Jib Posted March 3, 2006 Share Posted March 3, 2006 What ever became of the Puritans? Did they drift into other sects? Any pirates claim to be Puritans? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted March 6, 2006 Share Posted March 6, 2006 It is sometimes speculated that Bartholomew Roberts' articles, with their prohibition on gambling and bringing women aboard, were Puritan-influenced. Certainly Roberts was Protestant, as he had been elected partly to ensure that a Catholic captain would not replace Howell Davis. Still, there's no real evidence that he was Puritan; his articles are equally well explained by a desire to avoid conflict amongst the crew. The Restoration of King Charles II in 1660 was the end of Puritanism's heyday. The Puritans became one of the many groups lumped together as "Dissenters" or "Nonconformists," excluded from political power or office in the Church of England. Some went to the Americas, but generally to New England, not the Caribbean, and they are better known for going into business than into piracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jib Posted March 7, 2006 Author Share Posted March 7, 2006 So I guess they are "extinct". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. Bo of the WTF co. Posted March 7, 2006 Share Posted March 7, 2006 Not extinct... sounds like the founding fathers of corporate america! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshuaRed Posted March 7, 2006 Share Posted March 7, 2006 LOL the Puritans may be long gone, but boy does their general philospy live ever-on in New England! Up there north of the Cape they still disdain outsiders & all things "flashy or glitzy", work too hard, don't play enough, and go to bed too early. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jib Posted March 9, 2006 Author Share Posted March 9, 2006 I suppose much of my knowledge comes from popular fiction and films. The concept of stern "Solomon Kane" or the Salem Witch Trials. Cotton Mather and his brethern. I suppose these are more fantastic than true images of the Puritan. I know they had some clothing requirements, but how about diet? Did they drink beer or wine? I wonder if many of them fled to the Spanish Main after the restoration? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kass Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 I don't know if they were all that fantasic, Jib. Those people were seriously severe in their beliefs. That's one of the reasons they got kicked out of England! Lemme see if I can find you some links on clothing restrictions and the like... Here you are! William Perkins on the Right, Holy and Lawful Use of Apparel (1616) Building an Empire... one prickety stitch at a time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Doctor Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 Oh, Jib, you just had to bring up Cotton Mather! Most certainly the Jerry Falwell of his age, times 10. I tried reading some of Mather's sermons, and was so utterly disgusted I had to quit. Inflamatory, sensationalist, and reckless are the nicer words that leap to mind. :) Yo ho ho! Or does nobody actually say that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshuaRed Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 If you want a fascinating read into what daily life in Puritan Boston was like, read the diaries of Samuel Sewall, pretty much covering the ENTIRE GAOP. While he did preside over the famous witch trial proceedings, he was also very repentant later in life, and publicly apologized & recanted for it. Kinda progressive for a puritan! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhand Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 The puritan based religion was alive and well, clear into the middle 19th century. The Prebyterian church's doctrain was based on the "puritan" belief and ideology. Up through the time of the American civil war, the Presbyterian church remained a bastion of stern rightiousness, mirroring the early puratin church. The puratins may well have not been in power in England after James took over, but they sure ruled NEW ENGLAND with an irion fist and will. Cotton Mather and his bretheren....whose names escape me at the moment were the hierarchy of that church, he and his brothers were responsible for more spin doctoring than anyone in modern times I can think of....more like the Tony Sopranos of their time. Mather's brother in law, John Williams and Williams' family were all taken captive during the Deerfield raid in 1704. John William's Wife and child were killed during the long winter trek to Canada. His daughter Eunice was adopted into one of the indian tribes, and spent the rest of her life married to (his name escapes me now also) I believe he was Seneca, or Wabanaki? Anyway, there's a great book called the "Unredeemed Captive" about her, and her father's unsuccessfull attempts to gain her "freedom". Another great site visit, that will give you some good insight into the culture of 1704 New England, is: http://1704.deerfield.history.museum/home.do Redhand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kass Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 Oh yeah, Redhand! They may not be prospering, but they are still around. The website from which I got that link about clothing belongs to the Covenanters. These people are STILL angry at Scottish Presbyterians for joining the Union in 1688 when William of Orange became King of England! They don't even agree with the rest of the Presbyterian Church. They are some pretty scary folk... Building an Empire... one prickety stitch at a time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhand Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 Kass- I can tell you...being a dyed in the wool Presbyterian, the the modern Presbytery resembles ab-so-lutely NOTHING to what the original doctorin was. Our church is pretty middle of the road, compared to the rest of the presbytery. The original church was pretty stern, and was TOTALLY patterned off the puritan church. In fact up to and including the American Revolution, the Presbyterian church was probably one of the most popular of religious faiths at the time. This held true pretty much up to the American Civil war, when it started to finally "loosen" up, shall we say. The Mather bros. were a scary lot....take a look at their Dogma some time....What makes me laugh is that they (the puratins) came over here to escape religious percecution...and IMMEDIATLY started