Pirates' effects, 1722

[Fox]

Pierce Cullen wasn't yer classic Caribbean pirate, but he was a genuine pirate in 1722. His leather portmanteau contained:

"5 white shirts marked P.B.C.

1 white shirt marked C.

1 napkin marked C.A. 1714

1 napkin marked w.j.

1 white shirt

5 blew and white shirts

1 old frise coat

1 worsted damask wastcoat and serge damask breeches

1 pair of silk damask breeches

2 flannell wastcoats

2 bob wigs

1 pair of sleeved

1 pair of boots and spurs (Good Lord... here we go!)

4 plain cravat stocks

2 night caps

2 muslin cravats

1 pair of black silk stockings, 2 pair of white cotton stockings

1 pair of worsted stockings

1 towell

1 thread sack

1 blew and white bag

1 white Fustian wastcoate

1 old handkerchief

1 razor and hoand [sharpening stone?]

1[?] pair of blew and white riding spatterdashes

1 mail pillion

1 silk quilted stomacher"

When he heard of the arrest of Pierce Cullen, his brother Andrew fled his lodgings, leaving behind a "wallet" containing:

"1 Arithmetick Book signed Andrew Cullen

2 pair of breeches

2 flannell wastcoats

2 blew and white shirts

1 white shirt

6 plain cravat stocks

1 Turneover[?]

1 holland cravat

1/2 a yard of new holland

3 paire of yarn hose

1 paire of worsted hose

2 Wollen Caps

1 paire of shoes

2 blew and white baggs

2 Razers

1 knife and fork

1 Glove"

[HCA 1/17, f. 163]

There. Make of that lot what you will.

[silas thatcher]

ok, time for the questions !!!

there is listed a flannel waistcoat...does anyone know if it is like the flannel we know today ??

and the towel... curious to know how close the towels of today were to those back then...(pretty much so we can hang out period correct towels to dry instead of our sponge bob towels we currently have !! )

what is a mail pillion ??

[Silkie McDonough]

What Silas said. Thanks Foxe.

[Iron Jon]

Maybe it goes along with the spurs!

PILLION, a light saddle without pommel or bow, especially a pad fastened to the back of an ordinary saddle, as a seat for another person, generally a woman. Pillions were also used to support baggage. They were in common use from the 16th to the 18th centuries.

EDIT

Here's a light dragoon pillion used to carry extra luggage on horseback -

Edited August 30, 2010 by Iron Jon

[Dutchman]

ok, i know what a portmanteau is but just how big was this thing to hold a saddle as well as all the gear- or am i just reading too much into this was all in it?

I think we can also safely say if the spurs were ON the boots, they were not worn aboard ship.

good find foxe

[jendobyns]

I'm being lazy and not walking downstairs for the reference books, but from memory flannel in the period was wool, not the soft fuzzy cotton we know today. Twill or plain weave, woolen or worsted thread, smooth nap. There are even recipes in the period that tell you to use a flannel for straining things, those are definitely supposed to be wool.

I also seem to remember that towels _might_ be of the lighter Turkish variety, but there are also common weaves like huckaback that make a fairly absorbent cloth which makes good towels and I'm pretty sure it is period. I don't have any references for the type of terry cloth towels we have now. Some still life paintings of the time show a cloth that could be napkin, table cloth, or towel, on the table. Some have texture and these might be a form of huck, or diaper. So using the art work could be a starting point for looking for the right fabric for a period appropriate towel when you go fabric shopping?

Years ago I got two different pieces of huck toweling from a vendor called Carolina Calicoes. They are a natural colored cotton (but could also have been linen), shrank up quite a bit once washed, one turned out nice and absorbent, the other not so much. And they are part of my kit to this day.

Mistress D.

ok, time for the questions !!!

there is listed a flannel waistcoat...does anyone know if it is like the flannel we know today ??

and the towel... curious to know how close the towels of today were to those back then...(pretty much so we can hang out period correct towels to dry instead of our sponge bob towels we currently have !! )

what is a mail pillion ??

