Gentleman of Fortune

NOW THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT I WAS HOPING WOULD HAPPEN! this stuff is great guys! EXPOSED BOOBS AND FLOWING HAIR Well, remember, nobody outsideo of Rackam, Bonny and Reade really knew their true identity till after they were caught. So here again, the man who was employed by the the publisher of Johnson's book or a broadsheet etc was probably told, "paint us a picture of Reade and Bonny". My bet is that the opened shirt is just to reiterate the fact that they are women and are show some sensational boobage. And Long hair was in fashion. If you could grow it out long you could look fashionable without the incredible expese of a wig. If I were you though I would just wear it like everyone else wore it.... Of course, don't let me stop you from going to a pirate event with your boobs hanging out OR AT LEAST wait till i get there to do so TROUSER COLOR I think the natural linen/hemp/fustian color was probably the norm just because you stay cooler in lighter colors than you would in darker. Slops are work clothes too, so maybe not worth the expense and hassel of colored material.... The AXES The thing is that these look more like normal axes than naval/boarding axes with the spike. Maybe I have not seen enough originals but maybe the artist had not seen enough either and is just drawing what he knows. Keep it coming.... when we exhaust R&B lets do the frisking painting ok FOXE? GoF

I guess this has only just caused more confusion instead of less. The picture I originally posted was from the back cover of CJ 's GH. I assumed that it was from the original edition and posted it. After Josh's inquiry, I opened up the book and posted the ones that were in the text. So assuming the ones above in post one are correct.... I would imagine that, as Foxe has said time and time again, the artist who depicted the women were far removed from the carribean and from piracy and probably lived somewhere in England. The sensation of 2 women dressing like men and turning to piracy was just too incredible and fasinating for the citizenry of the early 18th Cent. So I would imagine that the hair and the naked boobs is just playing in to that. Regarless. They are wearing shoes, not boots and the tounges do not seem too high. The buckles are small though wich meshes with what we know about period shoes. We know that trousers for sailors are starting to come into fashion sometime in the early 18th Century and, Thomas's testimony and the engravings bear this out. The are button front with small buttons exposed. The length seems to be above ankle, below calf and are relatively straight. Both seem to have the standard shirt type for the period. It is not lace up the front but probably ties at the top. I imagine that their shirts are not tied in order to show us that they are women (look boobs). Although some of the men I have seen at events dressed as pirates have bigger boobs than those depicted here Coat: The coat seems resonably short and has what appear to be medium small cuffs. Can anyone make out any more details here? Hats.... Peter the Great style? They certainly are not headscarves. The scarves they are wearing are around their neck. Anyone else?

This is not going exactly where I wanted it too so let me try again. The picture I posted was from my copy of Johnsons... but not the right picture. I will get the correct one from the first edition and post it later.....

Jessie, I am curious too. That is why I would love to see more original hats from our period. With felted wool, its a cloth that has gone through the "fulling process". You can do this yourself. Throw a wool blanket in the wash machine on warm with a little soap and viola. The fulling process (or what makes it felt) is the result of the individual strands of hair embeding themselves in other strands. Each strand of wool/hair is not smooth but has little finger like projections, the soap makes them open up a bit and helps them slide over each other "locking" them in. With wool felt, you make layers of wool bats.... here is a visiual description of the process If you start with a wool textille (wool fel, the end result is a more flexible felt. But if you start with chunks of wool or wool batts, the end result is a little stiffer and more suitable for a hat. The few picutes I have seen would make me believe that the are wool felt, but these have been late 18th C Tricorn/Cocked Hat examples.

I thought this would be a good exercise to have us all discuss and make comments on Authentic Pirate costume. Foxe makes an excellent point when he makes the claim that: "While we assume that the person making the engraving is intimately familiar with sailors and pirates, chances are they are an artist working back in England and far removed from Pirates and Piracy". Even though, these are the best records we have for determining what is authentic costume for GAoP. We have the added benefit of an eyewitness description of Reade and Bonney from the testimony of Dorothy Thomas who was on a ship that was attacked by R&B. Her description of Reade and Bonny during their trial is as follows: (I screwed the pooch and posted a 19C pic which messed up my point.) I believe that these are the ones from the 1724 General History. If anyone has a better picture than this, please post it...

