Fusil Boucanier

[Monterey Jack]

I know variations of this have been posted before, I just can't find them:

Benerson Little, in his book "The Sea Rover's Practice" quotes

Esquemelin and Labat in describing a particular musket having a barrel

of 57 inches and .75 calibre.

My question is where we can find these muskets; or something close to

them. Loyalist Arms has the 1690s doglock and Middlesex Village has

the French 1717 musket which IMHO would work in a pinch. Does anyone

here know of other suppliers who can meet this requirement?

Obviously anyone portraying a traditional buccaneer will use whatever they have that falls within the time frame they wish, individually. I'm just looking to match this as close as I can and work from there.

[Capn_Enigma]

Exquemelin writes in The Buccaneers of America (1678):

"The buccaneers' main excercises are target- shooting and keeping their guns clean. They use good weapons, such as muskets and pistols. Their muskets are about four and a half feet long and fire a bullet of sixteen to a pound of lead."

and later:

"Morgan received the (Panama) resident's envoy with great civility and gave him a French musket with a barrel four and a half feet long, firing a one ounce bullet, [..]"

These muskets would not have been a doglock, but almost certainly a matchlock, which still was the weapon of choice in the Caribbean in the early 1670s.

Please note also that the barrel is 54" long and has caliber of .663 (16 gauge) and not .75 (10 gauge)

[Monterey Jack]

These muskets would not have been a doglock, but almost certainly a matchlock, which still was the weapon of choice in the Caribbean in the early 1670s.

Please note also that the barrel is 54" long and has caliber of .663 (16 gauge) and not .75 (10 gauge)

I agree the earlier ones would have been matchlocks; but isn't it true that by the latter 1600 the doglocks were being sent to the colonies as superior arms? From what I'm reading they load quicker, were lighter and had no match waving about that needed dealing with.

Little states that the:

"Matchlock was truly suited only for the conventional line of battle. Flint arms were preferred at sea and in the American Colonies from the latter half of the seventeenth century onward."

Given the trade (and theft) going on between the colonies and the Caribbean at the time I can see the buccs using these whenever possible.

As for the calibre, you're right; I misread that portion of the page.

In any case, where do we find 'em?

[Monterey Jack]

This is off the Loyalist website and is, in part, what I'm basing my search on; I just would like options and opinions. I know its likely 90% sales pitch, but to my knowledge they usually aren't too far off the mark historically.

****************

The Doglock musket, (named after the dog catch safety behind the cock), replaced the Jacobean/English lock of the early 1600's.

The Doglock came into being around the 1640's and were popular in the British armed forces until about 1715.

They remained in use as a regular issued weapon in the British navy for many years after this and

eventually evolved into the Sea Service musket of the 1730's.

These muskets were very popular in the colonies from the Caribbean to Canada.

The common, early British trade gun with the serpentine side plate was modelled after this musket as well.

Most firearms excavated at Port Royal Jamaica were of the doglock variety.

Many of these rugged muskets were used right up to the Revolutionary War in America by colonial troops as well

as native Americans.

Thoughts?

[Capt. Bo of the WTF co.]

I just want to point out that .75 cal. is equivalent to 12 guage, and the .62 cal is 20 guage. the .69 cal is the equivalent of 16 guage.

On the subject of where to find them, you will probably have to have one custom built. There was a Tulle Fusil style for sale on another forum that had a 52" .69 caliber barrel, but it had the 1680 French Tulle flintlock on it. I don't know of any makers off-hand turning out production buccaneer guns. There are several 17th century folks posting in the Frontier Folks forum who could help I'm sure. Try this...

http://frontierfolk.net/mb/

Good luck !

[Monterey Jack]

Thanks, Bo!

I just dug up some old posts from the Buccaneer project that say pretty much the same thing. I'll check out th' link,

Thanks, Mate!

[Jim Dandy]

Uhhh.... I don't want to come off as the slightest bit argumentative, seeing as how I'm the new kid on the block, but I don't see how anyone, anytime, anywhere could have used a matchlock for hunting. The critters you were after would smell the match, and your ignition time is iffy. Neither of those are considerations if you're in a battalion blasting away at another battalion, but they sure are if you're trying to get the drop on a passel of feral pigs on Hispaniola.

