Mary Diamond Posted January 26, 2009 Posted January 26, 2009 There has been so much discussion concerning stays, and so many enthusiastic folk attempting their first, that the Captain and I thought this may be of help. These are all period patterns ~ I made stays for myself from Simplicity, Butterick, and the below patterns, and have found the GAoP patterns to be the most comfortable. Be sure to note the seam and boning placement ~ this is critical to achieving the cone form, as opposed to a tubular form. How I used these patterns ~ I measured from the center of my breastbone to just above my privates, for the busk (wooden stabilizer which completes the form ~ can also be switched out for boning or reed, for a more flexible fit). Expect anywhere from 12" - 17", depending on your frame ~ when sitting, the busk does set down between your thighs a bit. I enlarged the chosen pattern so the center dimension will fit the busk. From there, it is a matter of creating scrap canvas (or other heavy, non-stretching material) samples, which are fitted and adjusted accordingly. It is a bit time consuming, but properly fitted stays are wonderful to wear (ask me about the nasty bruises I had from a poorly fitted -my fault! I tried rushing- pair of stays some day). Please let me know if there is any way I can help ~ Similar to the base for a 1650-60 gown in Waugh, I apologize, I have no date. 1670-80 1675 1697 ~ Note front lacing, therefore no busk. Oooh, shiny!
Mary Diamond Posted January 26, 2009 Author Posted January 26, 2009 Dated between 1678-1725 1715 Oooh, shiny!
LadyBrower Posted January 26, 2009 Posted January 26, 2009 ~ when sitting, the busk does set down between your thighs a bit. Thank you for this thread, and that little piece of information is actually really important- I'm on my (second and third attempt at stays) and I was worried they were too long! Thanks again. Cook and Seamstress to the Half Moon Marauders Lady Brower's Treasures, Clothing and other treasures Hell Hath No Fury like the Wrath of a Woman... No that's it. She doesn't need a reason. www.myspace.com/halfmoonmarauders www.myspace.com/faerienoodle
Capt. Sterling Posted January 26, 2009 Posted January 26, 2009 (edited) delete Edited February 16, 2009 by Capt. Sterling "I being shot through the left cheek, the bullet striking away great part of my upper jaw, and several teeth which dropt down the deck where I fell... I was forced to write what I would say to prevent the loss of blood, and because of the pain I suffered by speaking."~ Woodes Rogers Crewe of the Archangel http://jcsterlingcptarchang.wix.com/creweofthearchangel# http://creweofthearchangel.wordpress.com/
LaraCorsets Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 The Museum of Fine Arts in Boston has a lovely stay which appears earlier than most. Likely 1st half of the 18th century. Note the length of the tabs, the overall length of the conical torso and the "butterfly wings" at the base of the center front. That is not commonly found in stays later than the 1730s/40s (Let me see if I can figure out how to post a photo....) Lara aka - Rose www.LaraCorsets.com
Capt. Sterling Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 (edited) delete Edited February 16, 2009 by Capt. Sterling "I being shot through the left cheek, the bullet striking away great part of my upper jaw, and several teeth which dropt down the deck where I fell... I was forced to write what I would say to prevent the loss of blood, and because of the pain I suffered by speaking."~ Woodes Rogers Crewe of the Archangel http://jcsterlingcptarchang.wix.com/creweofthearchangel# http://creweofthearchangel.wordpress.com/
LadyBrower Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Is that laced only on the top bit there? Cook and Seamstress to the Half Moon Marauders Lady Brower's Treasures, Clothing and other treasures Hell Hath No Fury like the Wrath of a Woman... No that's it. She doesn't need a reason. www.myspace.com/halfmoonmarauders www.myspace.com/faerienoodle
Capt. Sterling Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 (edited) delete Edited February 16, 2009 by Capt. Sterling "I being shot through the left cheek, the bullet striking away great part of my upper jaw, and several teeth which dropt down the deck where I fell... I was forced to write what I would say to prevent the loss of blood, and because of the pain I suffered by speaking."~ Woodes Rogers Crewe of the Archangel http://jcsterlingcptarchang.wix.com/creweofthearchangel# http://creweofthearchangel.wordpress.com/
Cheeky Actress Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Dearest Mother! Tis a joy to hear from you! Please forgive me for my past transgressions, Mother. I did it for love! Lovely example of first quarter stays. Any chance they have this in a book somewhere...the example pattern? Member of "The Forsaken"