How is it made? Is it woven or is it Felted like wool? Curious GoF

Foxe Its not that I don't like the frisking scene... its just that its not a close up so I really can't make out the details. Maybe I should have put a when I said it. I like Hogarth too. My concern though is that he just started with his silver work in 1720 and not really the cool engraving stuff till the 1730s+. I feel that he starts to "paint" fashions that are more indicitive of the mid to later 18th C..... My favorite is the Rakes Progress (or whatever its called). "short jacket" I guess I am repeating what i have heard on other lists about it being short in the back and longer in the front. THAT is why I want better pictures to study because I, like you, cant determine if they are like that. (too me they seem the same length). My question is: Is this specific to sailors? Is it a shortened waistcoat or a shortenend justaucorp? What I would like to do next is post "period" pictures here (in another thread) and we could discuss the details. Maybe we should start wit Reade and Bonny? GoF

Longarm The conundrum is that seamen of different periods did wear (and have been documented to wear) earings. The point of the thread is/was that seamen are documented to wear earrings prior to the GAop, because it was fashionable to wear earrings then. Sailors wore earings After the GAop (late 18th & 19th centuries?) because it was fashionable to wear earrings then. BUT it seems that it was not fashionable to wear earrings during the the GAoP (1690-1720) and there is no evidence of anyone (pirate or otherwise) wearing them. It seems that the "tradition" of sailors wearing earrings got started AFTER the GAoP (that would be the tradition that everyone quotes as evidence). So Pyle et al were probably drawing from more "recent" tradition and the fact that sailors in the early 1600s were wearing them. Remember.... Pyle was drawing/painting at 150 years after the fact as well and probably had less information about historical pirates then we do now. I would imagine that if he was alive today and drawing pirates, with the info availlable now, he would be painting them a little different. GoF

Correct John.... cocked hat! Thanks for the heads up CC.... but I am really looking for pictures, descriptions of surviving examples. The cocked hat was around for about 100 years and I am curious as to the desiticntion between early and late. In the little research I have done, It seems that in the late 17th and early 18th Centuries, people did just about anything to their hats and that there were lots of different styles..... But as far as the basic "hat" goes. It seems that there was a round crown and a sugar loaf style that they then "cocked". By the AM Rev, it seems that they were offsetting the hole for the head to make the hat shorter in the front (4") and longer in the back (6-7"). I am really curious if this was done earlier as well or ? The basic hat blank that most companies sell seem to be the round crown that is roughly 5-51/2 " tall. Also, the wool that is used to make them generally seems to be a wool/rayon mix that is felted wool, not wool felt. the research goes on.....

Hurricane.... Can you e-mail me those photos... looks like E-bay pulled the listing as it is not accessible anymore. Thanks for the heads up though! GoF

Just kind of curious.... I have always assumed that those that came into "pirate" via SCA called it Garb. Others that have sailed in from other re-enacting time periods seem to call it "kit" or something else....

I had the great hard-drive failure of 2004 right before christmas and lost (never made a back up) all of my jpgs of original paintings etc of pirate stuff that I had gleaned from the net.... But anyway, I am trying to hunt down some info (hopefully photos of originals) on Tricorns for 1690-1720. I know that lots of "vendors" sell their version of a tricorn but most folks that do cater to F&I and Am Rev re-enactors. So what are the differences between a 1776 tricorn and a 1702 tricorn? This is meant to include triming, feathrers, cockades etc. Also, the ones that I have come across lately (later 18th C) seem to be made from wool felt not felted wool (there is a difference). Does anyone have anything to add? (or links to pics?) Thanks GoF PS the difference is felted wool is a woven wool textile that is felted wool felt is matted wool (like dreadlocks... kind of)

I would really like to read the passages on GAoP period justaucorps and Waistocats. Also, I'd like to get my mits on the patterns that she has regarding those items. And while I have your attention. I am trying to hunt down more infor on the sailors short jacket of the period. I understand that it is short in the back and long in the front, and has the mariner cuffs... but I would like to see more picures! Close ups too not faint water color of some chicks getting frisked. Thanks man! GoF

I hope my post didn't come across @ssh0le like.... I didn't have much time to post and now when I re-read it , it seems harsh. I think that there are two markets for Pirate stuff. The first, which makes up probably 95% of the market, is for Ren/Fantasy/Romatic/Hollywood versions of pirate stuff. The other 5% is for the folks who want it "Authentic/Accurate". This is not a "pass judgement" on either side thread, as both sides have their place (and if they are having fun... all the better). So to answere your question of: They did it that way to appeal to peoples emotional and preconcived idea of what they think a cool pirate looks like. If the workmanship is good, and you are handy with a needle, then you should not have too much of a problem "altering" it to look more like a 1700 shirt. IMHO I would 1) make a stand up collar for it (you should have plenty of material in the existing collar to do this. 2) find a way to ditch the lace up front and opt for a linen tape closure like (previous post). 3) Those cuffs look HUGE too. I would try to trim em down to about an inch and they should close with two button holes and a linen tape. btw... what is it made out of? GoF

Hmmm.... Its very period for 2005 Pirate Festival wear. Are you asking if that shirt is correct for Early 18th Century/GAoP? no shirt in question this is a line diagram of what the shirt should looklike.... although in GAoP the collar is not fold down but should be approx 1" stand up collar Also, it should not lace up the front but should have a button hole at the top on each side and you put a linnen "tape" through to tie it closed. Here is a place to get the pattern Get some 100% linen medium weight, the pattern, linen thread and about 5 hours of your time and you are good to go. Also, check out my site (non-commercial) for more infor on building your kit.

