BILLY BONES Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 As some of you know, I'm the armorer on POTC II & III, and I'm asking for your help. I've reenacted for 35 years, worked in a flintlock gunshop for 13, etc. etc. , but I've kind of gotten myself in a quandry. I need to wad the pistols so that they can be pulled from a belt or baldric, but they can't have any thing coming out of the barrel. I've always used styrofoam, and it generally disintegrates, but lately, I've tested it, and it's not performing as it should. I know about coco puffs, etc. but I'm dealing with every concievable calibre of pistol. I don't have time to fidget with the loads either. Something I can load into a barrel no matter what calibre. I've even used soft rubber, but actors don't need smoldering rubber coming at them, not to mention the residue produced. Things that wouldn't bother a reenactor are going to bother an actor!!! What do you think? Capt. William Bones Then he rapped on the door with a bit of stick like a handspike that he carried, and when my father appeared, called roughly for a glass of rum. This, when it was brought to him, he drank slowly, like a connoisseur, lingering on the taste, and still looking about him at the cliffs and up at our signboard. "This is a handy cove," says he, at length; " and a pleasant sittyated grog-shop. Much company, mate?" My father told him no, very little company, the more was the pity. "Well, then," said he, "this is the berth for me." Proprietor of Flags of Fortune.
Patrick Hand Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 Dang..... I can't think of anything safer than florist styrofoam.... When I was in a Gunslinger group, we'd do a demo to show how dangerous even blank charges were..... shoot a phone book, or 1/2" plywood..... (it blows an impressive hole through both)....... I guess, just not realy pointing at anyone and using styrofoam (and show how dangerous the guns are).... might be the only solution....... Sorry I couldn't be more help......
lorien_stormfeather Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 Aye, we use florist's foam in our cannon and our pistols...Rarely seen... disingrates nicely. No nasty flying flaming bits of wadding. I always tell onlookers (when we're loading or preparing charges) that it be Sea foam gathered just this mornin' by the powdermonkeys. Looking forward to trying me new pistol (Light Dragoon from Middlesex Village Traders) out this saturday at opening of Gig Harbor (WA) Fantasy Faire 10:00 am sharp! Small arms primed and ready.... One Eyed Billy Primed and ready... Le Petit Mort primed and ready... Huzzah to the Faire!
Fox Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 If POTC II and III have that f****ng Bloom person in them may I suggest wadding with lead balls. Ha! My missus won't want posters of him up then will she?! Foxe"With this Fore-Staff he fansies he does Wonders, when, God knows, it amounts to no more but only to solve that simple Question, Where are we? Which every chi'd in London can tell you." - Ned Ward The Wooden World Dissected, 1707ETFox.co.uk
Cire Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 Your missus likes Bloom? Foxe, I feel sorry for you. Because the world does revolve around me, and the universe is geocentric....
blackjohn Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 Things that wouldn't bother a reenactor are going to bother an actor!!! What do you think? I think they shouldn't be filming a pirate movie if they are such wusses... just joking... I don't like having stuff shot at me at close range either. Ok, so if your statement is true then paper is right out. Have you tried the Cream of Wheat bit? I've never tried it, but when I used to do Old West, supposedly some of the guys used it and it worked well. If it works (which it should), can I get my name in the film credits as Assistant Technical Director to the Armorer???!!!??? If that doesn't work, you can use toilet paper as wadding. It tends to blow up a whole lot better/faster than paper from a cartouche. My Home on the Web The Pirate Brethren Gallery Dreams are the glue that holds reality together.
BILLY BONES Posted August 18, 2005 Author Posted August 18, 2005 Thanks mates! I'm off to work. Capt. William Bones Then he rapped on the door with a bit of stick like a handspike that he carried, and when my father appeared, called roughly for a glass of rum. This, when it was brought to him, he drank slowly, like a connoisseur, lingering on the taste, and still looking about him at the cliffs and up at our signboard. "This is a handy cove," says he, at length; " and a pleasant sittyated grog-shop. Much company, mate?" My father told him no, very little company, the more was the pity. "Well, then," said he, "this is the berth for me." Proprietor of Flags of Fortune.
blackjohn Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 The cream of wheat trick, now that I think about it, must've been done with 6-shooters and capped off with crisco. I don't think cream of wheat will hold in place any better than blackpowder without wadding. Let us know how it turns out. Have fun!!! My Home on the Web The Pirate Brethren Gallery Dreams are the glue that holds reality together.
Dorian Lasseter Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 Well, it's a wee bit more expensive than cereal or foam..... try magicians Flash Paper..... It burns up very fast, leaves no noticeable ash, and adds to the flame of the powder... I've used it with much success.... Truly, D. Lasseter Captain, The Lucy Propria Virtute Audax --- In Hoc Signo Vinces Ni Feidir An Dubh A Chur Ina Bhan Air "If I whet my glittering sword, and mine hand take hold on judgment; I will render vengeance to mine enemies, and will reward them that hate me." Deuteronomy 32:41 Envy and its evil twin - It crept in bed with slander - Idiots they gave advice - But Sloth it gave no answer - Anger kills the human soul - With butter tales of Lust - While Pavlov's Dogs keep chewin' - On the legs they never trust... The Seven Deadly Sins http://www.colonialnavy.org
MadMike Posted August 18, 2005 Posted August 18, 2005 Hope the weapons are all period! I've always used 100 percent cotton cloth in about a two inch square patch (for pistols and rifles). After loading a powder charge, the patch was placed in the mouth as a "spit patch" just soaking it (not drenched with saliva). This will prevent the patch from smoldering and catching fire. I've left them in the bore for 15-20 minutes with only minor effects on the powder (being hygroscopic). Larger bore, larger patch. Never point a firearm at anyone, even with a blank. Yours, &c. Mike Try these for starters- "A General History of the Pyrates" edited by Manuel Schonhorn, "Captured by Pirates" by John Richard Stephens, and "The Buccaneers of America" by Alexander Exquemelin.