LaraCorsets Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Dearest Mother! Tis a joy to hear from you! Please forgive me for my past transgressions, Mother. I did it for love! Lovely example of first quarter stays. Any chance they have this in a book somewhere...the example pattern? Ungrateful gutter snipe. What do you know of love other than what it could buy you!? Take heed dear Brother, she cannot be trusted, I taught her too well. As for the stays, the functional lacing is the center back as was common. Hoever they do lace up in the upper few inches of the center front. It is not un-common, but I am not sure why as it would never be able to serve much of a purpose. Perhaps for a touch of flexibility in how tight across the front the stay is? As all Ladies know our bust size can fluctuate a bit with our monthly cycles. Those stays are in Boston at the Museum of Fine Arts. I have found no other photos or info on them. Lara aka - Rose www.LaraCorsets.com
RustyNell Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 (edited) that center lacing is a neat little extra...not only would it help for comfort when your a bit bloated ......could allow for a bit lest bust or a bit more in certain company... great way to go from a conservative tea with the ladies, without drawing gossip... to getting the attention of that certain gentleman, without the need of a friend to help tighten you up... LOL... its the PC version on Candi's hydraulic boobies in the Pyrate Comix thread ROFLOL Edited February 4, 2009 by RustyNell “PIRACY, n. Commerce without its folly-swaddles, just as God made it.” Ambrose Bierce
Capt. Sterling Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 (edited) delete Edited February 16, 2009 by Capt. Sterling "I being shot through the left cheek, the bullet striking away great part of my upper jaw, and several teeth which dropt down the deck where I fell... I was forced to write what I would say to prevent the loss of blood, and because of the pain I suffered by speaking."~ Woodes Rogers Crewe of the Archangel http://jcsterlingcptarchang.wix.com/creweofthearchangel# http://creweofthearchangel.wordpress.com/
Cheeky Actress Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Not to fret Rose, I have made peace with my father and will marry whom he choses... Lilly looks over at Mother Rose...and impishly sticks her tongue out at her..."So there...You see...my Johnny finds favor with his Father. No need to fret, dear mother...you HAVE taught me well. Member of "The Forsaken"
Cheeky Actress Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Rusty Nells said, ... LOL... its the PC version on Candi's hydraulic boobies in the Pyrate Comix thread ROFLOL I have to get over there and see this!? Member of "The Forsaken"
Capt. Sterling Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 (edited) delete Edited February 16, 2009 by Capt. Sterling "I being shot through the left cheek, the bullet striking away great part of my upper jaw, and several teeth which dropt down the deck where I fell... I was forced to write what I would say to prevent the loss of blood, and because of the pain I suffered by speaking."~ Woodes Rogers Crewe of the Archangel http://jcsterlingcptarchang.wix.com/creweofthearchangel# http://creweofthearchangel.wordpress.com/
LadyBrower Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 that center lacing is a neat little extra...not only would it help for comfort when your a bit bloated ......could allow for a bit lest bust or a bit more in certain company... great way to go from a conservative tea with the ladies, without drawing gossip... to getting the attention of that certain gentleman, without the need of a friend to help tighten you up... LOL... its the PC version on Candi's hydraulic boobies in the Pyrate Comix thread ROFLOL Oh that could be nifty- like those magic push up bras with the adjustable cleavage thing in the middle. Is that what it was used for? Cook and Seamstress to the Half Moon Marauders Lady Brower's Treasures, Clothing and other treasures Hell Hath No Fury like the Wrath of a Woman... No that's it. She doesn't need a reason. www.myspace.com/halfmoonmarauders www.myspace.com/faerienoodle
LaraCorsets Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Not to fret Rose, I have made peace with my father and will marry whom he choses... Lilly looks over at Mother Rose...and impishly sticks her tongue out at her..."So there...You see...my Johnny finds favor with his Father. No need to fret, dear mother...you HAVE taught me well. Like my father would ever chose or consent to me marrying you? Tess was a saint compared to you... As if a marriage with her sort were even a possibility. I invested in and trained my "daughters" for one purpose only. Marriage ain't it. Lara aka - Rose www.LaraCorsets.com
michaelsbagley Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 There has been so much discussion concerning stays, and so many enthusiastic folk attempting their first, that the Captain and I thought this may be of help. It's a good thing a new thread was started strictly about stays with none of the banter of the other thread...