Adding to what Corsair said 1689: the first calico printworks was begun in Germany at Augsburg and was later to grow into a large industry 1708 William III signed a law prohibiting the importation of printed silks, this only made calicos and silks more popular 1716 There were now more than 30 laws in England prohibiting the importation of calico and cotton; prints became more popular than ever. So for early 18th I would imagine that they were still an unusual choice of clothing.... enough so to be have a nickname that reflected it. GoF And except for the early and late 18th Cotton will be banned in England to protect the domestic market from imports from India other places

If any of you overspent on the holidays and needs cash and dosen't mind parting with this book please PM me! GoF

Well now that you have period shoes.... you are WAY ahead of the power curve as far as authentic kit goes. I would love to see the pics so get to work! GoF

I don't think there are going to be suttlers there... per se. They just said that they were bringing a sample of Practical Goose stuff and if there was anything in particular..... I PM's you so watch your mail! GOF

Well if the Traveler is traveling..... he still has to have shoes right? So I would think that if the fashion was to wear red heels (and also the underside of the tongue of the shoe) then why not do it on all of his shoes? He is probably imitating the court fashion.... not actually going to court. The trick is finding the right paint.... I did paint mine. I forgot what I used to paint them with though. I put it on, then didn't like it and tried to get it off.... it didn't work to well but it did tone down the red. Check them out here not a very good picture of the shoes (the one with me in the justaucorp) but there is a good picture of Mark Beaby's shoes and they look great with the red heels. How do you like the shoes? I was hoping that you would post some pic on the Piratebrethren forum.... Do they look like commoner shoes or do they look like upper class shoes. On the link above, I think the Kevin Garlic shoes (they are mine) look like commoner shoes (which is why I was semi-hesitant to red the heels). The Beaby shoe from Bjarne's boots and Sarah Junipers look like they would belong to an upper class gentlemen. Something more to think about.

Well I don't know. I mean, there either is or isn't a knitted cap in the Hermitage that PtG brought back from the England in 1699. If there is, than I would say its an option. I think the biggest drawback is that its about twice the price of a Thrum or Monmouth (from Kristie Buckland anyway. And its in Pounds Stirling (with a crummy exchange of almost 2-1). Hawkyns How do you like the Thrum from Practical Goose? I got an unsolicited e-mail from them asking to put a link to their hats on my pirate resources page. She claims (in the e-mail) to be the Kristy B of the US. I am interested to see her prices. Josh (if you are looking for a period knit hat, Practical Goose says they are going to the Pirate Feast with some stock) GoF

Well I don't know. I mean, there either is or isn't a knitted cap in the Hermitage that PtG brought back from the England in 1699. If there is, than I would say its an option. I think the biggest drawback is that it about twice the price of ta Thrum or Monmouth (from Kristie Buckland anyway. Hawkyns How do you like the Thrum from Practical Goose? I got an unsolicited e-mail from them asking to put a link to their hats on my pirate resources page. She claims (in the e-mail) to be the Kristy B of the US. I am interested to see her prices. GoF

My personal belief is that they are all good for our period. She calls the one "Peter the Great" because when the Russian Tsar visited London and the Low Countries (1698-99) to learn how to build his Navy he, was so taken with this English mariners cap that he bought one and took it home with him. She based it off of the original survives in the Hermitage Museum, Russia. The cap is tall in the crown rising to a rounded top. It has a double knitted down sloping brim about 45mm wide. Black John... i say that is a Peter t G hat!

If you can't get enough of talking about historically portraying Golden Age Piracy, make sure you stop by the Yahoo Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/piratebrethren/ Over 100 members and growing strong!

Lets just don't let this turn into one of those "we saved your @ss" kind of threads that pit the UK and US against each other. Just take a step back and look at world events. While like the US, the UK does have its portion of Jerry Springer Show morons; We, the US, have NO BETTER friend than the UK. SO.... back to why we hate Hollywood & Authentic pirates!