Blunderbuss Project

[Capt. Bo of the WTF co.]

Earlier this year I began converting an old CVA Blunderbuss kit into a better piece...

http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h80/Capt...lunderbuss1.jpg

http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h80/Capt...lunderbuss2.jpg

I have yet to finish the butt plate and install a better lock. My problem now is, I want to carry it on a cavalry sling. I haven't been able to document this in GAoP. Anyone?

Bo

[Capt. Bo of the WTF co.]

OK... Let's try again...

Same question. (Forgot how to post photos there for a bit. Sorry!)

[kass]

It's lovely, Bo!

Unfortunately I have no idea about the cavalry sling. But I bet the boys will be along shortly...

[blackjohn]

Cavalry slings, yes. On a blunderbuss (scratches head and thinks about it), not that I know of.

[Capt. Bo of the WTF co.]

Thakee both kindly.

BJ- thought I'd seen engravings with musketoons on slings before, but wasn't certain. I doubt any specific evidence exists for blunderbuss's though. As long as they were in use at the time I'm going ahead with it. Thanks again.

Bo

[Cascabel]

Somewhere I remember seeing a photo of a blunderbuss with a single swivel on the left side, held by one of the lock attaching screws. That would indicate to me use of a cavalry-type of sling. If I remember correctly, it was on a medium sized blunderbuss. If I can find the picture, I will post it here.

There were a great many variations in blunderbusses that were private contract and one of a kind pieces. I think we can be reasonably sure that somebody carried one on a cavalry style sling.

The single-point sling idea was still in existance in modern times with sawed-off shotguns carried under a coat during the roaring twenties gangster era. I say go for it !!!!!

[Capt. Bo of the WTF co.]

Many thanks Cascabel! I would love to see the picture if you find it.

I will be making a new side plate that incorporates both lock screws for the attachment of the ring for added strength.

I LOVE THIS PLACE!

Bo

[the Royaliste]

..Hmm...O.K., men, 'I'm from Missouri'! (not really, but)..'Show Me!!'...As much as I'd love to believe where this is going, I've seen no factual evidence of a naval style, whether 'contract',private or not, of any blunderbuss equipped with a cavalry rig sling....Now, since there is little evidence of a seaman havin' one,(no use, eh?), and most pirates were seamen, well then...show me, as I'm always interested in factual based historical indiscrepancies..I have to greet a hundred thousand doubting assholes every year that 'know it all'. Like Joe Friday, I just need the facts...In difference, many muskets sport swivels for use as wall guns, although most were planned for that use....Our arsenal aboard includes several blunderbuss, privateer 'contract' stlye, and larger Brown Bess types with a Grice-stlye lock. We're seamen, so when we care to sling 'em, we just grab a hunk 'o line, throw a hitch around the forestock, a hitch behind the triggerguard, and head ashore....but then again, we're simple sailors...

[Captain Jim-sib]

Having made a CVA Long Rifle Kit in me younger years, me hat's off to you for such a fine lookin' piece. CVA is not known for simple kits. Yet,

what comes in any kit?...parts! Well Done, sir !

[Capt. Bo of the WTF co.]

To the Capt. of the Royaliste;

Well sir, I AM a native of Missouri, born and raised in Cass county, and a true border man/ bushwhacker. Check the history books. Be careful how you throw that phrase around. :) ( all in fair play my friend- no animosity intended at all )

Seriously though, I would like to see some evidence myself, however I am and always will be of the firm oppinion that this old world would be a very backward place if someone somewhere didn't have the gray-matter to figure out how to do something better than what was being done. "Necessity is the mother of all invention" etc.

Secondly, I do more shore duty being out here in Missouri, and do some horsing around in cavalry and such. A sling is more to my personal liking besides.

Capt. Jim-sib, I thank you for the kind words.

Almost forgot to mention that L&R makes a vry nice replacement lock for those old Spanish made originals. They have a round face that very much resembles a Queen Anne but with no markings. As soon as I can trade around some stuff, I will be putting one on this piece.

[Cascabel]

O.K., Shipmates, (and ye of little faith)......

Here 'tis

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i238/cas...Blunderbuss.jpg

I hope it works. If not, I'll try again.

>>>>> Cascabel

[Cascabel]

Gonna try again to post the picture, rather than just the link....

Any how, the piece is in the Lewis H. Gordon Collection. Picture scanned from one of the books that I have. Not the exact piece I was thinking of, but the first image that I found. English, 16'' brass barrel, overall length, 31 3/8"

>>>> Cascabel

[Capt. Bo of the WTF co.]

YOU DA MAN HOSS!! :)

Thanx Cascabel, Jeez I love this place!

