a block from the Main-Yard, to hoift `em above half way up to the Yard, and let `em fall at once into the Water; havin ga Stick crofs thro their Legs, and well faftened to the Rope, that they might not be furpriz'd and let go their hold. This prov'd of great ufe to our frefh-water Sailors, to recover the Colour of their Skins, which were grown very black and nafty. Thofe that we duck'd after this manner three times, were about 60, and others that would not undergo it, chofe to pay half a Crown Fine; the Money to be levy'd and fpent at a publick Meeting of all the Ships Companys, when we return to England. The Dutch Men, and some English Men, defir'd to be duck'd, fome fix, others eight, ten, or twelve times, to have the better Title for being treated when they come home. Source: Rogers, Woodes. A Cruising Voyage Round the World: First to South-Sea, Thence to the East-Indies, and Homewards by the Cape of Good Hope. Begun in 1708, and Finish'd in 1711... (London: Printed for Andrew Bell, and Bernard Lintot, 1718): 23-24.. Is Neptune an American tradition, perhaps, for the next account reads: CAPT David Porter, USN, on United States frigate Essex, 23 Nov. 1812. On the 23d, we were honoured by a visit from the god of the ocean, accompanied by Amphitrite and a numerous retinue of imps, barbers, &c. &c. in his usual style of visiting, and in the course of the afternoon all the novices of the ship's company were initiated into his mysteries. Neptune, however, and most of his suite, paid their devotions so frequently to Bacchus, that before the ceremony of christening was half gone through, their godships were unable to stand; the business was therefore entrusted to the subordinate agents, who performed both the shaving and washing with as little regard to tenderness as his majesty would have done. On the whole, however, they got through the business with less disorder and more good humour than I expected; and although some were most unmercifully scraped, the only satisfaction sought was that of shaving others in their turn with new invented tortures. Here's the site I found these, and others: http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq92-5.h...tm#anchor175935 das

I was being facetious. Ya know...how the Welsh are so crazy about rugby and all... *wonders where Foxe's funny bone is, so she can tickle it...* das

I love this calendar...and the website, too (mycathatesyou.com). I discovered their site about 4 years ago - it's just too funny! My hubby's fav so far is from Feb 11 - the one with the ferret on the back of the cat with the caption "I will massage your scalp while Chi-chi provides the 'happy ending.'" LOL - the expression on that ferret is just too funny! das

Uh...what are we talking about here...boots...or booty.... das

There should be a topical creme for that.... Well, if there is...the Brits prolly invented it... Hitman - I guess the US will always be at war with the Brits (and visa versa), over something. Two giant egos that love to torment each other, in that big brother/little brother sort of way. But let's face it - without the US, Britain would now be part of Germany, and without Britain, we wouldn't have marmite and Twiglets... All teasing (and food) aside, I guess there will always be a little niggling between these two countries. No harm in it, I figure...keeps us both humble... (HA!) (actually, as a rugby addict, I praise the English for inventing the best sport on the planet!! Wait a sec...was it the English...or the Welsh... Okay, I'll behave now... ) das

Thanks, Foxe. Very interesting inventory, indeed - actually had a lot more clothes than I expected someone to have at sea, considering the space available. What do you make of the bottles, though? Seems like a lot of bottles to have hanging around, even if they were small. Could they have been empty bottles? Again - seems odd to hoard a bunch of empty bottles, but if they were filled, it's strange for their contents not to be noted. What do you make of it...anything? das

We have a national slogan... ??? *shrugs* Foxe - well, seeing as how me great-great grandpa was a Macbeth straight from Scoootlund...I have a certain special place in me heart for kilted men and bagpipes...especially on days when the wind blows high... It is sad, isn't it? I was fortunate enough to grow up in a small community, and had several great teachers over the years, so I did learn a little something...but nothing like I've learned since high school. Being interested in history/reenactments and archaeology has helped, too, and I'm terribly curious...so if I don't understand something, I WILL find a dictionary or encyclopedia that has the answer...OR, I just ask Foxe...he's faster than an itchy google finger... das

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Oh, that's priceless. I swear, Americans can be dumb - and I'm speaking as one. Sad to say, more Americans know all about Jessica Simpson's divorce than they know who fought in the Revolutionary War. Just totally clueless at times..annoys the heck out of me. In fact, that's why I'm HERE - to be able to talk with people that have knowledge about SOMETHING outside of Hollywood. But, in all fairness, a good portion of Americans eventually become self-taught during their early adulthood, so that by the time they're in their 30's, they've caught up with the rest of the world, for the most part. But yeah, American schools put more emphasis on sports than anything (I worked in a school district for 4 years (in the library) - drove me crazy that sports got priority in the budget above everything else, especially the arts.) Hey - one thing I can finally say, though...There IS something that's better than England - and that's SCOTLAND!! HUZZAH To Scotland for finally whooping England in the 6 Nations!! *Goes off to watch the rugby match again...such a sweeeeeet victory!!* Gosh, I'm really way OT here.... das

King...who??

