Dorian Lasseter Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 This might be apropriate in a different section, but... What kinds of cheese was around at this time? I can assume Cheddar and Swiss, but there are so many different types of cheese out there... However all those other choices weren't around then. What other 'common food' was there? Aboard ships we talk about salt beef and pork, beans, rice, peas, ships biscuits and cheese. Rarely do I hear of chicken, goose, rabbit, goat or lamb. But there was livestock on many a ship to feed the crew... Truly, D. Lasseter Captain, The Lucy Propria Virtute Audax --- In Hoc Signo Vinces Ni Feidir An Dubh A Chur Ina Bhan Air "If I whet my glittering sword, and mine hand take hold on judgment; I will render vengeance to mine enemies, and will reward them that hate me." Deuteronomy 32:41 Envy and its evil twin - It crept in bed with slander - Idiots they gave advice - But Sloth it gave no answer - Anger kills the human soul - With butter tales of Lust - While Pavlov's Dogs keep chewin' - On the legs they never trust... The Seven Deadly Sins http://www.colonialnavy.org Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCholeBlack Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Cheddar and Gouda are the two cheeses I know off the top of my head that are from the period. Both wax coated at the time too. There's another but it's slipping my mind. English made, named after a region, "discovered" right near the end of period. Ring any bells? Darn, I'll have to go find that reference again. oh oh, and if you want all the way to 1780. I just read a list of foods that a she merchant had for sale in 1740 I think. Off to find that too. (see how taking notes is already helping me ) "If part of the goods be plundered by a pirate the proprietor or shipmaster is not entitled to any contribution." An introduction to merchandize, Robert Hamilton, 1777Slightly Obsessed, an 18th Century reenacting blog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. Sterling Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 The first written reference to Stilton cheese was in William Stukeley’s Itinerarium Curiosum, letter V, dated October 1722. Other references made about the same time clearly indicate that Stilton was a hot item even then. Double Gloucester cheese made since the sixteenth century and Cheshire is mentioned in the Domesday book. According to Food and Cooking in 18th century Britain History and Recipes, by Jennifer Stead for English Heritage... with the improvement in transportation, the above cheese were becoming widely known. "I being shot through the left cheek, the bullet striking away great part of my upper jaw, and several teeth which dropt down the deck where I fell... I was forced to write what I would say to prevent the loss of blood, and because of the pain I suffered by speaking."~ Woodes Rogers Crewe of the Archangel http://jcsterlingcptarchang.wix.com/creweofthearchangel# http://creweofthearchangel.wordpress.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Brand Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 I found this site helpful. some of the dates appear to be off... http://www.geocities.com/lgol27/HistoryCheese.htm History of Cheese Introduction Cheese is one of the most varied and subtle foods in the world. In taste cheese can be bland, buttery, innocuous, rich, creamy, pungent, sharp, salty or lightly delicate. In texture it can be hard enough to chip off in flakes, so soft and runny that it needs to be eaten with a spoon or at any one of a dozen points of softness and firmness between these two extremes. In aroma, cheese can be rank and overpowering enough to turn the stomach of the strongest man (and still be eaten with relish by devotees), delicately aromatic or virtually unnoticeable. Cheese can serve as the perfect companion for wines, a superbly satisfying finale to a gourmet meal or simply as a basic nourishing foodstuff for family snacks. The Start Archaeologists have discovered that as far back as 6000 BC cheese had been made from cow's and goat's milk and stored in tall jars. Egyptian tomb murals of 2000 BC show butter and cheese being made, and other murals which show milk being stored in skin bags suspended from poles demonstrate a knowledge of dairy husbandry at that time. It is likely that nomadic tribes of Central Asia found animal skin bags a useful way to carry milk on animal backs when on the move. Fermentation of the milk sugars would cause the milk to curdle and the swaying motion would break up the curd to provide a refreshing whey drink. The curds would then be removed, drained and lightly salted to provide a tasty and nourishing high protein food, i.e. a