Bo

[blackjohn]

I haven't been able to document this in GAoP. Anyone?

I will add this. I have read in the post-Golden Age era (RevWar, George Washington) blunderbusses were issued to dragoons on a trial basis. Hence, they would need swivels.

I'm curious about the date of the blunderbuss in the pic Cascabel posted. It may be of a much later style. It has some characteristics (eg, the cannon barrel) that I believe are more indicative of a late 18thC firearm.

[Cascabel]

I don't think it is any kind of military issue piece at all. It just has a single point sling attachment that would lend itself nicely to a shoulder sling.

I don't think the sling in any way other than basic concept resembled the heavy suspension rig used by dragoons. Most likely a simple strap diagonally across the body of much lighter type. The piece and the sling swivel doesn't have the heavy-duty appearance of a military weapon.

>>>>> Cascabel

[blackjohn]

I'm curious Cascabel, does your source give any provenance for this particular weapon?

It is worth noting, as I'm sure you well know, the distinction between blunderbuss, musketoon and carbine can be somewhat blurry. While it wouldn't surprise me to find a blunderbuss of our period mounted with a sling, like the Royaliste, I'd like more facts.*

As an aside, I have seen every other type of carriage method used -- sling swivels, belt hook(!), even a braided leather sling tied at the barrel and the trigger guard.

*My apologies if I sound like a pain in the butt. It's not that I am (well... ymmv), it is that I'm a doubter. While my little mind can run through a zillion scenarios covering obtuse hows and whys to explain something, but at the end of the day, those are just theories, so I like to rely on facts and figures.

[Hawkyns]

Blackjohn I was thinking exactly the opposite, that it looked like an early 18th c piece. Particularly that extreme curve in the lockplate looks like one of the early so called banana lock plates like the first pattern and before pattern Bess.

Hawkyns

[blackjohn]

Yep, I agree with that, it does have an early looking banana-shaped lock.

[Cascabel]

I got the picture from 'The History of Weapons of the American Revolution' by George C. Neumann. The caption says "Circa 1760-1770", but appears older to me because of the curved lockplate. The lock is marked "BUCKMASTER". The engravings indicate possible use by an officer or well-to-do individual.

Perhaps someone has a listing of English gun makers showing the dates that they worked, and could shed a bit more light on it.

>>>>> Cascabel

[Capt. Bo of the WTF co.]

I definately won't be making a Dragoon sling fo this little buggar. I have worn them attached to an Enfield Musketoon doing Expansion period. Take yer head off if snagged in the brush! Mine will be around 2" wide of woven strap. My best friends wife is an accomplished weaver and does beautiful work.

One point to remember, is that when I go public, I ALWAYS note that most of what I carry is of my own design, and Not common to everyone. I am an inventive spirit now, and was in all my past lives as well. I still take new items and modify them to suit my own tastes. That's why we're living here in th USA. We'd still be in the dark ages if people didn't create "better mouse traps."

Bo

[Cascabel]

Aye, Bo...

I think you are on the right track. So often "documentation" and actual examples of period items are non-existant, so we must use a bit of common sense or "educated guessing" as to exactly what some non-durable items looked like. The sling that went with this weapon crumbled away many years ago, so we are left with only the gun itself. At that point, you need to think about what would work from a practical standpoint.

It can be considerably easier for those that do military re-enactment because of written government specifications and the higher likelyhood of surviving examples because of higher rates of production.

Sometimes even government specifications were a bit vague and open to interpretation, plus slight variations in issue items were dictated by available materials and production expedients. Throw into the mix the fact that governments sold off surplus and obsolete gun parts, much as they still do today, and you can have some very interesting variations in what turns up in collections.

I have seen numerous examples of Middle Eastern pistols and blunderbusses with high quality English or French locks. Usually the rest of the gun is not as good as the lock, and many times the lock is considerably older than the rest of the gun.

>>>>> Cascabel

[callenish gunner]

just a thought ...if a man was to climb the riggin' to get a shot at the opposing deck wouldn't he want a way to carry such a weapon aloft???

[Hawkyns]

He would, but I wouldn't reccomend this as a way of doing it. That shoulder baldric carry works very well on horseback, and tolerably on foot, as long as you have a hand to staedy the piece. Let it it swing loose with both hands used on the standing rigging and I will guarantee that the butt will get hooked under the ratlines.

Hawkyns

[Capt. Bo of the WTF co.]

Excellent observation Mr. Hawkyns. Thanx everyone for the input. I will post photos of the final product when complete.

Bo

[the Royaliste]

Aye, a fine photo, indeed,but....As Blackjohn mentioned, I really need provenance to deal with accuracy fobs. Otherwise, it's 'just a personal modification', and they tend to look the other way......