Crudbeard

I am very pleased that my comment has started a discussion of pirate cannon safety, tis whot I intended. I hope it will lessen the chances of accidents. I appreciate Hawkyns point about the ability of military style re-enactor groups to achieve safety control. And it is impressive, I have done some Schools of the Piece with them. It is a difficult situation though, when the cost of standing down is more than having driven 200 miles for nothing. When you are a pirate for hire with a contract with the festival, and YES, your contract does specify that you have the right to refuse anything unsafe, if you invoke that clause very much, you won't work very much, because the other pirates that are "easier to work with" will be hired. Now, I would rather not work than have someone hurt, but I am hoping that the Pub may get us all to some level of knowledge. Right now, I am moving to the other end of the firing line when I encounter unsafe cannon practice. Which does not fix the problem. Crudbeard

Iffen I can add me own two pense ta this......I likes ta exhibit historical cannon projectiles, cannister, grape, chain, etc. an I thinks perhaps an exception might be made fer these. I also was urged by Cascable years ago not ta wad me small arms iffen at all possible. I have followed this good advice and our crew rules only allow it in tha case of a set scenario where tha piece MUST be handled muzzle down afore firing. Otherwise, as ye knows, any pistol problems are "made safe" easily by dumping tha powder.

That wasn't the one where we all had to turn in our ammo boxes over to the safe camp.... I have an old Army m-60 ammo can that I painted red, and it has my name on it.... I keep my loading gear and powder (in the can) inside it..... At the first Northern California Pyrate Festival, they made us turn in all of our powder to the safety camp.... and they just left my ammo box (powder and everything) sitting on the table, slightly roped off from the public (but anyone could have just reached across and grabbed it....) I'd rather be in charge of my own powder, than have someone else do it..... Amen ta that!, says I. Gives me tha shivers ta let go of me own supervision of me dangerous stuff, as I knows how safe I be, an not necessarily how safe tha others be. Yet I have seen some damn fools shootin at festivals that should not be allowed ta have blackpowder, as I be sure you have as well. Iffen we wanted ta be ordered about, we would join up with a military re-enactor group, but we be pirates by choice, 'cause we have tha freedom o behavin like pirates that satisfies our disreputable black hearts. But, yer was a waitin fer that "but" wern't ya? But, I be thinkin that lack o safety standards in pirate artilley is eventually goin ta get someone's head blowed off. So I'm a throwing this out, whot be ye all predicting as ta rules? Be they a comin', no?, yes?

Well, I be still out at sea in tha fog on the signature thingy. I follered yer directions ta edit signature, and found somethin that said insert image, but instead of click and drag, or cut and paste, or brouse, which operations I sorter do know how ta do, it wants some kind o web link I be thinkin, which I have no notion of. How complicated is this?

Yer can count on tha Pirates of tha Dark Rose ta show up, Bloodthirsty, Crudbeard, an Oreo. Perhaps some some of me crew this year.

Excellent!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1 Crudbeard

Interestin'....more like tha old days. But I would also be concerned about not only leaving embers in the brush but also in the gun breech or up tha vent, resultin in, well, ya knows whot results. Yer also gets some extry protection with foil from sparks from some cussed spectators smokin a cigarette an standing behind yer magazine box, iffen yer be a firing on land. O course, ye be aware that tha AAA specifically don't allow anthing but tinfoil around yer cartridge. While we be pirates, tha Artillery Safety Rules are sorter tha National Standards that tha dammed sea lawyers u'll be a jabberin about in tha Court, iffen there ever be an accident. I likes ta try to show how pirates did it, but I'd keep it safe first.

An while we may be the Northernmost Pirates on the East Coast, our crew, tha Pirates of the Dark Rose, darkrosepirates.com, are based in Maine, but do get all the way down to Key West and out to Port Washington. I be tha Captain, Crudbeard by name (I didn't choose it) an we would love ta get in contact with any others in our area. Thankee fer includin us in yer list of crews

On our six pounder firing 8 oz we always have the back half of the cartridge to worm out. On our 1.74" swivel guns firing 1- 2 oz's it's a 50% chance that there is any amount cartridge left when we worm after each shot. Many times there is just nothing there, but other times there's near half the foil of the cartridge. Yep, I have also found on my 1 1/4 inch bore cannons that occasionally all of the tin foil blows out. This is disconcertin, as yer wants to be sure all the cartridge is out, so yer wurms agin, and mebbe agin, which is a bit of hassle. I have taken ta making my 1 1/4 inch cartridges with extra thick butt ends to try to make sure that some is left, as the crew has been threatened with a touch o tha cat iffen they neglect ta get some tin foil out when they wurms. But even so, sometimes the cartridge departs fer parts unknown. Anybody know why?

Pirates of the Dark Rose are planning to be there with at least Crudbeard and Bloodthirsty and Oreo (does he count?) Would like to have more of me crew there as well, we'll see As ta where ta camp, well, I well knows that tha fun be had on the beach, but havin' me tent inside tha fort is waaaay too convenient fer tha cannon work, so we will probably still stay there.