welcome supplement to meat protein. Cheesemaking, thus, gradually evolved from two main streams. The first was the liquid fermented milks such as yoghurt, koumiss and kefir. The second through allowing the milk to acidify to form curds and whey. Whey could then be drained either through perforated earthenware bowls or through woven reed baskets or similar material. The Legend Most authorities consider that cheese was first made in the Middle East. The earliest type was a form of sour milk which came into being when it was discovered that domesticated animals could be milked. A legendary story has it that cheese was 'discovered' by an unknown Arab nomad. He is said to have filled a saddlebag with milk to sustain him on a journey across the desert by horse. After several hours riding he stopped to quench his thirst, only to find that the milk had separated into a pale watery liquid and solid white lumps. Because the saddlebag, which was made from the stomach of a young animal, contained a coagulating enzyme known as rennin, the milk had been effectively separated into curds and whey by the combination of the rennin, the hot sun and the galloping motions of the horse. The nomad, unconcerned with technical details, found the whey drinkable and the curds edible. The Jews From Biblical sources we learn that when David escaped across the River Jordan he was fed with 'cheese of kine' (cows) (2 Samuel 17:29), and it is said that he presented ten cheeses to the captain of the army drawn up to do battle with Saul (1 Samuel 17:18). Indeed, records show that there was at one time a location near Jerusalem called 'The Valley of the Cheesemakers'. Clearly, skills had been developed to preserve milk either as an acid-curd based cheese or as a range of lactic cheeses, and fermented milks such as today's unsweetened natural yoghurt. Roman Cheesemaking Learning these techniques, the Romans with their characteristic efficiency were quick to develop cheesemaking to a fine art. Cheesemaking was done with skill and knowledge and reached a high standard. By this time the ripening process had been developed and it was known that various treatments and conditions under storage resulted in different flavours and characteristics. The larger Roman houses had a separate cheese kitchen, the caseale, and also special areas where cheese could be matured. In large towns home-made cheese could be taken to a special centre to be smoked. Written evidence shows clearly how far the Romans had changed the art of cheesemaking:- Homer, ca. 1184 BC, refers to cheese being made in the mountain caves of Greece from the milk of sheep and goats. Indeed one variety called 'Cynthos' was made and sold by the Greeks to the Romans at a price of about 1p per lb. This could well have been the Feta cheese of today. Aristotle, 384 - 322 BC, commented on cheese made from the milk of mares and asses - the Russian 'koumiss' is in fact derived from mare's milk and is fermented to provide an alcoholic content of up to 3%. Varro, ca. 127 BC, had noted the difference in cheeses made from a number of locations and commented on their digestibility. By this time the use of rennet had become commonplace, providing the cheesemaker with far greater control over the types of curd produced. Cheese had started to move from subsistence to commercial levels and could be marketed accordingly. Columella, ca. AD 50, wrote about how to make cheese in considerable detail. Scottish cheesemakers today would be perfectly at home with many of the principles he set out so clearly some 1900 years ago. By AD 300, cheese was being regularly exported to countries along the Mediterranean seaboard. Trade had developed to such an extent that the emperor Diocletian had to fix maximum prices for a range of cheeses including an apple-smoked cheese highly popular with Romans. Yet another cheese was stamped and sold under the brand name of 'La Luna', and is said to have been the precursor of today's Parmesan which was first reported as an individual make of cheese in AD 1579. Thus, Roman expertise spread throughout Europe wherever their empire extended. While the skills remained at first with the landowners and Roman farmers, there is little doubt that in time they also percolated down to the local population. Roman soldiers, who had completed their military service and intermarried with the local populace, set up their 'coloniae' farms in retirement, and may well have passed on their skills in cheesemaking. With the collapse of the Roman Empire around AD 410, cheesemaking spread slowly via the Mediterranean, Aegean and Adriatic seas to Southern and Central Europe. The river valleys provided easy access and methods adopted for production were adapted