[Iron Jon]

ok, i know what a portmanteau is but just how big was this thing to hold a saddle as well as all the gear...

I think, at that time, portmanteau was used to refer to any size trunk or carrying case used to hold clothing and personal items while traveling. Later they were called steamer trunks or wardrobe trunks.

[jendobyns]

Additional info for my answer to Silas Thatcher's question:

I just found an entry for towels on one of the Port Royal probate inventories.

9 new ozenbrig towells at 00 05 00 (so that's 5 shillings)

The link for that particular inventory is here: http://nautarch.tamu.edu/portroyal/archives/Inventories/Vol1/1-190.htm

Ozenbrib=oznabrig=osnaburg: Coarse, unbleached linen or hempen cloth first made in Osnabruck, Germany. It was commonly used for trousers, sacking, and bagging. (Montgomery, Textiles in America)

Nothing soft and fuzzy about this stuff ;-) The entry also goes on to say that the modern "osnaburg" found in fabric stores is a cotton muslin with dark flecks added to create the appearance of unbleached muslin.

Flannel, again according to Montgomery: Made of woolen yarn "slightly twisted in the spinning, and of open texture, the object in view being to have the cloth soft and spongy, without regard to strength...All the sorts are occasionally dyed, bleached by the steam of burning sulphur, in order to improve their whiteness" (Beck)

Hope this has been of use!

Mistress D.

[Captain McCool]

Pierce Cullen wasn't yer classic Caribbean pirate, but he was a genuine pirate in 1722. His leather portmanteau contained:

...1 pair of boots and spurs (Good Lord... here we go!)...

LOL! Were they buc... er... nevermind. Just nevermind.

Incidentally, is there any way of knowing if the stockings listed as cotton actually cotton, as we know it today? As in, made from the actual cotton plant? Or was this term being used to describe another type of fabric? Because I keep hearing that as an explanation for "cotton" items being listed in pre-cotton-gin records.

Edited September 7, 2010 by Captain McCool

[Capt. Bo of the WTF co.]

Check out information on Egyptian strains of cottons, as they were the staple of the cotton trade before the ante-bellum southern American plantations re-invented the cotton trade in the 19th c. Egyptian cotton even threatened to undermine the British wool trade a few times throguh history and was subject to heavy tarriffs and out-right bans.

Bo

[PoD]

A page from THE STORY OF HEMP IN COLONIAL VIRGINIA, a dissertation by George Melvin Herndon, 1959, University of Virginia, gives a picture of hemp in early America. Chapter 6, p. 153:

"Because of the time of uneasiness on account of the Stamp Act, a strong movement got underway for families to make hemp into osnaburgs, a kind of coarse linen originally made in Osnabruck, a town in North Germany noted for its manufacture of linen. This linen was used in North America in the making of shirts, jackets, and trousers. "

[jendobyns]

Pierce Cullen wasn't yer classic Caribbean pirate, but he was a genuine pirate in 1722. His leather portmanteau contained:

...1 pair of boots and spurs (Good Lord... here we go!)...

LOL! Were they buc... er... nevermind. Just nevermind.

Incidentally, is there any way of knowing if the stockings listed as cotton actually cotton, as we know it today? As in, made from the actual cotton plant? Or was this term being used to describe another type of fabric? Because I keep hearing that as an explanation for "cotton" items being listed in pre-cotton-gin records.

Again, going from Montgomery, cotton was used to refer to various types of woolen goods from the 1400's on. Manchester cotton, kendal cotton, even Welsh cottons, were wool, and apparently rather coarse woolen goods at that. The term may also apply to the process of raising the nap (frizing or cottoning) or the texture of having a nap or down. At this particular point in time use of the term cotton is problematic. Woolen forms of cotton do seem to me like a more economical and durable choice than plant based cotton for stockings. Indian and Egyptian cottons still aren't cheap yet, iirc.