The Pirates of the Dark Rose are using WD40 liberally swabbed in the bore after cleaning with sponge water dosed with concentrated black powder solvent. While I don't like WD40 for anything mechanical much, it IS water displacing, and I just can't wait for drying out before storage. I like the idea of the Murphy soap, peroxide, and alcohol though, and am gonna try it. Sonds great!

Aye, I'm used to it taking a while for men to be able to keep up with me..... Don't have anything ta add except that our crew uses pretty much the same ideas, basic moves cued by the fighters. As we do most of our live steel as attacks from off our pirate ship, verbal cues won't work as well as physical cues. I am intrigued that it seems most of the other crews do more cued fights than long strings of choreographed moves. For us, as we need to be able to fight on docks, the cued fight gives a lot more flexibility. It would be nice if some simple basic starting move could be learned by fighters from different crews. I am anticipatin' how this will make the festivals a lot more interestin' as long as we can keep it safe.

I love that movie ., ánother wonderful story from Robert Louis Stevenson ., I got it on DVD about 5 years ago for my collection. Who ever hasnt seen it should ., its a fun movie and was under-rated. In regard to folding bayonet blunderbusses, they seems to have been quite common during the early 18th century. The gun type was even patented in England in 1781. The idea seemed to gain popularity as the century wore on, with lots of 'em used in Rev. war times by all navies.

One thing about the bigger bore pieces that Lawrence and I have come to the conclusion on, is that when yer makin bangs, bigger ain't better. Optmum size of the bore seems to be right around two inches, where ya get tha biggest bang fer tha buck. Smaller, ya do get less bang. And with increasing tha bore beyond two inches you have to put in more and more powder, as the ignition is tending to blow more of the unburned charge down the barrel. While I don't know what the breech pressure curve is for this, I would expect that keeping sound level equal, the increased charge amounts as the bore size increases results in an steeply rising increase in breech pressure, which ain't good matey. When I sleeved my bronze Verbruggen from 3 inches down to 2 inches, I was able to use two-thirds the powder and get more noise.

In regard to polishing brass blunderbusses, the area around the touch hole will get very tarnished from the black powder, and I have not found Brasso or Nev-R-Dull will get rid of it. I use a green scrubbie, which dulls the factory shine of the brass a bit, but gets the piece cleaned in a reasonable amount of time. In regard to black painted sea service stocks on flintlocks, this seems to date back to the 18th century, and actually indicates that the military issue firearm was in fact used by the navy, according to William Gilkerson. I think that the black paint probably preserved the wooden stock better than the linseed oil mixture, although the oil is still used today on masts and spars in traditional rigs. The formula up here on the coast of Maine is half boiled linseed oil, to half turpentine to thin it out and make it penetrate, with a capful of Japan drier. Straight linseed tends to stay gummy too long.

The folding in of the end of the cartridge sounds like an interestin idea, I'd like ta see it. An artillery safety school I attended once had the theory that folding the forward end of the cartridge sorter like yer a talkin about would keep the tin foil from blowin out with the blast. But all my loads blow out or disintegrate tha forward two thirds o tha cartridge anyways, an we consistently wurm out tha back end an a bit of the sides. Now mebbe I likes me boom-booms louder than they do, doan rightly know. But yer method wud have tha advantages I'm advocatin.

