lady constance Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 just working on my first set of stays........ and honestly, i want those of you who know period fabrics quite a bit better than i to comment and give reccomendation......... uummmm,,, that would be YOU Kate Souris/Bagley, Micheal Bagley, Patrick Hand, Capn Sterling, Mary Diamond .. or anyone else more in the KNOW of things....... here are a few links to my growing fabric collection....... i want to know if these are close enough-- the ten foot rule... PC { pretty close}, PFC { pretty flinking close enough!}.... fabric would be for skirts and stays....... and-- can some one reccomend a fabric for a mantua.....i really just dont know if jacquard is quite goingto give me the draping it should have-- or rather that it would be TOO stiff for proper draping.... i would appreciate any reccomendations and comments....and ADVICE!! lady constance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Diamond Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 just working on my first set of stays........and honestly, i want those of you who know period fabrics quite a bit better than i to comment and give reccomendation......... uummmm,,, that would be YOU Kate Souris/Bagley, Micheal Bagley, Patrick Hand, Capn Sterling, Mary Diamond .. or anyone else more in the KNOW of things....... here are a few links to my growing fabric collection....... i want to know if these are close enough-- the ten foot rule... PC { pretty close}, PFC { pretty flinking close enough!}.... fabric would be for skirts and stays....... and-- can some one reccomend a fabric for a mantua.....i really just dont know if jacquard is quite goingto give me the draping it should have-- or rather that it would be TOO stiff for proper draping.... i would appreciate any reccomendations and comments....and ADVICE!! lady constance I must defer to the Captain's recommendations ~ quite a bit more experience than myself! Regarding the mantua ~ will you be wearing it while cooking? If so, I would recommend sticking with a natural wool or linen, just in case you get too close to the flames. Oh, and to clarify the PfC rule, for myself ~ it applies primarily to unseen sewn areas (such as seams, but not hems, collars or cuffs) and buttonholes (unfortunately, lacking in time and skill to apply in this area), not usually materials. My complete Riding Habit and Mourning Gown are all 100% wool and linen. My purple ballgown (my first attempt at one) is a synthetic jacquard. The buttons and shoes I sell also fit into PfC, simply from a cost standpoint. Current stays are cotton with Rigilene boning (I want to be able to wash them without dismantling). A new set of stays is on the drawing board, of linen. Oooh, shiny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Roberts Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 Stay away from this fabric. (Sorry don't have a close up) It was a very loose weave and kept unraveling on me. Not very fun for trying my first mantua. Like Mary said, I do all my seams with a machine and (I just recently started doing this) Finishing the garment by hand. (Oh I have the same trouble as Mary with button holes. Still working on getting those down.) But I strive real hard to use period material. Besides linen it just so nice to wear and much cooler than cotton or any synthetic material. One exception I would feel is velvet. I have yet to find PC velvet. (Made from silk or wool) Anything I have found has always been for upholstery. It way to stiff for garment use. The stays your making do look nice though. What is the outer fabric? I wouldn't mind a shot of it by it self. If the pattern is correct (more like close) for the period I would venture to say (Waiting on the wrath of Sterling ) that would be PFC. I just shot a whole bunch of photos of fabric samples at the V&A I could compare your fabric with what I have. At first glance there might be a chance it's close. (If the outer is the red gold stuff.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady constance Posted January 18, 2009 Author Share Posted January 18, 2009 Jack--i saw your earlier mantua- beautiful work -- the fabric looks like loose woven burlap { for i have no other word in my mind to describe-- or perhaps a very loose woven linen.....i KNOW that had to be a beaaaaaaaaaaaach to work with... hwo you got the seams to STAY together is beyond me-- perhaps zig zagging then straight stitching..... awesome work on your part.. i KNOW your efforts--- good job say i !! when you say outer fabric, which picture and which fabric?? you said red-- so that leads me to beleive the jacqaurd--- the red floral with greens and taupes..... that is 90% cotton with i beleive abit of poly in it--- and you are correct, the pattern is what drew me to it { and color}..... on the picture it appears as it has gold in it-- it doesNOT.... camera thingy.... { HATE the new digital dh bought-- because i have not mastered its programming yet !!!} i googled 18th century clothing /fabric patterns and hit a gold mine......... so a million images stuffed in my head......particularly patterns of flowers and such...... the golden color stuff is 100% SILK-- not a dupioni , just a silk..... i DID find aa website that sells linen/ wool / silk blends....... prices-- ehhhh -- kind of costly but after i perfect my and fine tune my patterns, i will splurge over and over i have read that many historical re enactors are simply stuck with and choose fabrics.net upholstery type fabrics.... there ARE 100 silk and linen and wools out there.... $$$$$ try fabrics . net and renassaince fabrics . com..... also denver fabris or fabric-store. net have awesome luck there..... and i havebeen playing with a few patterns and adding to them from waughs cut of women clothing.....