earings, sashes.... now STRIPEY Trousers?

[Gentleman of Fortune]

Ok, I know that striped clothes existed before the golden age.... and that sailors wore them AFTER the golden age.

Were stripey slops/trousers/stockings in vogue during 1690-1720?

Help me here Foxe!

[JoshuaRed]

I certainly hope so, GOF, as our Pirate Brethren seems fond of 'em! Me, I prefer the plain ones.

[Fox]

Like you say, loads of evidence before (patterned fabric remains from the Mary Rose for example), loads of evidence after (contemporary engraving of John Paul Jones springs to mind).

Off the top of my head: In 1736 Thomas Powell recorded that he had lost "one pair of thin canvas trowsers, one pair of blew and white striped cotton ditto". John Hutchinson in 1684 bequeathed "two wastecoates, one blue, one coloured"; I'm not sure what "coloured" means but it may mean multi-coloured or patterned. He also left "one paire woollen drawers white and red"

Diversifying a bit from stripes to other patterns. The possessions of James Bearcroft, sold at the mast in 1750 (a bit late I know, but it's on top of a big pile of paper on my desk...) after his death included 3 chequered shirts and 8 white ones, which I think shows a significant proportion.

Slightly earlier, this 1693 picture shows chequered aprons (or possibly petticoat breeches)

I think on the whole it's fairly safe to say that patterned fabrics are authentic for seamen of the golden age.

[corsair2k3]

Aren't those kilts?

The Corsairs asks, innocently.

[TabithaAnne]

From what I know the pants had a large stipe horizontal across the leg but nothing or no one I have talked to or read says anything about the black and white vertical striped pants. I have NO idea where pirates and stripes came....wish I did know though. I think it's just another one of those faire things like bells and fox tails.

[JoshuaRed]

Could be from 19th Century plays like Pirates of Penzance. Stripes would show up well on stage.

[Fox]

*bangs head on desk* I think I have clearly shown from period sources that stripes and checks considerably pre-date the 19th century and ren-faires. If it's just a case of showing that stripes are older than Pirates of Penzance then there's a million sources! (OK, maybe not a million, but pretty close)

Corsair, I wondered at first if they might be kilts but I have come to the conclusion that they are not, for the following reasons:

a: the men portrayed are supposed to be seamen, and though there were plenty of Scottish seamen the majority of them were lowlanders who probably wouldn't have worn kilts.

b: the philabeg or "little kilt", which they look like, did not come into prominence until considerably later. If they were meant to be portrayed in kilts in 1693 they would probably be wearing full plaids.

c: they're English, not Scottish.

So, all in all I think it's pretty safe to say they're not kilts - they're the wrong people from the wrong place in the wrong time to be wearing kilts. I thus believe them to be either petticoat breeches or aprons.

[dasNdanger]

NOOOOObody panic!! (sheesh, I must be driving you mad!!)

Here's linkage to the type of pants I'm referring to - this picture, supposedly - is from 1718...but I can't confirm that date.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v54/dasN...anger/monks.jpg

Hope that helps...

das

[blackjohn]

I have a neat little book with the name The Devil's Cloth. It's a brief history of striped cloth and clothes. Can't say that I've read it though...

Btw, anyone here familiar with "the fan"??? In Williamsburg, there is a fan dating to the early 1700s. One of the figures on the fan is what appears to be a sailor wearing striped trousers.

[corsair2k3]

The date's wrong--this artwork is from THE PIRATE'S OWN BOOK by Chas Ellms.

19th-century.

The Corsair

[blackjohn]

Oh... and there is another figure who may be a sailor wearing striped stockings...

[JoshuaRed]

*bangs head on desk*  I think I have clearly shown from period sources that stripes and checks considerably pre-date the 19th century and ren-faires. If it's just a case of showing that stripes are older than Pirates of Penzance then there's a million sources! (OK, maybe not a million, but pretty close)

Agh -chill Foxe! I am very very well aware of the existence of stripes in the 17th/18th century. I only mentioned the 19th century plays/books because it was there that our modern pirate mythology was born, along with Stevenson's and Pyle's stuff. It was in this time that tiny details that may have once been true, things like eyepatches, earrings, sashes, stripes, peglegs, etc, were exaggerated and stylized into the archetype gypsy-esque pirate we know today. It's like the modern stereotype is a copy of a copy of a copy of the original, and each copy gets further from the truth. That's what I was getting at.

[Fox]

Just to throw a few more sources for striped trousers on GAoP period seafarers (and thus by extrapolation pirates) at you all:

The armorial arms granted to Admiral Herbert, Earl of Torrington in 1689 include "two sailors...with white trousers striped gules (red)", or according to a different source "wide breeches argent (white) double striped crosswise crimson" The second description being a fairly good one of the petticoat breeches in the picture I posted above.