Tall Paul Posted August 23, 2005 Posted August 23, 2005 I was going to suggest using magicians flash cotton. it is chemically identical to flash paper, but it has a texture similar to cotton wool, which would make it offer a better plug than flash paper. It burns instantly and leaves no residue beyond a small oily smear. On the down side, it is HIGHLY volatile, in a hot dry climate there is a very small chance that it could spontaneously ignite, setting off the charge. You could spray it with a little water before putting it in the barrel, the heat of the charge would dry it out enough for it to ignite before it left the barrel. (I would try a few test shots first) I am sure that I recently read an article about filming in America, that stated that after a number of infamous and fatal accidents on film sets (The Crow for example) it is now illegal to set up a film shot where a gun is pointing directly at another person, and that camera angles and reverse shots should be used instead. But then again, if they are filming outside the USA.................. Incidentally, did you know that the reason that the props assistant was loading the guns on the Crow the day that Brandon Lee died, instead of the armourer, was that the armourer had been sent home early to save money!! Cpt "Tall Paul" Adams Colchester Historical Enactment Society (C.H.E.S.)
Longarm Posted August 28, 2005 Posted August 28, 2005 A few years back I watched a cannon drill here at Charlestown Landing where they used several layers of pantyhose to make the cartridge. When asked why I was told that it burns completly when fired with no residue or discharge, and it was very cheap and easy to find. When the cannon was fired over the pond only fire and smoke came out, nothing hit the water. The man giving the demo was also one of the park rangers, so he had the saftey of the park in mind. I love the smell of gunpowder in the morning. To me it smells like....PIRACY!
Francois Posted August 28, 2005 Posted August 28, 2005 I would have to agree with Dorian. I have tried Flash paper myself and it works fine. Just make sure you know how to store it and handle it with the use of black powder. You can also use small wads of thin tissue paper it will burn up just as fast. Francois By the way Dorian we missed you at pennsic this year. I brought my cutlass's with me this year to do some off site live steel fighting with you. That of which we talked of last year. I am a Free Men of The Sea I don't pillage and plunder.I covertly acquire!François Viete Domont de la PalmierI haven't been accused of Pyracy...............YET
Captain_MacNamara Posted August 29, 2005 Posted August 29, 2005 I tried the florists foam with 30 grains of black powder in my flintlock... I shot it into a bucket to see how much debris would be left, and naught but burnt powdery residue could be found... it works beautifully, at least with my pistol. Haven't tried it in the cannon yet. I imagine it wouldn't work that well with pyrodex, however... Pyrodex has to have a tightly packed wad to contain the pressure enough to make any noise other than "foof". Another reason I vote for using real black powder over pyrodex now... pyrodex has it's uses for effects/pyrotechnics, but I won't be usin' it in my 'locks anymore... Captain of the Iron Lotus It is the angle that holds the rope, not the size of the hole.
callenish gunner Posted September 3, 2005 Posted September 3, 2005 billy i have always gone the flash paper route myself ... a good wad of it on top of the powder and the sound and flash are both believeable ....i did a bunch of instruction films for the bicentenial 30 years ago and we found that to be the safest method for close combat scenes...keep the loads light for close range firing ....the concussion can still cause injury or even death at POINT BLANK RSNGE!!!! ......and if the sound needs boosting for the film they'll fix that with the foley artist
the Royaliste Posted September 4, 2005 Posted September 4, 2005 :) Oooooohhh-Kaaaay, so...you get my Bloody two Maravedis worth,also!......We aren't 'in the movie business', but in 'liability crazy, United States Coast Guard up my arse-California', I rekon I shoot darn near as much gunpowder as anyone, and it goes like this. My decks are close quartered to say the least, and then add children and citizens...Whether it be carronades, blunderbuss', long rifles, pistols, or grenado's, the drill is the same aboard the Royaliste. All charges are pre-made in extremely thin paper, (read 'coffee filter 'or thinner, like tissue). Rolled on various diameter tube, then folded, glued, or taped. Powder added. Charge placed in whatever style weapon in use..rammed tightly home, no other wadding, stuffing, foam, nor anything remotely possible to be construed as a 'projectile'. Never a trace, nor a problem, and we've used 150 pounds this month. The tightness of the compressed powder is sufficient, and since it was prewrapped, no wad necessary. Try it or not, but it keeps the safety issue completely out of our piratical lives.......
Black Hearted Pearl Posted September 4, 2005 Posted September 4, 2005 Taken notes, Captain. I imagine it will be on the test. ~Black Hearted Pearl The optimist expects the wind. The pessimist complains about the wind. The realist adjusts the sails.
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