{ adding volumes of fabric to the side panels for mantua..... so far so good.... } Jack-- will photo bucket a better shot--- that would be a hoot if it was the same.... LOL.... and what were you going to use that for? i thought about a mantua with it.. but being that i only have 4 yards of it, it would be a close cut for a mantua....so iwas going to do skirt... a really big full one.... if i wait for capn sterling to respond to questions such as these, i would drown in fabric!! He is just ttooooooooooo busy for such endeavors no matter how gracious he is about helping out the newcomers.... so, time to take a chance like we did for PiP....... just do it! if you want when i run into bargains, in silk and linen and wool, if you let me know what you are looking for i can just pick them up for you.. and ship them... in repayment for your kindness and the pirate brethren kind of deal..... lady constance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Roberts Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 I just was wondering what the outer fabric of your stays were and if you have just a shot of that. If I remember correctly dupoini silk is something to avoid. The slubbines of it kind of takes it out of period. You want something that is woven smooth with little slubs. So you should be right on. Thanks for you most generous offer on fabrics but Alas I have 2 rubber maid bins full of fabric and more that doesn't fit in them. I'm drowning in it you see. :) Thank you for your most generous offer. Perhaps I should refer you to this thread. Fabric Whore You see I already have problems... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theM.A.dDogge Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 Stay away from this fabric. (Sorry don't have a close up) It was a very loose weave and kept unraveling on me. Not very fun for trying my first mantua. yes...but you look so pretty in it....your wife must be jealous!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Roberts Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 (edited) Stay away from this fabric. (Sorry don't have a close up) It was a very loose weave and kept unraveling on me. Not very fun for trying my first mantua. yes...but you look so pretty in it....your wife must be jealous!!! Awe, thank you Mad Dogg you're too kind. Of it should be expected coming from some who also cross dresses humself. Edited January 18, 2009 by Jack Roberts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theM.A.dDogge Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 Stay away from this fabric. (Sorry don't have a close up) It was a very loose weave and kept unraveling on me. Not very fun for trying my first mantua. yes...but you look so pretty in it....your wife must be jealous!!! Awe, thank you Mad Dogg you're too kind. Of it should be expected coming from some who also cross dresses humself. yep...made that chamise meself too.....i still think it funny...that after all these years...there are more men making the clothes for their women then the other way 'round...tho not sure i would much use for it if me wife made me a mantua??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silas thatcher Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 there ya go jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady constance Posted January 18, 2009 Author Share Posted January 18, 2009 thank you Silas for posting the pics!!!! :) and i CUT OFF EVERY SINGLE TAB!!! the corset maker/generator directions simply were unclear to me--- and at this time, i shall not be adding over the top! i did pick up a few patterns at fabric whorehouse, a butterick- with several time eras of corset patterns.... i shall use linenfabric and maybe it wil go faster-- this one took me about 6-7 hours { thanks to the happy lady bernina who does all the hard parts.... if get to getting in the brass eyelets tonight i shall put it on and see what it looks like on.... lady constance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 lady if you are doing brass eyelets you may want to stich ardound them with thread to hide the brass. you can also do stiching around the fabric istself to make the holes for lacing. do you intent to spiral lace or cross lace them? and where thte hell is "i did pick up a few patterns at fabric whorehouse" located and what be the types o fabrics that be whorin there?????? :angry: sorry could nae resist luv. the stays look fantastic salty Mud Slinging Pyromanic , Errrrrr Ship's Potter at ye service Vagabond's Rogue Potter Wench First Mate of the Fairge Iolaire Me weapons o choice be lots o mud, sharp pointy sticks, an string Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silas thatcher Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 no brass eyelets.... i am comfortable with the hand sewn ones... they seem to be turning out fairly good.... spiral laced..... don't remember the name of the store... lady c. will have to tell ya.. this set didn't turn out REAL great.... mary diamond pointed out that the cut under the arm is probably too high, i agree, we royally screwed up the tabs, so cut the rest off, i think that the top is too high and needs to come down a bit... an inch or two... learned alot while watching others' progress and doing this set... the next ones should show more promise... well, gotta start somewhere :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 silas , they looked better then my first attempt......as to the highs and lows of cuts and fits, i cant see the details, so they looked fyne for a first attepmt. to ye and yer lady may ha'e faire winds and good trade til next we meet salty Mud Slinging Pyromanic , Errrrrr Ship's Potter at ye service Vagabond's Rogue Potter Wench First Mate of the Fairge Iolaire Me weapons o choice be lots o mud, sharp pointy sticks, an string Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Diamond Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 Lady Constance ~ I wanted you to know I have started a separate thread which may interest you ~ Stays ~ It All Starts with the Right Foundation This thread shows images of GAoP period stays patterns and stays. Especially helpful are the diagrams showing boning angles, to achieve the proper cone form. If you are so inclined, you could just enlarge these images to make the pattern for your stays. Ah, and I forgot to mention earlier ~ the ivory jacquard fabric is lovely. Please let me know if I can be of any assistance. Oooh, shiny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady constance Posted January 30, 2009 Author Share Posted January 30, 2009 Miss Diamond, been busy thinking and pouring over the topic of the essential garments..... butterick has a pattern with 4 different sets of stays ... the one closet to Gaop needs the tabs rounded.... it also gives the angles of the boning on the sides of the garment....... at an angle........ YAH.....so------- no more tube shaped stays..... now honestly, i should just use scrap fabric.... but i jsut cant bear to use unlovely fabrics.... !