cannon cartridge case

[Silver]

my cannon project is coming along and it is getting to the point of adding small item to the operation of the gun. i have been searching the web and books for what was used to run the cannon cartridge to the gun crew for loading. i'm trying to look at the early 1700's time frame. the leather or wooden case seems to have surfaced in the mid to late 1700's, holding the cartridge under one coat was read in on book and i know about the ladel and bunge barrel or powder bag. i have been on CW naval guns i know the modern artillery rules "leather pouch". i would be thankful for any thoughts, referances or an old thread that i have missed even opinions. thanks

[Commodore Swab]

Just out of curisoity what is your cannon project? Most all I deal with is your various implements (swab, worm, ram) and powder box for safety sake.

[Silver]

Just out of curisoity what is your cannon project? Most all I deal with is your various implements (swab, worm, ram) and powder box for safety sake.

i bought a 1805 swivil gun from hearns iron works and i'm builting a 1700's style naval carriage to fit the gun. started in jan. hope to have it done by april but had to stop working on it to take care of other things.

[Commodore Swab]

Is this the one that you got?

http://www.hernironworks.com/cannons/feswivel2.jpg

As for carriage are you building a more familiar english carriage or will you be building something more spanish which is easier since you would be able to use flat steel for the truniun caps instead of having to fabricate them. One bit of advice, I know some of their guns have had a problem with the cores floating while casting. The ones I have seen were cast using a core and were not bored out like the Viceroy does. If your core is good and strait you will have a nice little cannon.

[Iron Hand]

my cannon project is coming along and it is getting to the point of adding small item to the operation of the gun. i have been searching the web and books for what was used to run the cannon cartridge to the gun crew for loading. i'm trying to look at the early 1700's time frame. the leather or wooden case seems to have surfaced in the mid to late 1700's, holding the cartridge under one coat was read in on book and i know about the ladel and bunge barrel or powder bag. i have been on CW naval guns i know the modern artillery rules "leather pouch". i would be thankful for any thoughts, referances or an old thread that i have missed even opinions. thanks

Check this out.This will give you an idea what to shoot for..I've heard during the 1700's these pouches would hold 2 ro 4 cartridges. BAR only allows 2 cartridges to be carried at one time...http://cgi.ebay.com/RUSSIAN-IMPERIAL-ARTILLERY-AMO-CARTRIDGE-POUCH_W0QQitemZ270356598933QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item3ef2825095&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A0%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

[Silver]

Is this the one that you got?

http://www.hernironworks.com/cannons/feswivel2.jpg

As for carriage are you building a more familiar english carriage or will you be building something more spanish which is easier since you would be able to use flat steel for the truniun caps instead of having to fabricate them. One bit of advice, I know some of their guns have had a problem with the cores floating while casting. The ones I have seen were cast using a core and were not bored out like the Viceroy does. If your core is good and strait you will have a nice little cannon.

yes, that is the gun i have. i'm building in the english style, with a full bed. i have the transome, stool and quion to complete and then start bolting it all together. this "floating" thing concerns me. i did alot of checking around before i bought and all i heard was positive feed back about hearn. can you give me more details about what you have heard and how would you check something like that. thanks

[Silver]

my cannon project is coming along and it is getting to the point of adding small item to the operation of the gun. i have been searching the web and books for what was used to run the cannon cartridge to the gun crew for loading. i'm trying to look at the early 1700's time frame. the leather or wooden case seems to have surfaced in the mid to late 1700's, holding the cartridge under one coat was read in on book and i know about the ladel and bunge barrel or powder bag. i have been on CW naval guns i know the modern artillery rules "leather pouch". i would be thankful for any thoughts, referances or an old thread that i have missed even opinions. thanks

Check this out.This will give you an idea what to shoot for..I've heard during the 1700's these pouches would hold 2 ro 4 cartridges. BAR only allows 2 cartridges to be carried at one time...http://cgi.ebay.com/RUSSIAN-IMPERIAL-ARTILLERY-AMO-CARTRIDGE-POUCH_W0QQitemZ270356598933QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item3ef2825095&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A0%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

thanks a lot for the input. that is a great looking ammo pouch, if i hit the right site that is a small arms or primer pouch worn by a gunner. i'm looking for the protective pouch or case carried by your powder boys, to get the cannon charge from the magazine to the gun deck. i know cannon cartridges were being used in the 1600's it is written as a responsiablity of the master gunner in "the sea-mens grammer" by john smith. again thanks.

[Commodore Swab]

this "floating" thing concerns me. i did alot of checking around before i bought and all i heard was positive feed back about hearn. can you give me more details about what you have heard and how would you check something like that. thanks

A cannon with a core is cast using a piece of hard sand where the bore would be. Once cast the sand is broken out leaving a cannon with a bore already drilled. I do not know if yours was cast with a core or not. If the core is not held prefectly in the center you will end up with a bore that has a much thinner wall thickness on one side of the barrel and a much thicker thickness on the other.

If your barrel has not been proofed I suggest you find somebody and proof it before firing it.

[sutlerjon]

There are a couple of questions regarding what you want in a pass box or bag.

What is the diameter of your bore, if it's small then a shoulder bag is probably appropriate, if it's larger, say something that wouldn't be comfortably carried over the shoulder then you want a pass box that is more like a lidded bucket.

More than likely on ship you'd have used a pass box, on land a pass bag, not unlike US CW accessories.

[Commodore Swab]

Either way you aren't going to be carrying charges around in it (from a safety standpoint) even when firing. To keep up with the pace of things you are going to want to be able to quickly pick up a single charge carry it over and load your gun. Not place itinto a bag walk a couple feet and then pull it out of the bag.

[Silver]

There are a couple of questions regarding what you want in a pass box or bag.

What is the diameter of your bore, if it's small then a shoulder bag is probably appropriate, if it's larger, say something that wouldn't be comfortably carried over the shoulder then you want a pass box that is more like a lidded bucket.

More than likely on ship you'd have used a pass box, on land a pass bag, not unlike US CW accessories.

thanks for the input, you gave me the word that i had been looking for "pass box/bag/barrel/bucket" i have found several places on the net using those words. thanks agian.

[Silver]

Either way you aren't going to be carrying charges around in it (from a safety standpoint) even when firing. To keep up with the pace of things you are going to want to be able to quickly pick up a single charge carry it over and load your gun. Not place itinto a bag walk a couple feet and then pull it out of the bag.

i know what you are saying, but everytime we shoot the cw gun(12pdr dalgerhen boat howizter) we always use a pouch to transfer the charge from the ammo box to the loader #2 man . there are some things you have to do for safety. i would use it for every shot.