The 1706 slop specifications for the RN includes "Striped shag breeches" and "Shirts of blew and white chequer'd linen". A second contract of the same year also specifies "Strip'd ticken wast coats" and "Strip'd ticken breeches." These specifications remained more or less the same for some years, at least until the end of the GAoP.

In 1725 the slop contractor to the Navy, William Franklin, wrote complaining that the captain of HM Sloop Happy had taken aboard his own slops instead of Franklin's regulation clothing. The letter gives us a good idea of the prevalence of striped breeches for he lists the clothes he tried to send to the Happy, which included 6 pairs of kersey breeches (in plain red), 8 chequered shirts, 36 pairs of trousers (canvas), 60 ticking waistcoats and 60 pairs of ticking breeches.

Slop regulations and Franklin letter are quoted in Mariner's Mirror volume 10, pp 31-39

[hurricane]

Thanks Foxe for the research. I found it very enlightening. I am humored that someone would think that red and white and blue and white would be in one's mind for pirates, but not black and white... wasn't black a fairly common dye color, especially compared to reds or blues? Is there anything to say otherwise?

And while I understand that a peglegged pirate with an earring is a little cliche, how is a re-enactor who actually has lost his leg supposed to portray a pirate without being stereotyped by others? I'm sure some pirate must have had a prosthetic leg along the way, particularly because of the state of warfare then. Such is the quandry here... :)

-- Hurricane

[Fancy]

What of Calico Jack? Wasn't he called so, because of his colorful striped clothing?

[Hawkyns]

Hurricane- black is a difficult colour and hard to justify. First, it was an expensive dye in period, and not readily available. Second, black dyes using period materials are very difficult to set and fade very quickly. Depending on the bases of the dyes, they will fade to purplish red or brown, or grey, or even yellow with just a few weeks in strong sunlight. Modern anniline dyes are far too strong and colour fast in comparison to period dyes. True black wool, woven from the fleece of black sheep, is even a bit browner than pure black, and rare at that.

Striped fabric- I have no problem with striped fabric, my concern is more with the width of the stripes. Rather than the 1 inch stripe so beloved of pirate costumes, I believe it is more the thin stripe of pillow ticking. That is a common weave through the entire period and a cheap fabric at that.

Hawkyns

[Hawkyns]

For period descriptions of clothing, style and dress of the lower sort in the 18th century, try this:

http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/subjects/runaways/

This is invaluable and in constant use among the 18th C hardcore folks. Also, as you read down you will find several of them stole boats and have some maritime connections.

Hawkyns

[Fox]

I am humored that someone would think that red and white and blue and white would be in one's mind for pirates, but not black and white...

Firstly, would you be kind enough to point out where I suggested that black wouldn't be worn by pirates?

Secondly, why should pirates wear black? Do bank robbers have a uniform (apart from the obvious mask, stripey shirt and bag marked "swag")? At the end of the day pirates were just seamen on the wrong side of the law. Many of them had careers lasting a matter of months, sometimes even just weeks, you think they thought "OK, so I'm a pirate now, I'll throw out all my clothes and get some nice new black ones so I look the part"?

wasn't black a fairly common dye color, especially compared to reds or blues? Is there anything to say otherwise?

You mean apart from, for example, the slop specifications posted above which list both red and blue but not black? Or the relative expense of black compared to other colours, or the numerous other examples?

Seriously, no. Black was not a common dye colour, particularly when compared to reds and blues and other such colours. Even the fabric that is described as black was probably just a very dark grey rather than jet black in many cases because of the enormous expense of getting a true black dye.

Any costume experts wanna come in on this one?

I am quite definitely humoured that someone genuinely thinks pirates had their very own fashion code

And while I understand that a peglegged pirate with an earring is a little cliche, how is a re-enactor who actually has lost his leg supposed to portray a pirate without being stereotyped by others? I'm sure some pirate must have had a prosthetic leg along the way, particularly because of the state of warfare then.

Yeah, like the guy in Edward England's crew with the wooden leg. What Josh was saying was that while these things may have some basis in truth they have been wildly exaggerated. I'm sure any re-enactor who had genuinely lost his leg and wore a wooden leg would be welcomed with open arms by any group. However, this is not a thread about wooden legs so I'm not going to go any further.

What of Calico Jack? Wasn't he called so, because of his colorful striped clothing?

There's quite a good thread elsewhere about calico in the GAoP, it was probably coloured but not necessarily stripey. Course, Hurricane will probably tell us it must have been coloured black because pirates didn't wear red or blue...

