Elena

Yes, and there are other ballads about girls dressed as sailor boys too. Simply because they had happened. One had happened on the Thames river and they knew it was a girl when she fell dead from the rigging. As William was a very often given name that time, I think she was known as William too. Only that I don't remember right now the title of that ballad so I can find it... Maybe somebody else remembers what I am telling about.... Other similar ballad is "Caroline and her sailor bold" There lived a rich Nobleman's daughter Caroline is her name we are been told One day from her drawing room window She admired a young sailor bold She cried - I'm a Nobleman's daughter My income's five thousand in gold I forsake both my father and mother And I'll marry young sailor bold Says William- Fair lady remember Your parents you are bound to mind In sailors there is no dependence For they leave their true lovers behind And she says - There's no one could prevent me One moment to alter my mind In the ships I'll be off with my true love He never will leave me behind Three years and a half on the ocean And she always proved loyal and true Her duty she did like a sailor Dressed up in her jacket of blue When at last they arrived back in England Straightway to her father she went Oh father dear father forgive me Deprive me forever of gold Just grant me one favor I ask you To marry a young sailor bold Her father looked upon young William And love and in sweet unity If I be spared till tomorrow It's married this couple shall be. Well, there is another Irish one which tells a slightly different story - about a "son of a gun" - "The handsome cabin boy": It's of a pretty female As you may understand. Her mind being bent for rambling Unto some foreign land, She dressed herself in sailor's clothes, Or so it does appear, And she hired with a captain To serve him for a year. [The captain's wife she being on board, She seemed in great joy To think the captain had engaged Such a handsome cabin boy, That now and then she'd slip him a kiss, And she'd have liked to toy, But 'twas the captain found out the secret Of the handsome cabin boy.] Her cheeks they were like roses And her hair rolled in a curl. The sailors often smiled and said He looked just like a girl. But eating of the captain's biscuit Her colour did destroy, And the waist did swell of pretty Nell, The handsome cabin boy. It was in the bay of Biscay Our gallant ship did plow. One night among the sailors Was a fearful flurry and row.* They tumbled from their hammocks For their sleep it did destroy, And they sworn about the groaning Of the handsome cabin boy. "Oh doctor, dear, oh doctor," The cabin boy did cry. "My time has come, I am undone, And I will surely die." The doctor come a-runnin' And a-smilin' at the fun. To think a sailor lad should have A daughter or a son. The sailors when they saw the joke They all did stand and stare. The child belonged to none of them, They solemnly did swear. The captain's wife, she says to him, "My dear, I wish you joy, For 'tis either you or me's betrayed The handsome cabin boy!" [Now sailors, take your tot of rum And drink success to trade, And likewise to the cabin boy That was neither man nor maid. Here's hoping the wars don't rise again Our sailors to destroy, And here's hoping for a jolly lot more Like the handsome cabin boy! More? "The female smuggler": O come list a while, and you shall hear, By the rolling sea lived a maiden fair. Her father had followed the smuggling trade, Like a war-like hero. Like a warlike hero that never was afraid. Now, in sailor's clothing young Jane did go, Dressed like a sailor from top to toe Her aged father was the only care O this female smuggler. Of this female smuggler who never did despair. With her pistols loaded she went aboard. And by her side hung a glittering sword, In her belt two daggers; well armed for war Was this female smuggler, Was this female smuggler, who never feared a scar. Now they had not sail-ed far from the land, When a strange sail brought them to a stand. 'These are sea robbers,' this maid did cry, 'But the female smuggler, But the female smuggler will conquer or will die. Alongside, then, this strange vessel came. Cheer up,' cried Jane, 'we will board the same; We'll run all chances to rise or fall,' Cried this female smuggler, Cried this female smuggler, who never feared a ball. Now they killed those pirates and took their store, And soon returned to old Eng-a-land's shore. With a keg of brandy she walked along, Did this female smuggler, Did this female smuggler, and sweetly sang a song. Now they were followed by the blockade, Who in irons strong did put this fair maid. But when they brought her for to be ter-ied, This young female smuggler, This young female smuggler stood dress-ed like a bride. Their commodore against her appeared, And for her life she did greatly fear. When he did find to his great surprise 'Twas a female smuggler, 'Twas a female smuggler had fought him in disguise. He to the judge and the jury said, 'I cannot prosecute this maid, Pardon for her on my knees I crave, For this female smuggler, For this female smuggler so valiant and so brave.' Then this commodore to her father went, To gain her hand he asked his consent. His consent he gained, so the commodore And the female smuggler, And the female smuggler are one for evermore. "The brisk young lively lad" It's of a brisk young lively lad Came out of Gloucestershire, And all his full intention was To court a lady fair. Her eyes they shone like morning dew, Her hair was fair to see; She was grace, In form and face, And was fixed in modesty. This couple was a-walking, They loved each other well; And someone heard them talking And did her father tell, And when her father came to know And understand this thing, Then said he 'From one like thee I'll free my daughter in the spring!' 'Twas in the spring-time of the year There was a press begun; And all their full intention was To press a farmer's son. They pressed him, and sent him out Far o'er the raging sea, 'where I'm sure He will no more Keep my daughter company! In man's apparel then she did Resolve to try her fate; And in the good ship where he rid She went as surgeon's mate. Says she 'My soldier shall not be Destroyed for want of care; I will dress, And I will bless, Whatsoever I endure! The twenty-first of August There was a fight begun, And foremost in the battle They placed the farmer's son. He there received a dreadful wound That struck him in the thigh, Every vein Was filled with pain, He got wounded dreadfully. Into the surgeon's cabin They did convey him straight, Where, first of all the wounded men, The pretty surgeon's mate Most tenderly did dress his wound, Which bitterly did smart; Then said he 'Oh! one like thee Once was mistress of my heart! She went to the commander And offered very fair: 'Forty or fifty guineas Shall buy my love quite clear! No money shall be wanted, No longer tarry here!' 'Since 'tis so Come, let's go! To old England we will steer!' She went unto her father's gate And stood there for a while; Said he 'The heavens bless you! My own and lovely child!;' Cried she 'Since I have found him, And brought him safe to shore, Our days we'll spend In old England, Never roam abroad no more!'

