Do you think there were churches in Tortuga?

[Elena]

My logic half says yes, half says no.

Half no that in a pirate paradise and perdition athmosphere.. well... a church...

Half yes because in Cayonne there were planters too, and they might have built one and brought a priest.

But I honestly have no idea... Looking for opinions

[William Brand]

Yes. In two separate drawings of the late 17th century a church is depicted in Fort du Rocher, which is not surprising, given the very Catholic nature of the French. I have seen other drawings of the island depicting buildings mounted with crosses, though I do not know the names of the churches or monasteries depicted. Since both the Spanish and French occupied the island more than once and sometimes at the same time, there would have to be churches. It's harder to find a Spanish or French settled island without one church and as many as a dozen.

Both of these 17th century maps of Tortuga below show the same two primary locations, utilizing the most basic emblems for maps of the period. A fort (or whole community built around a fort) is depicted as a building with a large standard or flag flying from the roof. As period flags were often square, this just looks like a square flying from the peak of the roof. A church or monastery (or a community built around the same) will have a building affixed with a cross.

Maps from the mid 16th century into the late 18th century use these two basic emblems all of the time.

[Mission]

We should always be cautious of viewing period behavior using a modern lens. A lot of this stuff about the pirates being non-religious or socialist or egalitarian or whatever other modern group behavior people want to assign to pirates seems to come from those who haven't researched the period very well but want to prove modern paradigms using pirates as an historical example. Pirates were men of their times and religion was still a central feature of life during the GAoP.

[Elena]

Thank you very much. So at least in Fort Rocher, but possible in Cayonne and Basse Terre, there were churches.

And do you know how much I was searching for this map of a proper dimension? Thank you! I had seen it, but as small as... an avatar, maybe.

Edited September 26, 2011 by Elena

[michaelsbagley]

Also keep in mind Tortuga (and others) may have been pirate friendly ports... but they were port towns first, pirate friendly locales second. Most if not all towns of the period would have churches. Even if it happened to be a port town, and even if it was a pirate friendly port town.

[Elena]

Michael, this was what I was saying too in my first post, that " Cayonne there were planters too, and they might have built one and brought a priest". And this was exactly why I was of two opinions, conflicted.

[Swashbuckler 1700]

We should always be cautious of viewing period behavior using a modern lens. A lot of this stuff about the pirates being non-religious or socialist or egalitarian or whatever other modern group behavior people want to assign to pirates seems to come from those who haven't researched the period very well but want to prove modern paradigms using pirates as an historical example. Pirates were men of their times and religion was still a central feature of life during the GAoP.

Still Woodes Rogers brought religious scriptures ( what ever) with him to New Providence to educate pirates. I think that pirates believed odd suff and were indeed more religious than "we" would imagine. Merry life was the most important thing like David Gordingly wrote " ( the men) who preferred bombo to bible"

[Jib]

Did not Port Royal have multiple churches of different denominations?

[Swashbuckler 1700]

Did not Port Royal have multiple churches of different denominations?

Certainly there was but it seems that they were not in too great use and according to this documentary( and finds from sunken city) there were even Jewish Synagogue Here is good documentary that will give food for thought

btw pirates ( if my memory serves me right) articles were swore with bible....

see around 5.45 in the vid

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=850J9tYPd28

Edited April 15, 2012 by Swashbuckler 1700

[Mission]

Père Labat gives an account of French pirates attending mass and even bringing a priest on board their ship to perform it. (During the ceremony, the captain shot one of the pirates for blasphemy.)

There are some other threads on religion that would be worth looking into if the topic interests you.

Religion on Pirate Ships

Papist Pyrates

Religion During the GAoP

Christianity in the Caribbean

Puritans

[Swashbuckler 1700]

Père Labat gives an account of French pirates attending mass and even bringing a priest on board their ship to perform it. (During the ceremony, the captain shot one of the pirates for blasphemy.)

There are some other threads on religion that would be worth looking into if the topic interests you.

Religion on Pirate Ships

Papist Pyrates

Religion During the GAoP

Christianity in the Caribbean

Puritans

Interesting. I think (since they were french in labat's time) they were quite surely buccaneers/ filibustiers which often were privateers. But indeed pirates were little more religious than is often remenbered. Like Bart Roberts who was true believer but extremely hypocritical ( cutting ears and noses or nailing men to the masts does not go well with many doctrines of the Bible....)

[Mission]

To be a human is to be a hypocrite.

[Fox]

( cutting ears and noses or nailing men to the masts does not go well with many doctrines of the Bible....)

I dunno, sounds very Old Testament to me!

[Swashbuckler 1700]

( cutting ears and noses or nailing men to the masts does not go well with many doctrines of the Bible....)

I dunno, sounds very Old Testament to me!

Indeed I take that back... That also reminds me of the code of Hammurabi as well as new testament ( especially that nailing).... they are not very happy writings att all and they represent their writing time which was cruel.

Edited April 15, 2012 by Swashbuckler 1700