The correct Sword

hitman · January 4, 2004

Ahoy mates, I've been lookin for info on the confederate commerce raiders. More pointedly weapons this propably runs the gammit of possibilities but maybe I can narrow it down some. Would loyalist arms naval cutlass and cabelas navy revolver cut it at muster or should I look else where? :blink:

hitman · January 5, 2004

Found these pics of the real thing,

http://www.confederatearmscompany.com/catelog2.html

if your wonderin why I dont snap em up me maties I'll be pointen ya to the price. :blink:

Wartooth · January 5, 2004

Found these pics of the real thing,
http://www.confederatearmscompany.com/catelog2.html

if your wonderin why I dont snap em up me maties I'll be pointen ya to the price.

Sorry I don't have a link, but try and dig up the online catalog for Atlanta Cutlery. They are the mother division of Museum Replicas. A couple of years ago they had sabers similar to that and at a good price too.

Deacon Frye · January 5, 2004

The CSA cutlass is essentially the same as the US 1841 Cutlass.

There's a replica of the CSA cutlass available for $144.99 at: Legendary Arms.

The thing you might want to bear in mind, though, is that the Confederacy was obtaining arms from overseas, and they didn't necessarily adhere to the "official" pattern.

In particular, some of the commerce raiders were purchased and outfitted overseas, and never touched the American shore.

Here's a cutlass claimed to have been used on the CSS Florida: Eagle Trading.

capnwilliam · January 6, 2004

Ye have a great Avatar, Mate Hitman! :)

Capt. William

hitman · January 6, 2004

That was my worry deacon with so many ships and crews never touching the southern cost I cant imagine witch way to go it appears that one could do pretty much as they wished and be able to defend it but I'd like to get this into the plaussible not just possible range. I know that the Alabama was built and fitted out in europe. Is there any documantation on where they got their arms. I haven't found too much yet in my online search and our local library is so outclassed by even small town standardes for the moment the internet is the only place I can look. I'm also running into a wall in regards to my side arm but then thats another story :lol:

hitman · January 6, 2004

Thankee capnwilliam. Now If Icould just get some stars into those bars I'd at least have something completed.

julius27 · January 6, 2004

One should keep in mind that most Confederate troops were militia (at least early on) and even those that were regulars often had to arm themselves. This means that pretty much anything correct to the period (or earlier, as many weapons were hand-me-downs) will also be correct to a Confederate soldier or sailor. Remember that only about half of the Confederate Army even wore uniforms! I don't mean to sound over the top on the subject, but I fancy myself a student of the "War of Northern Aggression" and get rather enthusiastic on the subject.

Deacon Frye · January 6, 2004

That was my worry deacon with so many ships and crews never touching the southern cost I cant imagine witch way to go it appears that one could do pretty much as they wished and be able to defend it but I'd like to get this into the plaussible not just possible range. I know that the Alabama was built and fitted out in europe. Is there any documantation on where they got their arms. I haven't found too much yet in my online search and our local library is so outclassed by even small town standardes for the moment the internet is the only place I can look. I'm also running into a wall in regards to my side arm but then thats another story

Interesting subject, Hitman. I wish I had more insight into it. To find the inventory of a particular raider could require some in-depth research. Are you going to be a seaman or an officer?

You might want to take a look around http://www.csnavy.org/ .

In particular: http://www.csnavy.org/weapons.htm

BTW, don't forget about Inter-Library Loan. Even though your library is small, they can probably order about any book you'd find in a big one.

hitman · January 8, 2004

Yeah it is becoming a real challenge because the options are pretty wide open. I'm thinking (with his eye towards his budget) I'll go with the legendary arms cutlass but I'll propably ditch the cabelas revolver as it was not origianally .44 caliber but .36. Ofcourse I could always claim the ten foot rule. As to officer or seaman I think I'll split the diffrence and go with a mate all though the truth is I'm a little young for that. Hey incase I haven't said it or even if I have thanks one and all for the help.

Quick edit Well a look at the link you provided has been quite helpful decaon apparently the standared caliber for the confederate navy was actually .44 diffrent than the union specs apparently the cabelas catolog didn't note the reason for thier change of caliber and my mistake was thus made. Unfortunatly the link also convinced me I need a LeMat. (anybody know of a bank that ill loan money for a gun )

Deacon Frye · January 9, 2004

Quick edit Well a look at the link you provided has been quite helpful decaon apparently the standared caliber for the confederate navy was actually .44 diffrent than the union specs apparently the cabelas catolog didn't note the reason for thier change of caliber and my mistake was thus made. Unfortunatly the link also convinced me I need a LeMat. (anybody know of a bank that ill loan money for a gun )

Not quite following you here, hitman. The link I posted shows a Colt Army .44 representing a bunch picked up by Rephael Semmes just prior to the outbreak of hostilities--some of which were used by the Confederate Navy.

So far as I can recall, Confederate versions of the Colt Navy were all .36 caliber.

For some reason, a number of reproductions of "Confederate" navies and even some billed as Colts come in .44 caliber. I have one given to me years ago. If you find an original "navy" in .44, I'd like to know about it.