[hurricane]

Thanks all! That's very interesting about black since it has so often been associated with pirates (albiet, incorrectly). This is very helpful information and I appreciate the historical perspective. Very educational and helpful in developing appropriate gear.

Hurricane

[Fox]

No problem Hurricane, that's what this forum's for .

I can't actually think of any pirate historically speaking who was particularly associated with black - unless you count Teach's beard.

The privateer George Shelvocke (who was a bit of a pirate really) had a black suit at the start of his voyage to the south seas, but it's not like people say "oh yeah, Shelvocke, he's the guy in black..."

When Davis wanted to hoist a black flag the best he had available to him was a dirty tarry tarpaulin.

Anyway, back to stripes

[Patrick Hand]

after his death included 3 chequered shirts and 8 white ones, which I think shows a significant proportion.

OK... not quite stripes......

But has anyone else noticed how few checkered shirts are worn by pyrate reenactors? Lots of white and black (quickly ducks) but not many checkered.

I do like the reference to

60 ticking waistcoats

I wanted to make a waistcoat.... but wool under wool..... would get a bit to hot.... ticking might work very well........

[lorien_stormfeather]

Regarding Black dye: From my reading black dye was costly and not likely to be used, I think for common sailor's clothes. If it started out black the color would have faded to grey-blue in usage anyway.

Someone else on the board mentioned the little book "The Devil's Cloth: a history of stripes and striped fabric" by Michel Pastoureau. Columbia University Press, 1991, ISBN 0-231-12366-3

Intriguing book about the history of striped cloth and its historic use to designate heretics, bastards, prisoners, prostitutes, servants, jugglers, executioners, those on the fringes of social order and later revolutionaries.

Seems some Carmelite monks came back to France from a crusade wearing striped robes from the Middle East and set off a 50-year battle with the Vatican. The medieval mind was sorely offended by the loud design and the idea of the juxtaposition of two colors in repeat pattern. "Barres" were added to the coat of arms of illegitimate sons.

By the mid-seventeenth century the horizontal sailor’s stripe appears as red and white or blue and white. By the end of the 18th Century, the common seaman wore a knit striped jersey, distinguishing him from the officers. In the French Navy an officer promoted through the ranks rather than Naval School was called a “zebra”.

Spinnakers are striped because the design makes the ship seem like it is moving faster than a plain sail.

Then we have the "insurrection" stripes of both the French and the American revolutions and flags. By 1775 the stripe of the uprisings for liberty became popular among the gentry and considered romantic and the "American stripe " became popular in Europe.

The author doesn't specifically mention pirates, but when pirates were romanticized in the 19th Century. They were shown wearing fashionable and flamboyant striped garments, of course.

Time to sew that striped petticoat I was pondering....

[Gentleman of Fortune]

OK... stripes

Apparently the 1706 Admiralty contract called for (among other things)

Strip’d Ticken Wast Coats of proper lengthes, to be one Yard in length at least, with Eighteen Black Buttons, the Holes Stitched with Black Thread lined with White linen and two White Linnen Pockets, at the Rate of Seven Shillings each.

Strip’d Ticken Breeches of proper lengthes, lined with white linen, and two linen Pockets, with Sixteen Black Buttons, the Button Holes stich’d with Black Thread, at the rate of five Shillings each

Strip’d Shagg Breeches lin’d with Linnen, with three Leather Pockets, and fourteen white Tinn Buttons, the Button Holes stich’d with white Thread, at the Rate of Tenn Shillings and Sixpence each

So it seems that striped trousers (if made from Linen ticking or duffel/shagg wool cloth) AND waistcoats are appropriate for our time frame... or at least post 1706.

GoF

[Fox]

Actually, if working from the Admiralty slop contracts it can be pushed a little further back, the 1702 contract specifies "Striped suits lined

with canvas" amongst other things.

I think, given that we have written evidence of patterned fabrics from at least 1689 (Torrington's arms) and pictoral from at least 1693 (The England's Safety frontispiece), plus the slop contracts evidence from 1702 onwards it's probably fair to conclude that patterned fabric, checks and stripes, would be authentic for the GAoP.

In fact the evidence for patterned fabrics stretches way back either side. Checkered and striped fabric remnants were found on the Mary Rose (1545), and San Juan (c.1565) shipwrecks, and pictures of seamen in striped clothing can be found right through the 18th century and well into the 19th at least.

[the Royaliste]

Spinnakers are striped because the design makes the ship seem like it is moving faster than a plain sail.

Hmmmm, after watching a race near the St. Francis Yacht Club Sunday, this 'fact' seems in doubt to me.. Many beautiful spinnakers, but not a striped one in sight; they all must have wanted to seem as though they were going slow