I've hunted hogs (though not with black powder). You could never get close to them with a lit match. Never in perdition. The Spanish were stuck with matchlocks because His Catholic Majesty didn't want his colonies to be better armed than the home crowd. Which is one reason why a bunch of angry Carribbean longhunters were able shoot h*ll out of them, on land and sea. Also: Never seen a period representation of a boucanier with anything but a flinter.

(gets off little soapbox, looks abashed)

Re: the weapon you quote from the Sea Rover's Practice: 57" sounds exactly right for an old-time fusil boucanier, seeing as how the old French inch is about x1.08 longer than our English inch. 54 French inches equal 57" or 58" of ours. So that sounds like a regulation weapon. The bore, on the other hand, sounds English. Curiouser & curiouser... Perhaps it was Dutch? The Dutch used the same big bores as the English did, and favored the same paddlebutt stock and the same ultrasuperlong barrels the French did. I guess without a picture we can't know for sure.

Closest thing I can think of in a ready-made weapon would be the Cookson fowler offered by the Middlesex Trading Co. I looked long & hard at it, but have resolved to build a 12-bore club-butt fowler instead. The buccaneer fusil is a beautiful thing, and I shall build one someday with parts from the Rifle Shoppe, but in the meantime -- as an English subject -- I feel no great need to pass myself off as a counterfeit Frenchman (grins, doffs hat).... and I want to go BP-hunting for the wily wildschwein sometime before 'someday'.

(And then barbecue it, or at least a haunch of it, according to one of Labat's recipes. And then eat it. But that's a whole 'nother topic)

[Bartholomew Treate]

Doglocks were indeed in heavy use in Port Royal, at least up through 1692 when the earthquake struck.

Here's a great link on the artifacts as well as a history and progression of the firing mechanisms...

-- http://www.geocities.com/aborgcr/PRoyal/pr...prfirearms.html

[Capn_Enigma]

.. but I don't see how anyone, anytime, anywhere could have used a matchlock for hunting. The critters you were after would smell the match, and your ignition time is iffy.

Do you have a source that matchlocks were not used by the buccaneers for hunting?

A. Konstam:

For most of the buccaneer period, the standard firearm was the matchlock musket. As the weapon measured up to 5 ft. (1.5 meters) long, it was cumbersome to carry and operate, and smaller and lighter caliver muskets were sometimes used, although many buccaneers considered them less effective in battle.

In the Caribbean, winds blow very steadyly. So the buccaneers would approach their prey from the leeward side, where the smell of the matches would be blown away from their prey.

[Monterey Jack]

.. but I don't see how anyone, anytime, anywhere could have used a matchlock for hunting. The critters you were after would smell the match, and your ignition time is iffy.

Do you have a source that matchlocks were not used by the buccaneers for hunting?

A. Konstam:

For most of the buccaneer period, the standard firearm was the matchlock musket. As the weapon measured up to 5 ft. (1.5 meters) long, it was cumbersome to carry and operate, and smaller and lighter caliver muskets were sometimes used, although many buccaneers considered them less effective in battle.

In the Caribbean, winds blow very steadyly. So the buccaneers would approach their prey from the leeward side, where the smell of the matches would be blown away from their prey.

I think the firearm most common at the start of the bucc period would have been a matchlock, and the woodcuts of the period show stocks that certainly look like a matchlock. However, being the industrious fellows the buccs were, if they could get their hands on a cache of doglocks they certainly would have used them. The excavation points to them being in the Caribbean and their import for use in the colonies in the late 1600s has been established, so I'd say it would be a mix of both, with favour being on the side of doglocks. Just to wrestle with semantics, Konstam does say "weapon of the bucc period," meaning the most common firearm of the time, not necessarily the weapon of choice for the buccaneers.

As to the hunt, I can't comment; my experience hunting is to approach from aisle 6 behind the dairy products, hit the meat counter and make a fast retreat thru the produce dept.

Jim Dandy, welcome a board; an' never be afraid t' speak yer mind here; its all good!

[blackjohn]

I'll throw fuel on the fire... there are alot of other types of locks available early in the period.

English locks

Snaphaunces

Wheellocks

Snaplocks(!?!?!)

And of course, if you are stealing stuff from the Spanish, you may find yourself with a Miquelet lock! Which is something I've always wanted... a miquelet escopeta!

Is this thread veering off course?

[Monterey Jack]

Aren't Engish Locks, Snaphaunces, and snaplocks all considered "flint" locks? I thought the term flintlock was a generalization and these were subcategories of vitually the same weapon (given variances in the mechanism itself).