If you would like, I can forward this question to someone I know who has done extensive research on period stockings. She may be able to shed more light on this.

Mistress D.

[jendobyns]

Pierce Cullen wasn't yer classic Caribbean pirate, but he was a genuine pirate in 1722. His leather portmanteau contained:

[HCA 1/17, f. 163]

There. Make of that lot what you will.

Foxe, could you expand on the little cryptic bit of info at the bottom of the inventory, and tell us what book or collection of records this came from? Thanks!

Mistress D.

[jendobyns]

info from my stocking researcher regarding the cotton stockings:

Deborah Pulliam said that cotton (regular old plant cotton) was around being knit into stockings by the 1720s. Unfortunately I don't have a citation beyond that.

It was at one time believed that the Brewster stocking was that early, but now there are ideas it may be later. The Brewster Stocking is cotton, per Deborah's exam with an electron microscope.

The Gest stockings in the Chester County Historical Society collection, and featured in "Fitting and Proper" are from 1765, and knit from cotton.

The Pennsylvnia Gazette has a stolen goods ad from 1734 that includes cotton stockings.

According to Shire Album 119 "Framework Knitting" p. 10 "The first pair of cotton stockings seems to have been made in Nottingham in 1730, but it was not until improvements in cotton-spinning techniques later in the century enabled a stronger thread to be made that cotton began to supersede silk for lighter hose."

So perhaps, if you read this the way I do, the early cotton stockings _might_ be made out of plant based cotton, but wouldn't be fine

yarn like the silk ones.

My stocking oriented friend also surfed around this list and ran across the thread on striped stockings from back in 2005. Says they aren't historically accurate for the period, but hey, they're comfy and look cool, and historic accuracy isn't everyone's priority. I'll try to dig up the date on horizontally striped stockings for those who care, though, and put it up on that part of the forum. I think that horse got beaten to a pulp on another list I'm on.

Mistress D.

Edited September 9, 2010 by jendobyns

[Fox]

Foxe, could you expand on the little cryptic bit of info at the bottom of the inventory, and tell us what book or collection of records this came from? Thanks!

Yes indeed. It comes from the records of the High Court of Admiralty (HCA) in the National Archives at Kew. HCA 1/17 is the records of indictments and subsequent proceedings filed at the High Court of Admiralty, 1713-1724. The lists come from f[olio] 163 of that file.

[Iron Jon]

Do you have to visit the National Archives at Kew to see the documents or is there any place to view the Admiralty records online and is it a pay type service?

[jendobyns]

Foxe, could you expand on the little cryptic bit of info at the bottom of the inventory, and tell us what book or collection of records this came from? Thanks!

Yes indeed. It comes from the records of the High Court of Admiralty (HCA) in the National Archives at Kew. HCA 1/17 is the records of indictments and subsequent proceedings filed at the High Court of Admiralty, 1713-1724. The lists come from f[olio] 163 of that file.

Thank you! Yet another reason to cross that ocean!

Mistress D.

Edited September 8, 2010 by jendobyns

[Fox]

Do you have to visit the National Archives at Kew to see the documents or is there any place to view the Admiralty records online and is it a pay type service?

Some documents have been digitised by the National Archives and can be viewed for a fee, but it's mostly wills and military service records. I believe the staff will digitize records on request, for a fee, but you'd need to know exactly what you wanted. I don't know what the fee is, but HCA 1/17 (for example) has something around 200 folios (400 pages), which would make it prohibitively expensive - certainly cheaper to fly over unless you have a very specific request.

[Capt. Sterling]

ok, i know what a portmanteau is but just how big was this thing to hold a saddle as well as all the gear- or am i just reading too much into this was all in it?

I think we can also safely say if the spurs were ON the boots, they were not worn aboard ship.

good find foxe

Pillions do not have to be as large as a regular saddle... we had pillions for our portmanteaus for the rev war...they were strapped behind the saddle and the portmanteau was strapped to that... you have seen my portmanteau....it currently stores all the shackles...the pillion for that was even smaller...about 7-8" wide and about 12" long....

