Sword question (screws lid off of Foxe's worm can)

[Daniel]

Well, here's a clue from Cane Quest.

16th century sword canes were often bequeathed in wills.  With a French ordinance issued in 1661-1666 forbidding carrying such "blades in sticks," one can assume by that time that sword canes were well into fashion.

I have no independent confirmation of this. The page refers to Kurt Stein's Canes and Walking Sticks and to Francis Monek's Canes Through the Ages, but the inadequate footnotes do not make it clear which, if either, of these sources leads to the purported wills and French ordinance.

Barring outright fraud, there is a picture of Robert Burns' sword cane at SCRAN, from when Burns was an excise inspector c. 1789, so there is at least one pre-Victorian sword cane visible on the Web.

[Daniel]

I ordered Francis Monek's Canes Through the Ages through interlibrary loan. The bad news is that it is not, as the title suggests, a history of canes, but mostly pictures of the author's cane collection. Thus there is nothing confirming the story of sword-canes in 16th-century wills or 17th-century legislation.

The good news is that, among the several dozen sword-canes Monek collected, there is one that is listed as dating from about 1730 and another (French) that is listed as dating from about 1600. If I can figure out my new digital camera, I may put pictures here.

Thus it seems probable to me that sword-canes existed during the Golden Age, though how popular they were remains debatable. That makes me breathe a sigh of relief; in my novel, set in 1716, a sword-cane features in a climactic scene.

[Daniel]

Here are some pictures. Not very clear, I'm afraid, but should give the general idea to someone who wants to describe or make one.

Caption from Monek: "Old French ivory and horn L handle sword cane wih cherub on handle, partridge wood shaft, c. 1600. 35 3/4" high.

Caption from Monek: "Bec de Corbin antler handled sword cane, c. 1730, malacca shaft, very old, etched blade, eyelets, 35 1/4" high, ferrule 3 1/4" high.

[CaptainJackRussell]

Hi at all,

about the flamed blade:

Flamed blades occur in most asian cultures, but also have been in use in Europe. The first appear in 15th century, but the most are two-handed-"warswords". For them there is (as well as for any Bidenhanders) no approval that they were really used in combat. Period drawings by Urs Graf, Hans Holbein and other drawers of that era show those swords ever as guards for officer, flags or "five and drum". If they had any use in battle the must have use it like small spears (in German called "Ahlspiess".

Flamed blades indeed have a major advantage comparing to their straight-bladed cousins. A straight blade you can grap with the bare hand, if the grip is firm enough, even if it's razor-edged. A simple very firm grip enables you to control the opponents blade or allows you a disarming action. This is not possible with a flamed or serpented blade. There the edge always can bite. Those blades have been in use until the 18th century and certainly not only used on land.

About the sword-canes: They appear in the 17th century as a assassins weapon, but they where introduced to anyone who would go out armed without letting anybody know.

The fashion of the 18th century introduced the cane as an assessoire of the gentlemens garb, replacing the small sword. But even then many opportunities occured where you must have been fighting for your life. Some used swords hidden in a cane, some trained stickfighting. Therefrom, new fighting schools where introduced, almost led by the Italians, the Germans and the Potuguese. Many of that styles survived until today like "Jogo Do Pau" from Portugal (Jogo do Pau

Keep your powder dry and keen your blade,

Jack

[Daniel]

One last post, then I promise to leave this subject alone.

I got Kurt Stein's Canes and Walking Sticks. It has two more pictures of GAoP and pre-GAoP sword canes.

One is a late 16th century German combination sword-and-gun cane. It is mahogany with an octagagonal section hilt, a blade 42.43 inches long, overall length 50.125 inches. The blade is flattened diamond section. Here's the picture.

The other is an early 18th-century sword cane. The flat hexagon section of the blade is typical of the period. The shaft is hardwood, the grip polished bone. Ferrules are brass. Here's the picture.

There's also some useful information on period sword canes.

A word about blades of the seventeenth and early eighteenth centuries.  As has been observed, these were periods during which the sword was worn as an important item of both military and civilian dress, and this undoubtedly is the reason for the great scarcity of sword canes dating from them.  Bladesmiths did less bluing than artistic etching and gilding, and after one examines only a few early blades the characteristic manner of their decorating becomes quite unmistakable.

In sum, sword canes are period, although they were considerably scarcer than they became in the nineteenth and late eighteenth centuries.

[Rumba Rue]

Rats! I was going to take pictures of the ones I have, but the batteries died in the camera. So gotta run off to the store today and get more batteries.

But I will take pictures of what I have. No the blades aren't the fancy stuff shown on that website from Africa.

I don't know about other states, but I do know that they are illegal here in Calif.

Ok, got new batteries, took pictures:

Sword cane

I tried to take one of the top, but it didn't come out very good. It's a lion's head.

top of cane

Who me? So I've used them in some sci-fi con costume contests...I'll never tell what they really are!

[Fairfax]

And, the sword cane lives on...

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/277...6p-237327c.html

Blatant thread hijacking, here.

Now I know why I no longer read the newspapers.

As several horrified churchgoers looked on, Carlson hacked into Devol's neck with his stealth weapon and nearly severed the victim's jugular vein outside Trinity Lower East Side Lutheran Church, police said.

Oy. Apparently a longish knife inside a cane is now the same as an F-117.

Useta be that you'd only read such sensationalism in things like the Weekly World News.

[Dorian Lasseter]

And, the sword cane lives on...

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/277...6p-237327c.html

Blatant thread hijacking, here.

Now I know why I no longer read the newspapers.

As several horrified churchgoers looked on, Carlson hacked into Devol's neck with his stealth weapon and nearly severed the victim's jugular vein outside Trinity Lower East Side Lutheran Church, police said.

Oy. Apparently a longish knife inside a cane is now the same as an F-117.

Useta be that you'd only read such sensationalism in things like the Weekly World News.

:angry:

I do beg you pardon.... is this your thread that was so blatantly hijacked?

No... It is not...

If you read farther back, you would see I made a suggestion that a seperate thread on swordcanes might be made...

[Rumba Rue]

sorry, I didn't know I was suppose to start a seperate thread....

[kass]

Chill out, people. Thread hyjacking isn't a hangin' offense. We're all friends here...

[Dorian Lasseter]

Aye, Just liken credit ta be given where it's due....

[Fairfax]

I do beg you pardon.... is this your thread that was so blatantly hijacked?

No... It is not...

If you read farther back, you would see I made a suggestion that a seperate thread on swordcanes might be made...

What I meant, Captain Touchy, was that I was hijacking the thread. No need to get your panties in a bunch.

[Dorian Lasseter]

Ahhhh....

There lies th' problem o' this here medium o' conversation...

Ye quoted my post, and added th' bit about blatant thread hijackin'... usually that infers yer callin' me such...

M' underclothes ain't in a bunch... I was just pointin' out what I had thought was a misunderstandin'...

Now, go ta' th' Tsuname Kate an' have a Guinness on me.... I happen ta know th' owner personally...

:)

Slainte!