As for veering off course; I think anything that opens up options to traditional bucanneer portrayal is a good thing!

[blackjohn]

I'm not too certain of the taxonomy of lock mechanisms, especially as seen by the professionals. I personally believe they are each distinct beasties. Sure, they are all what I like to call "rocklocks" and work off of similar principles but the mechanisms, both external and internal, often vary quite a bit from late period flintlocks.

[Capn_Enigma]

Just to wrestle with semantics, Konstam does say "weapon of the bucc period," meaning the most common firearm of the time, not necessarily the weapon of choice for the buccaneers.

To clarify this:

Jan Rogozinski writes:

The matchlock musket was the main weapon of the Caribbean buccaneers, many of whom also were hunters. To enhance accuracy, this had a smooth- bore barrel more than four feet long, it fired 60 caliber lead balls weighing an ounce. A few carried large- caliber flintlock pistols, accurate only at short distances. [..] While none of their guns were rifled, the buccaneers reportedly were expert marksmen. Exquemelin wrote that they devoted their time to "target- shooting and keeping their guns clean." They probably were better shots than untrained Spanish militiamen, who often still carried the arquebus, an earlier version of the musket. However, Spanish troops poured down accurate and deadly musket fire when Joseph Bradley assaulted the fortresses at Chagres in 1671 [in preparation for Morgan's Sack of Panama].

[blackjohn]

Eh... it really depends on what time period one is speaking of. If one is talking about early buccaneers, the availability of matchlocks makes them the obvious choice. If, on the other hand, one is addressing the types of weapons carried by Dampier & co., matchlocks would be the weapons of choice of the luddites.

I don't know how it panned out, but I remember a few years back the archaeologists working on the Whydah discovered a long item in concretion. At the time, there was some debate about it being a matchlock, and how cool it would be if it was, matchlocks being very much out of date by 1717 (though from what I understand, some were pressed into service due to lack of flintlocks during the War of the Spanish Succesion).

[Monterey Jack]

Eh... it really depends on what time period one is speaking of. If one is talking about early buccaneers, the availability of matchlocks makes them the obvious choice. If, on the other hand, one is addressing the types of weapons carried by Dampier & co., matchlocks would be the weapons of choice of the luddites.

I think this sums it up nicely, Blackjohn. The area I intend to work within is 1690 to 1720; the last straggling bit of the bucc era.

Capt Enigma, please don't take it that I'm arguing against buccs using matchlocks, that would be like saying Pirates never drank rum. My option is for a later piece still in use by the buccaneers and I'm opting for something other than a matchlock; just needed clarification of what it was and where I could find it.

[blackjohn]

Duh... my mind must be pre-occupied with moving. La Salle's ship La Belle went down in 1686 (the expedition departed France in '84). The archaeologists recovered a couple unopened crates of muskets that were intended to be used by the colonists. If memory serves, they were Tvlle flintlocks. Not doglocks, mind you, but flintlocks.

[Capn_Enigma]

The area I intend to work within is 1690 to 1720; the last straggling bit of the bucc era.

Ah! Because you mentioned the "traditional buccaneer" in your original post, i assumed that you also meant it that way.

[Capt. Bo of the WTF co.]

Thank you Blackjohn! I had lost that inormation several years ago, and I'm very happy to see that again! This is the weapon of choice for me for my boucanier representation. Tulle-ho!

[Monterey Jack]

The area I intend to work within is 1690 to 1720; the last straggling bit of the bucc era.

Ah! Because you mentioned the "traditional buccaneer" in your original post, i assumed that you also meant it that way.

Aye, that confuses a lot o people. Generally when I use the TB term I mean "as opposed to the common assumption that they were all simply GAoP pirates" I created the Traditonal Buccaneers Yahoogroup in the hopes that those folk wanting to portray the explorer/hunter/ survivor type buccaneer over the piratical one would have a place to gather. That group covers the bucc angle from about 1650 to 1715. So even though it includes the late buccaneers, it tries to cater to the "traditions" begun by the earlier ones.

In talking offline with folk, I keep finding that people attending Rendezvous, mountain man and colonial events don't always take acceptingly to us showing up as buccs; they keep assuming we're pirates. With any luck now that the list has about 35 people on it we'll start to see some bucc-related muzzle loading events created.

Thanks for the help, everyone!