Cheeky Actress Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 (edited) Like my father would ever chose or consent to me marrying you? Tess was a saint compared to you....As if a marriage with her sort were even a possibility. I invested in and trained my "daughters" for one purpose only. Marriage ain't it. With an inequitable look, Lilly made her opionon known...."Hey, I'm standing right here!" Edited February 4, 2009 by Cheeky Actress Member of "The Forsaken"
Cheeky Actress Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Mother Rose, I have a question about the assembly of the stays; as in the method you found regarding inserting cane and such. thank you. Member of "The Forsaken"
LadyBarbossa Posted February 5, 2009 Posted February 5, 2009 Hmmm... intreguing stays. Even more intreguing is th' spat her. :::highly entertained::: :) ~Lady B Tempt Fate! an' toss 't all t' Hell!" "I'm completely innocent of whatever crime I've committed." The one, the only,... the infamous!
Capt. Sterling Posted February 5, 2009 Posted February 5, 2009 (edited) delete Edited February 16, 2009 by Capt. Sterling "I being shot through the left cheek, the bullet striking away great part of my upper jaw, and several teeth which dropt down the deck where I fell... I was forced to write what I would say to prevent the loss of blood, and because of the pain I suffered by speaking."~ Woodes Rogers Crewe of the Archangel http://jcsterlingcptarchang.wix.com/creweofthearchangel# http://creweofthearchangel.wordpress.com/
Rumba Rue Posted February 5, 2009 Posted February 5, 2009 One thing I have noticed is not all stays are quilted down each row of boning. The stays I'm having made won't have that as all of that is on the inside, but it will have the wooden busk.
LaraCorsets Posted February 5, 2009 Posted February 5, 2009 One thing I have noticed is not all stays are quilted down each row of boning. The stays I'm having made won't have that as all of that is on the inside, but it will have the wooden busk. Rhumba Rue, I am not sure I follow what you mean by "quilted down each row of boning"..... To me quilting is when batting in sandwiched between 2 layers of fabric so when it is sewn through it has depth and fluff to it. Like a quilt type blanket (did I explain that well enough to make sense?). It that what you mean by a stay being quilted? As far as I have seen (and I do not know everything) 17th & 18th cen stays were not commonly "quilted". I do know some later Regency era examples I can think of where they were padding the bust. Are you perhaps thinking of "jumps" which is an unboned, sleeveless fitted garment often worn as an additional warmth layer with stays or supposedly occasionally in place of them? Lara aka - Rose www.LaraCorsets.com
LaraCorsets Posted February 5, 2009 Posted February 5, 2009 Mother Rose,I have a question about the assembly of the stays; as in the method you found regarding inserting cane and such. thank you. I delayed in responding because this does not have a simple answer. It all depends on what type of boning you are using, how are constructing the stay, what sort of stay..... it can get very complex really and the maker needs to figure out which method works best for them for that particular stay. I also have to add that in regards to corsets of the Victorian decades and later I have no problem being considered an "expert" as that has long been the focus of my collection and studies. However, for stays of the Regency era and earlier I am NOT comfortable being considered and expert. Yes, I know more than most people but have so much more to study and learn. That all said, here are some of my experiencec and opinions on boning stays: - never use "spiral" steel, it is wrong in every way - flat or enameled steel is not period but has certain benefits. It is the first choice for theatrical period garments because of how firm, flat and easy it is to slide into sewn channels. They are easy to purchase is pre tipped sizes and easy to replace them if necessary. In a full boned stay it can make the garment quite heavy however and it can be difficult to get the small sizes often needed for those little end or tab channels. Most of us who choose to use them are professionals who have just about every size in stock ready to go. - Rigeline, cheap plastic boning and zip-ties.... I suppose if you have NOTHING else available it is better than nothing but it is all wrong in every way. They also do not last for more than one or two wears without warping terribly. You will have to replace it so why waste your time or money in the first place? - High quality German "plastic whalebone".. now that is good stuff! It is so much like real baleen in it's size and flexibility. I use it most often in my accurate reproductions that would have used baleen. I order the smallest size and use occasional pieces of the larger sizes here or there. I custom cut each piece for each channel, round of the ends and use a nail file to make sure it in not at all sharp (sharp rips through fabric). I get mine from Farthingales.com. Highly reccomended for full boned stays especially. In half boned stays do not skimp on the boning and it should do well. - reeds.... I just ordered a bunch from Kass and have yet to work with them. They look good but I haven't an experience with them to share. I just want to have it as an option for my customers to choose. Thee is my two cents for the day. I have to get back to work. I promise to share construction advice later. Lara aka - Rose www.LaraCorsets.com
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