Just a stupid question... but most ships are told they made around 10 knots in good wind, some lighter ones up to 12... When you were talking here about 4 knots or less... I am a little shocked. It is too much of a difference between the two figures not to be shocked. Any idea why?

Here as usual.

Thank you all for your explanations! They give lots of good ideas :) not only for the present story. They help a lot, both because I am never sure about the exact technical signification of certain English words and because I don't have a detailed idea on what happens during ship work on a sailing ship. Yes, we had a loose cannon incident, two times (not aboard the same ship).

Thank you very much. He might have got his body in the bite of a line under pressure, and the captain saw in the last second and grabbed him back. It helps a lot. In which conditions would a line do this? Not falling overboard though, because it has happened with others in the story (I was inspired by Mission's post with Saint Elmo's fires, and the sailor who saw it - a devout Catholic - crossed himself in terror, forgetting that he was holding the rope of a bossun's chair, and that there was someone in that chair, checking the hull for damages... )

We had seen in stories a lot of times the lowly sailor/ soldier saving his officer's life... but in what circumstances it can be the opposite? A captain saving a sailor's life? I am trying to come with an idea but not sure which, this is why I need your help, as you are more accustomed with mishappenings aboard. This captain would be capable to help/ grab away the young sailor if he sees the impending accident, and I want the young sailor very grateful to him for having saved his life. ...So, please, help! What could have gone wrong aboard in this case? (1719, West Indies, if it helps... And it;s during the daily work, not in a battle.)

I am Elena, sailing to you from the Black Sea... or a little more inland, from Bucharest, Romania. I am also into writing pirate fiction and the Pub has always helped me with research and ideas. I am always willing to make new friends too...

Thank you for the ideas! <3

...if suddenly confronted, while up into the rigging, during his watch, with stomach cramps? The beginning of the "flux", or a food poisoning or something? I guess he can't get down until the watch ends, the bossun will be angry with him anyway... but if he doesn't go to the "heads"... it would be worse.

You are here among friends from all countries, how you can notice... So greetings from the Black Sea...

You are here among friends from all countries, how you can notice... So greetings from the Black Sea...

Do you know you have a pirate ancestor? His name is Stenka Razin! This is the song: And this is the story and the translation of the song: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stenka_Razin Welcome aboard! Or should I say Dobro pozhalovat'?

A warm wish, a :Thank you" for all who keep alive this wonderful place, a cake worth all the Brethren, And a toast for many more years together:

Yes, thank you John,it fits with my ship's needs too.

A question: would a ship have charcoal aboard in our time before the steamers? and if yes, why? Because I heard that making charcoal for the little forge takes several days...

Thank you very much, it was common at sea, as far as I heard (and on land too in those times). Until then, I found a book in your links dealing with it, and I read a bit - when I find my information, I have nothing against researching "on my own", I don't take (always) an "already digested" answer. Anyway, your book helped me with what I needed immediately (I think it was the one published in 1736).

It works without pictures, Grimm! It is exactly what I need! Thank you!

What was the treatment for "flux", "camp fever" and other gastro-intestinal epidemics then? I mean, yes, many people died... but some still survived typhoid fever, disinteria, yellow fever and the things. Even cholera!

Many happy returns!~

I hadn't found a pigeon to carry out my message, and the snail was too late in delivering my wishes to you - sorry!

Never too late for the snail to arrive and send you the deserved greetings...