hengishammer Posted January 13, 2005 Posted January 13, 2005 How did pirates start fires if matches weren't invented back then? Did they use a flint striking tool or some other method ? I need pictures if anyone can point me in the right direction! Thanks!
Captain_MacNamara Posted January 13, 2005 Posted January 13, 2005 easy, they just fired a "blank" powder charge from a blunderbuss at whatever they wanted to catch fire! Seriously though, I dunno... probably flint and steel. Anyone else care to take a crack at this one? Captain of the Iron Lotus It is the angle that holds the rope, not the size of the hole.
Diego Santana de la Vega Posted January 13, 2005 Posted January 13, 2005 Striking matches were invented but not called matches in 1827. Matches were first called "congreves" and sold as "lucifers" but then problems with formulas for useful success and changing chemicals in the make up and it wasn't till 1844 they were patented as the "safety match" The predessor of "our today match" was: small sticks of pinewood impregnated with sulfur, struck on stone and was developed in China in the 6th century AD. Love begins with a smile, grows with a kiss, and ends with a knife in your back.
Coastie04 Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 I'd imagine that for many ships, especially the larger ones, fire would be transfered more than started. There would be at least a lantern or galley stove with enough embers to light something else. This is just speculation on my part, and I can't back it up with hard evidence, but I'd imagine that using flint and steel below deck would be rather dangerous, as the sparks can occasionally go flying off in unpredictable directions, and using the aforementioned method above deck would be rather difficult when there was a good wind blowing. Coastie She was bigger and faster when under full sail With a gale on the beam and the seas o'er the rail
Cap'n Pete Straw Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Most common methods: -- Rubbing wood together (not broke -- don't fix it) -- Flint and steel (absolutely most common method) -- Fire-starter pistol (Dixie Gunworks carries one -- it's a flintlock designed specifically to ignite an amount of tinder) -- Magnifying lens (the ability to concentrate the sun's rays and start fire is what makes this a truly indespensible tool) -- In the 1800s, the Promethean Match. This is such a cool invention, that I must quote part of "The Story of Matches" web page.... "In 1828 ...Samuel Jones, a chemist of London.... invented what he called the Promethean Match. This consisted of a tiny glass vessel, which had a minute portion of sulphuric acid inside, which was enclosed in a small quantity of chlorate of potash, the whole being sealed up in the end of a paper spill. When the head was crushed between the jaws of a small pair of pliers, which was sold with every box, the liberated acid immediately caused the potash to ignite." ...Stories have it that real tough guys would show off their cajones by BITING the match to break the glass phial, which was an extremely hazardous thing to do. "He's a Pirate dancer, He dances for money, Any old dollar will do... "He's a pirate dancer, His dances are funny... 'Cuz he's only got one shoe! Ahhrrr!"
Patrick Hand Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Awh come on...... back then if you wanted to start a fire...... flint and steal.... If you wanna try it for yourself...... check out any blackpowder shop..... (or search the web...) And it is realy easy to do... hit your flint with the steal.... catch the sparks on your char.... blow gently... and make fire....... matches... lusifers.... and all the other fire making stiff was for the rich.... flint and steal was the common way to do it.....
hengishammer Posted January 14, 2005 Author Posted January 14, 2005 Thanks for the many responses chaps! The reason why Im asking is because we are making a mod for Halflife 2 called Pirates, Vikings & Knights 2. www.pvkii.com Theres a character on the pirate team who runs around and drops a keg of blackpowder to explode as one of his weapons. The thing is, would he carry a flint device to light the keg or would he just shoot the bloody thing to make it explode? Matches werent around during the golden age of pirates, thats why I want to seek an alternative. It would need to be something portable. Any input on this? I appreciate all the info
the Royaliste Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Gunpowder and grenadoes were usually ignited with slow match.........
Rumba Rue Posted January 14, 2005 Posted January 14, 2005 Well ye see, ye had ta feeds the crew lots o' beans ta start off with. Then went the gas starts escapin' ye holds yer wick with blackpowder coverin' it, and boom! Either way, ye lit a fire. Rumba Rue ** **
Patrick Hand Posted January 16, 2005 Posted January 16, 2005 would he carry a flint device to light the keg or would he just shoot the bloody thing to make it explode? In that case, slowmatch would work the best..... (slowmatch is basicly prepaired cotton rope ) with one or both ends burning..... In a hurry, they could fire a flintlock very close to the powder... but if they "touch off" to much..... they will get a nasty burn as the powder flairs..... Thats why gunners uesd a linstock... (a stick to hold the slowmatch....) I've read about using a barrel of powder and a slowmatch to ignight it as an impromptu granade....to slow down boarding partys... timing of the whole thing could get tricky.........
Cap'n Pete Straw Posted January 16, 2005 Posted January 16, 2005 If it was setting off a line of gunpowder... Assuming the pirate in question has a flintlock at the ready (and we already KNOW that there is a surplus of gunpowder available), it's the simplest means-at-hand. He simply adds some powder to his frizzen pan, shoves a little down the barrel, aims the barrel at the line of powder, pulls the trigger, and crack - kapow - sizzle.... BOOM! "He's a Pirate dancer, He dances for money, Any old dollar will do... "He's a pirate dancer, His dances are funny... 'Cuz he's only got one shoe! Ahhrrr!"