That had to be one hell of a fart.... das

Well, shiver me timbers!! I never met a man wif an extra inch o' brim that I didn't give me beads to...*tosses a strand of sparklies to HM!* das

OOO!! Nice hat!! :) Still, I wonder what ye had to show to get all of those non-period beads... ...and is that guy behind you getting ready to take a piddle?? das

Okay - I'm getting confused. Can we break this down a bit... Let's see what we have, with some of my own questions added (my questions/observatios in italics): 1. one paire of rough sleeves, 18d; (perhaps work sleeves worn over arms to protect clothing/skin, or an odd set of sleeves. Could they have been removed from a garment to make it sleeveless, and held onto if needed again?) 2. halfe a yard of dowles, 3s; (?? is this a wooden dowel, or dowle, as in down feathers? Or is it dowlas, a coarse linen cloth made in the north of England and in Scotland? My vote is on the latter.) 3. six neckcloths as 12d a peece, 6s; (self-explanitory - but what material?) 4. 2 paire of drawers, 5s; (Wow - silk...I don't even wear silk drawers!! Must be nice... ) 5. 4 shirts, 14s; (self-explanitory) 6. thre old silke neckcloths, 4s; (self-explanitory) 7. a white Jackett, 2s; (What style, do you think?) 8. two blew shirts & one pr drawers, 6s; (Separate from the other shirt and drawers - why? Poorer quality material, perhaps?) 9. a carpet; 6s; (Carpet? Was this a rug, or something else? Carpet was an old term for a table cover, or could this refer to some sort of blanket?) 10. a coat & briches, 10s; (A justaucorps, perhaps, or some other style coat? Britches are self-explanitory.) 11. cloth sute, 30s; (What would this have been? A matched set of clothes, perhaps finery for town?) 12. 4 paire stockings, 7s; (self-explanitory) 13. one paire old silke drawers, 3s; (self-explanitory - but why separate from the rest?) 14. one old sea gowne, 14s; (probably the same thing as the "frocks" which turn up quite often in seamen's inventories. They are probably what I would describe as a smock - about the same length as a short jacket, but with no opening at the front except for a small one at the neck.) 15. old silke wastcot, 2s; (Self-explanitory) 16. 6 old handchercher, 3s; (self-explanitory - Perhaps for nose-blowing as opposed to sweat-mopping??) 17. one silver spoone & paper of buttons, 7s; (A silver spoon, but no knife/fork?? Buttons sewn onto paper...like they still are, basically. What sort of paper? Must update me kit...) 18. stuff and gunter scale compass, 11s; (Stuff?? Any ideas? Gunter's Scale is a large plane scale, usually 2 feet long, used for navigation. Was the compass separate, or just part of the Gunter's scale description?) 19. one calbush tipt with silver, 40s; (calabash - A kind of gourd, perhaps a gourd-like vessel, or perhaps a pipe. One source says 'A water dipper, bottle, basket, or other utensil made from the dry shell of a calabash or gourd.' I wonder if it was a personal drinking cup?) 20. sea booke, 5s; (a log book, or manual - Foxe, what is a 'rutter'?) 21. one hatt, 4s; (self-explanitory - anyone venture to guess what kind?) 22. 18 glas bottles, 6s; (What sort of bottles? Medicine? Empty? Other?) 23. barrel of Rum, 30 gallons, 3li; (Whoa. No spyglass. No compass. No boots. But he had 30 gallons of RUM and silk drawers!! A real party boy! WOO-HOO!!) 24. one barrell of suger 2C½, 50s; (Quite a bit of sugar, too. Was it common for a man to bring his own stores along?) 25. one sea chest, 8s; (self-explanitory) Whew...that was rough. Interesting to see what was NOT in the inventory. No other books or Bible. No writing instruments, unless that is grouped in with 'stuff'. No sewing kit, no belts or buckles, no knives, no personal games (dice, cards), no shaving/toilet kit...no comb. Why are these things (and the like) missing - could others have helped themselves to the more valuable items before inventory was made, or were they not commonly owned by everyone, and shared amongst a group instead? das

I just tell 'em that I was born below the Mason-Dixon line, which isn't really true, since the line doesn't run through Jersey. But if it did, I would still be south of it. Besides, me grandma was from Charleston, so I have 'connections' in the south...which usually works until they find out about me great-great-great grandma being a slave and all. Oh, it's all so silly, really. I've never been a prejudiced sort, and so sometimes I just don't get it. Why call people names or hate people and take exception to the things they can't change (ancestors' deeds, race, place of birth, etc...)...it's just so...primative. das

Here's some more to mull over... From Answers.com: 1. From the beginning, Yankee has been a fighting word. We first come across it in the names of pirates: one Captain Yankey, also known as Yankey Duch (presumably meaning "Dutch"), mentioned in 1683 and 1684, and a Captain John Williams, known as Yankey or Yanky, in 1687 and 1688. By 1765, it had been applied specifically to inhabitants of New England, and not as a compliment. A poem published that year called Oppression, a Poem by an American, has as its hero "a Portsmouth Yankey," with the note, "our hero being a New-Englander by birth, has a right to the epithet of Yankey; name of derision, I have been informed, given by the Southern people on the Continent, to those of New-England." For Foxe: "The origin might have been the phrase Jan Kees ("John Cornelius") (two very common Dutch names), which the English-speaking people picked up as "yankees", a word they used to refer to the Dutch." das

Wonderful!! I will keep a sharp eye out for it!! Thanks for the heads up!! das