[jendobyns]

Foxe, could you expand on the little cryptic bit of info at the bottom of the inventory, and tell us what book or collection of records this came from? Thanks!

Yes indeed. It comes from the records of the High Court of Admiralty (HCA) in the National Archives at Kew. HCA 1/17 is the records of indictments and subsequent proceedings filed at the High Court of Admiralty, 1713-1724. The lists come from f[olio] 163 of that file.

Thank you for that info!

Well now I"m in trouble. I started looking around in the Archives web site and found, under the Black and Asian History exhibit, information about the voyages of the Duke and Dutchess, and facsimile copies of the letters of marque. I need to step away from the computer now or I could spend the rest of the day looking at this site! Thank goodness I could print that out for later. *G*

I guess I'll have to start saving up for that trip. I wonder how much it'd cost to spend a year doing nothing but research? Hmm, gotta go buy that lottery ticket....

Mistress D.

whose favorite buried treasure is found in archives and archaeology sites

[Aquazoo]

So perhaps, if you read this the way I do, the early cotton stockings _might_ be made out of plant based cotton, but wouldn't be fine

yarn like the silk ones.

My stocking oriented friend also surfed around this list and ran across the thread on striped stockings from back in 2005. Says they aren't historically accurate for the period, but hey, they're comfy and look cool, and historic accuracy isn't everyone's priority. I'll try to dig up the date on horizontally striped stockings for those who care, though, and put it up on that part of the forum. I think that horse got beaten to a pulp on another list I'm on.

Mistress D.

Ok, doing a bit more reading in Jeremy Farrell's _Socks & Stockings_, which has a primarily English focus:

In 1688-9, tailor Robert Graham charged for making silk drawers and "sowing fine cotton stockings to them" for William III. Pantyhose? :-)

in 1698, Celia Finnes noted spinning cotton and knitting it into stockings. Most likely hand knit.

1699, a household inventory mentions a cotton wheel (spinning wheel)

Farrell uses the term "stripes" for vertical and "banded" for horizontal.

Galerie des Modes shows 1" vertical stripes in 1787, and getting narrower in the 90s.

Ribbed stockings in 1786 were also described as "striped."

Farrell suggests the vertical rib and horizontal band combined might be "diced" stockings, which are mentioned in 1763 — a clothing description that includes a frock suit. I presume this to mean it was not Scottish diced hose. It's from a description; he does not cite any images or extant examples from that era. No info on whether this was done with colors or textures.

Farrell goes on to say banded hose became popular in the 1790s among "Jessamies," English counterparts to the French Incroyables, and cites a watercolor, "Le Petit Coblentz," which you can see here:

http://www.allposters.com/-sp/Le-Petit-Coblentz-Posters_i1738175_.htm

Moving along to the extant stockings, we see bands for women as early as a selection shown at the International Exhibition of 1862.

From the Great Exhibition of 1851, we see men's socks (short socks, not stockings) with bands.

[jendobyns]

So perhaps, if you read this the way I do, the early cotton stockings _might_ be made out of plant based cotton, but wouldn't be fine

yarn like the silk ones.

My stocking oriented friend also surfed around this list and ran across the thread on striped stockings from back in 2005. Says they aren't historically accurate for the period, but hey, they're comfy and look cool, and historic accuracy isn't everyone's priority. I'll try to dig up the date on horizontally striped stockings for those who care, though, and put it up on that part of the forum. I think that horse got beaten to a pulp on another list I'm on.

Mistress D.

Ok, doing a bit more reading in Jeremy Farrell's _Socks & Stockings_, which has a primarily English focus:

In 1688-9, tailor Robert Graham charged for making silk drawers and "sowing fine cotton stockings to them" for William III. Pantyhose? :-)

in 1698, Celia Finnes noted spinning cotton and knitting it into stockings. Most likely hand knit.