hengishammer Posted January 17, 2005 Author Posted January 17, 2005 Thanks guys! The last 2 posts were particularly helpful:) I think we will go with the last suggestion:) Something quick that could light a keg without carrying around a slowmatch. Check us out form time to time! www.pvkii.com
the Royaliste Posted January 17, 2005 Posted January 17, 2005 Thanks guys! The last 2 posts were particularly helpful:)I think we will go with the last suggestion:) Something quick that could light a keg without carrying around a slowmatch. Check us out form time to time! www.pvkii.com Interesting that you choose the most non-factual method.....We've tried this many a time, and it is totally unreliable in comparison to a linstock; the power of the charged pistol usually casts the powder trail to the winds, seldom produces results, and usually burns or injures the enabler... altho it looks good in the movies...who cares of authenticity in a video game anyhoo, eh?
hengishammer Posted January 17, 2005 Author Posted January 17, 2005 Well, you have to consider --yes it is a video game. But we are trying to be as real as possible within reasonable limits. I just dont see how a pirate would run around Lugging a Keg of Powder on his back with a lit slowmatch in one hand, juggling his cutlass, and flintlocks. Where does he stick the lit slowmatch while wielding his cutlass? Its on fire! For practical purposes it would suit us just to have the pirate fire at the fuse in order to get it lit for a slow--timed light. alternatively, he can just shoot the keg and have it explode immediately.
Captain_MacNamara Posted January 17, 2005 Posted January 17, 2005 Blackbeard braided his into his beard, to make him appear more menacing... but it could be used to ignite explosives too. There was also a character in Pirates of the Carribbean that lit grenadoes from slowmatch burning in his beard. Jacoby? I think was his name. Captain of the Iron Lotus It is the angle that holds the rope, not the size of the hole.
the Royaliste Posted January 17, 2005 Posted January 17, 2005 , he can just shoot the keg and have it explode immediately. Well, the 'Blackbeard stlye' would be cute, but again, your choice is impossible, black powder needs spark or fire to explode, contact from a round ball just won't do, eh wot??
Cascabel Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 Ye can see meself and Ravan igniting the pig at Pirates in Paradise after it was doused with rum using the flash from the pans on our flintlock blunderbusses in the photo gallery: https://pyracy.com/gallery/details.php?...550&mode=search >>>>>>> Cascabel
Black Hearted Pearl Posted January 18, 2005 Posted January 18, 2005 Let me preface by saying I have no experience with blackpowder..... Correct me if I am wrong, but the linstock is "smoldering" and not a flame. Therefore, tucking a lit linstock into a strap tied around your boot would be the most effective means of "carrying" a lit linstock. As long as the person remembered it was there and didn't let time run out of linstock. You might have up to an hour with a lit linstock tucked in your boot. Of course, this is all speculation on my part and I am probably totally out on a plank with this idea. ~Black Hearted Pearl The optimist expects the wind. The pessimist complains about the wind. The realist adjusts the sails.
Patrick Hand Posted January 19, 2005 Posted January 19, 2005 Black Hearted Pearl..... What you are thinking of is the slowmatch.... slowmatch is treated rope that one or both ends are lit, and it slowly burns (but not a flame...) the glowing (burning) end is used to ignight a matchlock or a cannon.... The linstock (basicly a stick) is what is used to hold the slowmatch so you don't burn your hand when the powder ignights......
the Royaliste Posted January 19, 2005 Posted January 19, 2005 Found this whilst ebay surfin'..with provenance, the difinitive answer on lighting grenades, etc...'grenedier's light' For sale is this Rev War grenade lighter originally worn on the grenadier's cross-belt to light grenades for throwing. It remained in position after they were converted back to full duties with the musket as a mark of tradition and recognition. A removable wooden handle held a smoldering match rope which had it's reserve length passing through the center hole. When one considers there is no actual picture of it in the book and the ratio of grenadier soldiers to that of a normal soldier it dosn't take long to figure out how rare these must be. As in all my other auctions, this piece is guarenteed authentic. Please view my other auctions.
Patrick Hand Posted January 20, 2005 Posted January 20, 2005 WOW.... THAT IS COOL......!!!!!!!!!! When I went to rendezvous, I use to carry a "New Mexican tinder tube" for using when using flint and steal to start a fire...... there are some Major difference between the two .... but some simularitys.........(OK I can't spell) I'M GOING TO HAVE TO MAKE ONE OF THOSE......... (OK done with dancing about in front of the pewter).... that picture gives me all of the info I need to make one..... coool coool cool.... (I will post this .... then finish the "happy dance" without continuing to bother anyone else..... ) Sorry for being so silly..... but there are times when I see something.... and there is that "spark" ....... inspiration... whatever......... Thanks for shairing that Captain.....
JoeJacks Posted January 20, 2005 Posted January 20, 2005 Here is something I ran across a while back and upon reading this thread said "Hey I seen one a those." Jus in case yer intrested. Seven Years War Matchcase
Patrick Hand Posted January 21, 2005 Posted January 21, 2005 ... But I can carve wood eaiser than solderin tin to make one...... but thanks for the link......
dasNdanger Posted February 9, 2005 Posted February 9, 2005 As I hear it, they just rubbed two wenches together and went from there... *crawls back under rock to avoid grenades* das http://www.ajmeerwald.org/
Patrick Hand Posted February 24, 2005 Posted February 24, 2005 Well I made a quick version of the match case..... carved it outta pine just to see how it worked..... 1. I made it about the same lenght as the photo..... but the slowmatch burns to fast, and you have to keep poking in forward (I used untreated 100% cotton cord ) 2. next one will be longer.... 3. The slowmatch burned OK, but I think the holes should be a little bigger for a little more air. it would get too much "char" on the ends (this may be because I was using untreated slowmatch...) 4. I didn't add the atachments (the two rings and pin to hold it on).... the next one will have them... 5. Not sure If I want to wear it on the middle my baldrick..... the smoke from the burings slowmatch .... gets in your eyes..... maybe lower and slightly out of the way, but accesable...... AAAh.... the joys of reconstructive archology.........
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