percecuting the indians. Can we all say IRONY....I think we can. -Redhand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kass Posted March 9, 2006 Share Posted March 9, 2006 Oh yes. I've been reading their doctrine on various websites. The only thing good I can see is that they said slavery was unjustifiable. But wow! They were none too fond of my people (Irish Catholics) or Jews... Building an Empire... one prickety stitch at a time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capnwilliam Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 Most Americans are very Puritanical. The so-called "party animals" are generally the most so. Note the way they play HARD; look for any EXCUSE for a party; what I really love is the way they find it necessary to go through long-winded explanations as to why they got drunk: "well, you see, we'd been working so hard on this project for the past several weeks, and we NEEDED to unwind...". Reminds me of the time someone asked me if I was going to a particular celebration. I answered, "no". Upon being asked why not, I replied, "because I don't want to." Next question: "I feel guilty when I get invited to things and don't go. Don't you?" My response: "no." Can you spot the Puritan in that story? Capt. William "The fight's not over while there's a shot in the locker!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kass Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 Funny, William. That sounds like Catholics to me! Building an Empire... one prickety stitch at a time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oops Posted March 10, 2006 Share Posted March 10, 2006 I know they had some clothing requirements, but how about diet? Did they drink beer or wine? Somewhere, maybe in Alister McGrath's biography of John Calvin, I read that the average Puritan was "no ascetic" because "he found it a serious hardship to drink water when the beer ran out." I believe McGrath misinterpreted the facts. Beer was drunk not merely for fun in those days, but because it was much safer than water, which was often contaminated with cholera and God knows what else. Nevertheless, while the Puritans could be plenty ascetic about some things, they saw no shame in drinking beer in moderation. I don't know the Puritan stance on drinking wine, although I know that John Calvin, whose theology was the foundation of Puritanism, approved wine drinking in moderation. But note that "Sunday blue laws," which forbid drinking alcohol on Sundays, are a New England Puritan invention. - Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capnwilliam Posted March 11, 2006 Share Posted March 11, 2006 Funny, William. That sounds like Catholics to me! Which one? Capt. William "The fight's not over while there's a shot in the locker!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kass Posted March 11, 2006 Share Posted March 11, 2006 The guilt, the long-winded explanation (justification?) of why they got drunk... Sounds like my family! It amuses me because we all know what the Puritans thought of "Papists". Building an Empire... one prickety stitch at a time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jib Posted March 13, 2006 Author Share Posted March 13, 2006 How about witchcraft? Did the puritans take the role of zealot they are often pictured as? I know witch hunts happend in Europe well before the hunts in New England. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kass Posted March 13, 2006 Share Posted March 13, 2006 Oh that wasn't a purely Puritan thing, Jib. But there is research that suggestes that the scale of "witch hunts" isn't accurate in Europe or the Americas. Most of the time, people accused of witchcraft were just general troublemakers and "witchcraft" was a convenient excuse. You know about the Salem witch hunt being the product of group hysteria, right? No witches. Just a bunch of girls who couldn't stop lying once they'd started... Building an Empire... one prickety stitch at a time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Posted March 13, 2006 Share Posted March 13, 2006 ...and the Essex witch hunts being the product of Matthew Hopkins' greed Foxe"With this Fore-Staff he fansies he does Wonders, when, God knows, it amounts to no more but only to solve that simple Question, Where are we? Which every chi'd in London can tell you." - Ned Ward The Wooden World Dissected, 1707ETFox.co.uk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhand Posted March 13, 2006 Share Posted March 13, 2006 Kass, Jib- The New Engald witch hunts, were a mix of land and property grabs, as well as a convenient excuse to remove a disagreeable neighbor, or other "unsavory" person from the town/countryside. The catalyst for the whole thing derives not from tainted grain, but from the Native indians....or rather the puratin's fears there of. three of four of the girls in the original group that started the Salem hysteria, were refugees from the frontier. The puratins had a STRONG fear of the indians being satan's minions....well they had strong fears about LOTS of stuff in the new world. They did a lot of tranferrence of fears, to things and people around them. The Mather brothers really did an excellent job of fueling the fire with their "fears". A really good book that addresses this is called "In the Devil's Snare" ....written by a woman who's name eludes me at present. A very interesting subject tho. -Redhand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jib Posted March 14, 2006 Author Share Posted March 14, 2006 What do you think about the Ergot posioning that is rumored to have helped the witch hunts in Salem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshuaRed Posted March 14, 2006 Share Posted March 14, 2006 Does that have to do with the theory that a rogue bacteria or moldspore in their rye bread caused village-wide hysteria? Back in college my Colonial American professor was convinced that it was either this or bacteria in the water that basically had everyone straight-trippin'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhand Posted March 14, 2006 Share Posted March 14, 2006 I believe they have pretty much disproved the mold/bacterial theory, on grounds I believe that it would have been totally inedible. The lady author who wrote "In the Devil's Snare" makes a very strong argument for the "indian" theory. See my above statement. -Redhand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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