1699, a household inventory mentions a cotton wheel (spinning wheel)

Farrell uses the term "stripes" for vertical and "banded" for horizontal.

Galerie des Modes shows 1" vertical stripes in 1787, and getting narrower in the 90s.

Ribbed stockings in 1786 were also described as "striped."

Farrell suggests the vertical rib and horizontal band combined might be "diced" stockings, which are mentioned in 1763 — a clothing description that includes a frock suit. I presume this to mean it was not Scottish diced hose. It's from a description; he does not cite any images or extant examples from that era. No info on whether this was done with colors or textures.

Farrell goes on to say banded hose became popular in the 1790s among "Jessamies," English counterparts to the French Incroyables, and cites a watercolor, "Le Petit Coblentz," which you can see here:

http://www.allposter...s_i1738175_.htm

Moving along to the extant stockings, we see bands for women as early as a selection shown at the International Exhibition of 1862.

From the Great Exhibition of 1851, we see men's socks (short socks, not stockings) with bands.

Welcome to the pub! Glad you finally found it and could share this useful info!

Perhaps you'd like to introduce yourself to the rest of the folks here?

Mistress D.

[Grymm]

Foxe, could you expand on the little cryptic bit of info at the bottom of the inventory, and tell us what book or collection of records this came from? Thanks!

Yes indeed. It comes from the records of the High Court of Admiralty (HCA) in the National Archives at Kew. HCA 1/17 is the records of indictments and subsequent proceedings filed at the High Court of Admiralty, 1713-1724. The lists come from f[olio] 163 of that file.

Thank you! Yet another reason to cross that ocean!

Mistress D.

And just down the road is the big house where I work so you could come and look round, if I'm working I'll sort you tickets, if I'm not I'll show you round. Plus in a year or so we may have Fred's kitchen at Kew up and running. It's a wee time capsule, someone shut the doors in 1780 summat and all that happen was people filled it with stuff that they couldn't throw away. Still got it's ovens , charcoal stoves, HUGE chimmney fan roasting range, all mid to late 18thC and I may get to play with it.......I love my job =o)

Edited September 10, 2010 by Grymm

[Swashbuckler 1700]

Pierce Cullen wasn't yer classic Caribbean pirate, but he was a genuine pirate in 1722. His leather portmanteau contained:

"5 white shirts marked P.B.C.

1 white shirt marked C.

1 napkin marked C.A. 1714

1 napkin marked w.j.

1 white shirt

5 blew and white shirts

1 old frise coat

1 worsted damask wastcoat and serge damask breeches

1 pair of silk damask breeches

2 flannell wastcoats

2 bob wigs

1 pair of sleeved

1 pair of boots and spurs (Good Lord... here we go!)

4 plain cravat stocks

2 night caps

2 muslin cravats

1 pair of black silk stockings, 2 pair of white cotton stockings

1 pair of worsted stockings

1 towell

1 thread sack

1 blew and white bag

1 white Fustian wastcoate

1 old handkerchief

1 razor and hoand [sharpening stone?]

1[?] pair of blew and white riding spatterdashes

1 mail pillion

1 silk quilted stomacher"

When he heard of the arrest of Pierce Cullen, his brother Andrew fled his lodgings, leaving behind a "wallet" containing:

"1 Arithmetick Book signed Andrew Cullen

2 pair of breeches

2 flannell wastcoats

2 blew and white shirts

1 white shirt

6 plain cravat stocks

1 Turneover[?]

1 holland cravat

1/2 a yard of new holland

3 paire of yarn hose

1 paire of worsted hose

2 Wollen Caps

1 paire of shoes

2 blew and white baggs

2 Razers

1 knife and fork

1 Glove"

[HCA 1/17, f. 163]

There. Make of that lot what you will.

hmmm.... quite fine silk clothing there hmmm...... reminds me of your " What can whyda told to us? " conversation.....