Well, I'm sure every group is slightly different and some probably don't use the numbers. If memory serves me correctly, I'll go down the list (just for fun) 1. Looking down the barrel, stands on the right side of the gun at barrel's end. Before Fire: Ramming the charge with ram end of the wet sponge. After Fire: Wet sponge for sloppy awesomesauce. (extinguish embers and quick clean) 2. Looking down the barrel, stands on the left side of the gun at barrel's end. Before Fire: Loading the charge (Ding Dong) after a hand delivery from the powder monkey. Yes powder monkey was indeed the correct term. To my knowledge, never given a number, but if I had to.. I would say #5 man who just stands by the ammo cart all day… boooooring (perfect job for the noobies). After Fire: Worm (cleaning out the Ding Dong wrapper) and dry sponge to clean out the sloppy awesomesauce. 3. Looking down the barrel, stands on the left side of the gun's rear. Before Fire: Priming wire. This is the guy with the long brass pin with a ring at the end. Slams this down the wire to puncture the charge and open up the ding dong (delicious). After Fire: Vent pick to clean out any crap that could cause a fowling or misfire. Usually helps #4 insert and hold the primer. (Only until #4 has the lanyard snug, otherwise the primer wants to pop out while #4 walks back to firing postion). 4. Looking down the barrel, stands on the right side of the gun's rear Before Fire: Hooks the lanyard to the primer. Yaaaaa, that's about it. After Fire: Stands there until Before Fire: Lazy buggers! 5/Powder Monkey: Stands by the ammo crate and runs powder Before Fire: RUN MONKEY RUN! After Fire: RUN MONKEY RUN! 6/7/8: No reenactors needed but in Civil War they would prime the actual ammunition. Many rounds would have punch holes which had numbers on them. This is to open the round to allow fire in and ignite a fuse. The charge would then explode (say at 200 yards) instead of relying on a direct hit. Pretty nifty. Gun Sergeant: At gun's rear but slap in the middle. These guys also generally make fun of us (in good sport) and act as a bridge between officers and peons (I mean privates/corporals). They also crack wise at the officers, bringing us peons great joy. Before Fire: Aims and elevates the gun barrel. After Fire: Looking pretty with those 3+ stripes. Also, making fun of us and cracking wise. Tips: When #4 and using the lanyard, place the handle between your knee and hip on your leg. Instead of yanking the lanyard, keep your feet in the same place but turn left. Sometimes we'll yank the lanyard but loosen the tension and sometimes the lanyard hook will bounce out of the primmer hoop. Embarrassing. Everyone should use gloves at all time. Welder gloves are perfect, except for #4 where deerskin help with the delicate nature of the job. Why so much Brass everywhere? It doesn't make sparks unlike steel or iron, hence a much safer experience. You don't want that priming wire setting off a charge, now would you? Perks of artillery. When you get that sloppy powder/water mix on your clothes, it turns GREEN! Bringing character to your gear. Also, used primers pinned to your hat also give you more character. Yaaaar I love to write long posts and I hope you mates like reading them =) Everyone, feel free to message me or post with questions. A trip down memory lane =) On the subject of crew numbers, as I see ye be from the West Coast, this may be interestin'. Well, up here in Maine, in the traditional windjammer sailing fleet, whenever we need to get the passengers ta haul on a line together, we say "two, six, heave". All the crews do it, but just about none of 'em knows why. As yer probably knows, in the sea service of tha great guns, numbers two and six stood just behind the two crew working the muzzle and were responsible fer running the gun out when loaded, hauling on the taykles either side together. This call ta haul together survived on the East Coast, did it do the save on the West Coast I wonders?

I'm going to chime in here with what me buddy Blair at Loyalist Arms said, the English doglock is the most complicated lock he sells, and is the only lock I have ever sent back to him for adjustment. My guess is that the "dog" may be two different things, the hook that pivots on the lock plate and can engage a notch at the back of the cock and prevent it from falling, or perhaps the tab that protrudes slightly through the lock plate at a right angle and prevents the cock from falling. Anybody know?

One thing I have found when making a cartridge former rod out of wood for the great guns, or cannon, is to drill an air hole down to the end straight through, or at a slant if the wooden former is longer than yer drill. This makes the tin foil cartridge slide off without crumpling from the vacumn. Another bit of equipment which is more trouble to make, but is worth it, is a female form to receive the tinfoil cartridge when pouring in the powder. It will hold the empty cartridge upright for filling, keep the cartridge shaped perfectly when compacting and crimping the end, and will give a visual second check on how full the cartridge is, helping to avoid overcharges. This is lathe work unless you happen to find just the perfect wooden socket. An advantage of a well formed cylindrical cartridge is that the amount loaded is obvious comparing to the other cartridges in your magazine. Viceroy Sir Lawrence Campbell and I found at PIP a misfire that we suspect was caused by a cartridge that did not fit the bore very well and "tumbled" when being rammed. To avoid embarrassing failures to fire, I recommend that gunners avoid the crude "turdy" looking cartridges, but put a bit of effort in getting male and female formers made specifically for the bore of yer pieces.

One interesting point from the excellent advice Capn. Thighbiter gives, and which I also wholeheartedly agree with, is the Victorian webwork looking carriages mentioned. Actually they are not quite so young as the Victorian age but were manufactured as garrison carriages somewhat earlier in the 19th century than the Victorian age. Made from 1810 or so until the 1860s, the idea was to replace the wooden construction with something that would be more permanent for fixed artillery in forts, and they hold many cannon in parks today, with most folks assuming like I did that the webwork carriage was a much later way of displaying the gun. But no, these were working carriages.

Actually, the wheels are authentic. While this is a naval carriage usually seen onboard, when these were used for land based seacoast defense, the wooden wheels or trucks were replaced with these cast types.

I know the rest of the brethren think we Pirates of the Dark Rose don't want to play with the rest, but I truely just have not been following the Pyracy Pub until now. So........yes, Crudbeard, Bloodthirsty, Oreo, and hopefully some of the rest of our crew are definitely planning to see tha rest o ya next year. As ta where we camp, having a tent inside is rather handy for the cannons, but the beach seems like a fun place ta be as well. Mebbe we will do both. Crudbeard

My first post on the pub! While this may be a bit out of date in answer to the discussion, I use "fire in the hole" because it is the phrase that everyone understands. Righto, it is definitely not period authentic, but nobody mistakes what is to happen next. Wish we pirates had a better warning that would be as crystal clear.