{ fabric princess that i am}.......... but ic an say that i am so happy that everyone here is so encouraging..... even when my results are less than..... thank ye! very much.... lady constance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Hand Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 .i still think it funny...that after all these years...there are more men making the clothes for their women then the other way 'round.. Dang... that could be it's own thread.... I couldn't get Carol (my Boss, she went the year before last to PiP) to wear stays, the closet I could get her to wear were jumps.... but give you three guesses who made them..... I'm the one wot sews, and she is the one that sells the stuff (well animal mascots...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary Diamond Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 Miss Diamond,been busy thinking and pouring over the topic of the essential garments..... butterick has a pattern with 4 different sets of stays ... the one closet to Gaop needs the tabs rounded.... it also gives the angles of the boning on the sides of the garment....... at an angle........ YAH.....so------- no more tube shaped stays..... now honestly, i should just use scrap fabric.... but i jsut cant bear to use unlovely fabrics.... !{ fabric princess that i am}.......... but ic an say that i am so happy that everyone here is so encouraging..... even when my results are less than..... thank ye! very much.... lady constance Lady Constance ~ I am happy to hear you are reassured. Yes, it is a bit of a trial to use scrap fabric first for trial stays fittings (I am a fairly impatient person, and hate delays to starting the "real" project) ~ please do keep in mind, it is only to establish the proper lines and check for fit. A single layer of fabric, seam stitched, with tabs cut, and yourself spiral laced in. Shouldn't take more than hour to make and try on, to see if the general fit is correct, and to make adjustments to the pattern accordingly. This scrap fabric shell is just that ~ scrap ~ I do not use my scraps to make the "real" stays. The trial fitting ensures a better fit when you take the second step, and cut your real (lovely) fabrics. Less chance of a poor fit, which would be a waste of the lovely fabrics. Best of Luck! Oooh, shiny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeky Actress Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 I have to agree with you Mary regarding the topic at hand. Making a quick mock-up out of cheap fabric saves on frustration later. While making other period undergarments, I’m talking 1880s corsets here. I always have to stop and change my mental gears when working in another time period…sewing techniques do differ). I prefer using a medium to heavy weight fabric; such as twill or canvas duck. Personally, I usually have about a 1 yard or so laying about. The nice thing about this weight of fabric is you can obtain a better feel/form then a lighter weight fabric – especially when you cinch-up your lacing (spiral). And like Mary…I am a very impatient person, therefore, helpful hints always cut down on the loss of time and money! Member of "The Forsaken" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCholeBlack Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 I'll have to respectfully disagree with Donna & Lisa. I have found that fitting with fabric never works properly. After all, there is no fabric that is going to fully mimic the stiffness of fully boned stays. I always use the corrugated cardboard mock up technique and it has never failed me. I have used it for everything from 15th century through regency, & know others that have used it successfully for nearly everything else including modern bustiers. Points in the cardboard techniques favor; it's free from your local recycling center, cardboard mimics the stiffness of stays, pieces can be cut with the corrugations running in the same direction as the later boning channels, places of discomfort are easy to identify as the cardboard pokes where the fabric doesn't & they are sturdy enough that in a true pinch (& with plenty of duct tape) they can be worn for an entire weekend event. Plus it's just kind of fun to be able to say you've "worn" cardboard. Cardboard Fitting Tutorial Granted there are those that will immediately argue "they didn't have cardboard in (insert time period) so we shouldn't use it either". But lets be honest with ourselves, at the time when stays were being worn daily, by every class of women, they had professionals to fit & construct them. The techniques they employed in fitting are not necessarily within the skills of your average seamstress/reenactor. I would much rather every woman have a well fit, properly constructed, comfortable enough to sleep in pair of stays than be anal retentive about the techniques used to achieve them. Chole "If part of the goods be plundered by a pirate the proprietor or shipmaster is not entitled to any contribution." An introduction to merchandize, Robert Hamilton, 1777Slightly Obsessed, an 18th Century reenacting blog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeky Actress Posted January 30, 2009 Share Posted January 30, 2009 Well then...seeing that I work for a paper company (box plant), I be able to supply the whole Crewe with an endless supply of corrugated stock. Thanks Chole... Member of "The Forsaken" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady constance Posted January 31, 2009 Author Share Posted January 31, 2009 hmmmm.... the darling silas is working overtime tomorrow....$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$........ one half of my brain says... repeatedly....... please , some one, simply tell me what you would charge to make me a set of stays...! make an offer! i cannot be the only person who has discovered that if i have the money, i dont have the time... and if i have the time, i don't have the money......... well as of the last years have been... i got the money! it is the time i DONT have!! tell me what you charge, let me think ,i will write a check, give you time to find out it is GOOD and give you my measurements and let me simply work on my skirts and mantua.... heck i can even send you the fabric and boning!!! there-- i said it! lady constance... PM me with offers....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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