[MadMike]

According to Russel Bouchard in "The Fusil de Tulle in New France", the regiment in Canada was supplied with flintlock fusils in 1660. The matchlock "mousquet" which would remain in service until at least the early 1700's among some militia.

An early contract dated 7 Nov 1696 gives the spec's for a boucanier musket with a barrel 4'4" long, caliber 18 balls to the pound, with round faced locks.

Apparently it wasn't until 1712 when the boucanier muskets were cut back to four feet and to take a socket bayonet.

Loyalist offers an early fusil, dated to the early 1690's which would be great for a pirate portrayal. Unfortunately, Loyalist stated in an e-mail that they have no plans yet to introduce a buccaneer musket.

The Rifle Shoppe offers parts for a fusil boucanier. Also, the New England Club Butt musket nears a striking resemblance to the fusil boucanier.

Yours, Mike

[Monterey Jack]

Loyalist offers an early fusil, dated to the early 1690's which would be great for a pirate portrayal. Unfortunately, Loyalist stated in an e-mail that they have no plans yet to introduce a buccaneer musket.

That's the one I'm thinking of getting; though I'm also looking at the 1717French musket from Middlesex as well. Now I just gotta find someone wjho takes AMEX!

[Patrick Hand]

Just to make things worse..... sort through some of these photos...

http://www.thm-online.dk/tidsperioder/peri...ioden1670-1699/

OK... I know they are not guns from the Carriebean..... but they are period.....

Lots of snaphenses, wheellocks.... and flintlocks...the Dog lock apears to be mostly an English variation....you gotta jump around (and I can't read any of it.....) but look at the guns......................... just keep hitting buttons to see more guns......

[blittle]

I ran across this post by accident, and thought the following might be useful to those interested in the fusil boucanier, AKA buccaneer gun:

The "buccaneer gun," called a "fusil boucanier" by the French at the time, existed from at least the mid-17th century, and quite possibly earlier, until the late 18th century, its heydey being the latter half of the 17th century through the first half of the 18th. Its origin is unconfirmed, although it may be Dutch. The gun was a long barreled, club-butted, heavy caliber flintlock hunting arm. Fusils are flintlocks, not matchlocks, and the French flintlock was a true flintlock, not a doglock, although there are buccaneer guns with doglocks still extent--the variety of barrel, lock, and furniture of buccaneer guns was apparently quite broad. ("Mousquet" in French of the period referred to a matchlock, "fusil" to a flintlock.) The version described by Exquemelin and referring to the 1660s to 1670s, and by Labat, referring to late 17th and early 18th centuries, had a barrel of four and a half feet (converted to French pouces, roughly 57 inches or so, although there were buccaneer guns with barrels longer and shorter than this), and a caliber of 16 balls to the pound. French calibers of the period are not equivalent to English calibers. To allow for windage, a French caliber of 16 balls to the pound ranges from a bore diameter of .732 inches (caliber) to .777 inches, due to the wide manufacturing tolerances of the time. The ball itself averaged .68 inches. French buccaneer guns ranged from 21 to 12 balls per pound, and perhaps even a bit larger and smaller. In the late 17th century, buccaneer guns manufactured for the French Navy were standardized at 18 balls to the pound (.689 to .732 inches). Unfortunately, although the buccaneer gun was manufactured in large numbers, it was a weapon put to much hard use, and few remain today.

As to the matchlock versus flintlock discussion, primary sources, as well as secondary sources written by experts in early firearms, agree that the flintlock was the preferred arm for warfare at sea and in the New World from the mid-17th century onward, and was quite common. This does not mean that sea rovers of the period never used matchlocks, but after circa 1650 the flintlock was the principal long arm in use among sea rovers, Native Americans, and colonists engaged in warfare in a woodland environment. Hunters always preferred the flintlock, and were some of its earliest users. Any period reference to a "buccaneer gun" is to the 17th century translation of "fusil boucanier"--a flint arm.

The Rifle Shoppe carries parts cast from an original 18th century fusil boucanier, as well as other furniture and locks suitable to buccaneer guns.

The best (and most accessible) photos and illustrations are in Bouchard's Fusil de Tulle, Gilkerson's Boarder's Away!, and Hamilton's Colonial Frontier Guns. Hamilton also discusses French calibers of the period in detail.

Hope this helps.

Benerson Little (The Sea Rover's Practice)

[blackjohn]

In your research did you ever attempt to contact the archaeologists working on the La Belle wreck to see what types of muskets they were carrying?