Misery · January 9, 2004

i love the csnavy cutlass bayonet id have to see it closer to see if i wanted one of the repoductions

hitman · January 9, 2004

Well Deacon in the second link there is the note that "The standard official caliber of the CSN was .44 for revolvers----not navy caliber of .36 as used by the north." Although they did not show a pic I think what they are trying to say is that for colt imitations made in the south for the csn the caliber was .44. As to .39 that was a typo on my part and I have corrected it. Do you think I missunderstood this note?

hitman · January 9, 2004

Yeah Misery thats one of the proplems here THERE IS JUST TOO MUCH GOOD STUFF"

Deacon Frye · January 11, 2004

Well Deacon in the second link there is the note that "The standard official caliber of the CSN was .44 for revolvers----not navy caliber of .36 as used by the north." Although they did not show a pic I think what they are trying to say is that for colt imitations made in the south for the csn the caliber was .44. As to .39 that was a typo on my part and I have corrected it. Do you think I missunderstood this note?

I took this to mean that the CSN elected to go with .44 caliber revolvers such as those shown in the pictures on the page.

The south did produce copies of the Colt Navy, and bought others overseas, but these were all, SFAIK, .36 caliber.

The "Navy" was widely used by army officers on both sides as well as the Union (and British) Navy.

Just 'cause I like it, a pic from the gunroom of the HMS warrior:

HMS Warrior

hitman · January 11, 2004

DROOOOOOOOOOOLLLLLLLLL <_<

So thats how Britannia ruled the waves lol

hitman · March 6, 2004

Sorry to bring such an old post up but if any of you were intrested I found one definitive source on the confederate privateers. Called (duh)

The Confederate Privateers by William Morrison Robinson Jr.. It's currently published by theUniversity of South carolinia orgiganilly published by Yale university press 1928. So far it seems some of the things we had assumed to date about the privateers were wrong. (When I say we I mean here on the board) Chief among them the assumtion that the privateers fitted out chiefly over seas, not so due to the neutrality laws england laid down forbidding the condeming of prizes in her waters thus makeing cruising far abroad too dangerous and unprofitable for these private men of war. Belive this book may lead to more discoveries if ya'll be intrested I think I'll start a new thread in Capt. Twill as I am drifting away from the primary purpose of plunder.....We shall see.

Deacon Frye · March 7, 2004

Sorry to bring such an old post up but if any of you were intrested I found one definitive source on the confederate privateers. Called (duh)
The Confederate Privateers by William Morrison Robinson Jr.. It's currently published by theUniversity of South carolinia orgiganilly published by Yale university press 1928. So far it seems some of the things we had assumed to date about the privateers were wrong. (When I say we I mean here on the board) Chief among them the assumtion that the privateers fitted out chiefly over seas, not so due to the neutrality laws england laid down forbidding the condeming of prizes in her waters thus makeing cruising far abroad too dangerous and unprofitable for these private men of war. Belive this book may lead to more discoveries if ya'll be intrested I think I'll start a new thread in Capt. Twill as I am drifting away from the primary purpose of plunder.....We shall see.

I'm not following you, hitman.

How does England "disallowing condemnation (presumably of prizes?) in her waters" negate the fitting out of privateers?

BILLY BONES · March 8, 2004

If the Confederacy preferred .44 revolvers, then go with a Colt Army. Don't pick a Navy simply because it's a navy. That just means it's .36 cal. Besides, the Navy frame and cylinder were not designed for a .44, and weakens the entire revolver. Why worry so much? Stick with a Colt if you're worried about authenticity. No one can say that's wrong. Another suggestion would be a Belgian, or English percission pistol. I wouldn't get a Lemat. The odds of you having one (as a common sailor) are slim, besides the fact that they were primarily a horseman's weapon, and were used by officers for the most part. Sure, they're cool, but if I was a sailor, I wouldn't want a bulky revolver with a huge holster on my side.

BILLY BONES · March 8, 2004

Oh, as as far as the cutlass, find something you like, as long as it was made in or before your time period. You can look at photos of known Confederate cutlasses, and never find two alike. They were not standardized! More than likely, a U.S. naval cutlass will be the most appropriate. True, the Confederacy manufactured some cutlasses, and those are the only ones you're going to find photos of, because it stands to reason that a Confederate used them. Like any Confederate sailor or soldier, you're going to use the easiest cutlass to aquire, which is the Federal (Union) cutlass. You don't see alot of photos of those identified as Confederate-used, because it would be hard to prove. I'm willing to bet that well over half the cutlasses used by Confederate sailors were captured Federal cutlasses. Remember, before the war, all sailors had the Federal cutlass. Why would they change their cutlass to a Confederate manufactured one? I've done alot of research on this, as I was propmaster for "The Hunley"," Ironclads", etc.

Zorg · March 9, 2004

Actually, the lot of Confederate equipment closely patterned 1850s French equipment as thats what we could get ....

( I knows this, Mobile bein an old stompin ground)

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