to suit the different terrain and climatic conditions. Cheesemakers in remote mountainous areas naturally used the milk of goats and sheep. Tribes such as the Helvetica, who had settled in the Swiss Alps, developed their own distinctive types of cheese. They were in fact so successful in doing this that for a period all export of their Emmental cheese was banned. In Central and Eastern Europe the displacement of people through centuries of war and invasion inevitably slowed down developments in cheesemaking until the Middle Ages. Production was often restricted to the more remote mountainous areas where sensible cheesemakers simply kept their heads down and hoped for the best. In the fertile lowlands of Europe dairy husbandry developed at a faster pace and cheesemaking from cows' milk became the norm. Hence, the particular development of cheeses such as Edam and Gouda in the Netherlands. This was much copied elsewhere under a variety of similar names such as Tybo and Fynbo. A hard-pressed cheese, relatively small in size, brine-salted and waxed to reduce moisture losses in storage, proved both marketable and easy to distribute. France developed a wider range of cheeses from the rich agricultural areas in the south and west of that country. By and large,soft cheese production was preferred with a comparatively long making season. Hard-pressed cheese appeared to play a secondary role. To some extent this reflects the Latin culture of the nation, mirroring the cheese types produced in the Mediterranean areas as distinct from the hard-pressed cheese that were developed in the northern regions of Europe for storage and use in the long cold winter months that lay ahead. However, throughout the Dark Ages little new progress was made in developing new cheese types. Middle Ages During the Middle Ages, monks became innovators and developers and it is to them we owe many of the classic varieties of cheese marketed today. During the Renaissance period cheese suffered a drop in popularity, being considered unhealthy, but it regained favour by the nineteenth century, the period that saw the start of the move from farm to factory production. The Development of Some Cheese Varieties with the Date First Recorded Cheese Variety Year(AD) -------------- -------- Gorgonzola 879 Roquefort 1070 Grana 1200 Cheddar 1500 Parmesan 1579 Gouda 1697 Gloucester 1697 Stilton 1785 Camembert 1791 Data compiled from Scott (1986). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Brand Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 The "How to Cook Medieval" site has a page on cheese found here... http://www.godecookery.com/how2cook/howto02.htm "This list includes cheeses that were known during the Middle Ages & Renaissance, along with some 17th century varieties and a few modern cheeses that are acceptable period substitutes. Beaufort Brie Camembert Cheddar - first recorded use is in 1500. Comté Cottage Emmenthal Farmer's - similar in both taste & texture to Medieval cheese. Glouscester - first recorded use is in 1697. Grana - first recorded use is in 1200. Gorgonzola - first recorded use is in 879. Gouda - first recorded use is in 1697. Gruyére Maroilles Mozzarella Parmesan - first recorded use is in 1579. Port-Salut Reblochon Rewen, Rowen, Ruayn - Autumn cheese, made after the cattle had fed on the second growth. This was apparently a semi-soft cheese, but not as soft as a ripe modern Brie: one period recipe says to grate it. It appears to be the same cheese that in France today is called fromage de gaing. See: Tart de Bry Ricotta - for Platina's recipe for ricotta cheese, see: Recocta. Romano Roquefort - first recorded use is in 1070. Spermyse - soft or cream cheese flavored with herbs. Stilton" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCholeBlack Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Colonial Women of Affairs before 1776 by Elisabeth Anthony Dexter has a couple of listings of newspaper advertisements that involve groceries, foods, wines & vegetable seeds for sale. Since you included up to 1780, these might be of some interest! This is from the Boston Evening Post, May 9 1772 To Be Sold Cheap by Mrs. Sheaffe, At her Shop the North Corner of Queen street, lately occupied by Mr. Joshua Green, All Sorts of Groceries, Among which areFresh Jar & Cask Raisins & Currants, Superfine & Common Philadelphia Flour, by the barrell or smaller Quantity. Rice-ground ditto, Brown sugar by the barrell or Less Choice Hyson tea at 20s per the single pound of less by the Quantity; also Some of a superior Quality at 28s. Bohea & Suchong ditto, Coffee by the hundred or less Very fine Chocolate by the box or Pound, Spices, Citron, Almonds, Capers, Olives Anchovies Race & Ground Ginger Pepper Allspice Basket Salt Cayanne Pepper Very fine Mustard Small Philadelphia Rusk by the Keg or Less Split Peas in Bushel Casks, or by the Quart Saltpetre, Single refin'd Loaf Sugar by the Hundred or Loaf, Also, a very excellent Sort of Double ditto in Small Loaves, Florence oil Turkey Figs Sugar Plumbs and Almonds Tamarinds Starch Flax Crown and Hard Soap Hair Powder Kippen's Snuff by the dozen or single bottle Sago, Barley Velvet Corks Oatmeal by the Bushel or smaller Quantity 15 & 18 inch T D Pipes Choice Fresh Indigo Brimestone Allum Copperas Redwood Logwood &c &c. Also choice Frontineac Wine by the Case or Bottle. Playing Cards, and an Assortment of Glass & China Ware. The Above articles are the best of their kind, and she will esteem the Custom of her Friends and the Public as a peculiar kindness. There are a few other similar listings transcribed but Mrs. Sheaffe's is the longest. Then there is this advertisment from the Boston Evening Post March 11, 1751 To be sold by Lydia Dyar at the North End, near The Salutation, The very best of Garden Seeds, early Cabbage, early Lettuce Seeds, early Dutch, early Sugarloaf, ealry Yorkshirt, green Savoy, yello ditto, large winter Cabbage, Colliflower, early Dutch Turnip, round red Turnip, yellow ditto, lage Winter Turnip, three sorts of Carrots, early Charlton Pease, early Hatspur Pease, Marrow fat Pease, Dwarf Pease, all sorts of other Seeds, Windsor Beans, Hotspur Beans, with a variety of fine Flower Seeds, imported in the very last Ship from London. Helpful or excessivly useless information? "If part of the goods be plundered by a pirate the proprietor or shipmaster is not entitled to any contribution." An introduction to merchandize, Robert Hamilton, 1777Slightly Obsessed, an 18th Century reenacting blog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. Sterling Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Do you want things that would be strictly taken on board ship? or something you might find as well in the local inn? "I being shot through the left cheek, the bullet striking away great part of my upper jaw, and several teeth which dropt down the deck where I fell... I was forced to write what I would say to prevent the loss of blood, and because of the pain I suffered by speaking."~ Woodes Rogers Crewe of the Archangel http://jcsterlingcptarchang.wix.com/creweofthearchangel# http://creweofthearchangel.wordpress.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Brand Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Her is a nice little reference on Cheddar... http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/A850754 "Originally made in England, Cheddar takes its name from Cheddar Gorge in Somerset. However, today Cheddar cheeses are manufactured throughout the world. The name is not protected, which has allowed it to be used (and abused) by producers worldwide. According to local legend, creation of the original bit of Cheddar was a happy accident, following the abandonment of a pail of milk (for safety, apparently - there must have been rampant milk-thieves stalking Somerset in those days) in the Cheddar Gorge caves. The milkmaid later returned to find that the milk had been transformed into something else. God only knows what possessed her to eat it. The distinctive flavour of the cheese is said to owe a great deal to the grazing provided by the rich pastures of the Somerset levels. The Cheddar caves, consistently at a temperature of 7°C, were an ideal place to store the cheese in - until a load of rats came along and spoiled the whole show. Cheddar - a Royal Life Whether the milkmaid tale is a load of old pretendy or no, there is no doubt that cheese making was already well-established by the 12th Century - coagulant-loving Henry II declared Cheddar cheese to be the best in Britain and 10240lb (4645kg) of the treasured substance (at a farthing per pound) figures in the king's accounts (the Pipe Roll) in 1170. This is before pizzas or sandwiches were officially invented. He shared the joy with his son, Prince John, who is on record as having bought a load of the stuff in 1184. At the time of the unfortunate Charles I, the parliamentary records show a huge demand for Cheddar - it was sold to the court before it was made, and was only available there. Giant Royal Cheddar Shocker Queen Victoria was once presented with a drum of lovely Cheddar that weighed 11cwt (558kg), formed from the milk of over 700 cows." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorian Lasseter Posted January 3, 2007 Author Share Posted January 3, 2007 Do you want things that would be strictly taken on board ship? or something you might find as well in the local inn? Hmmm.... I was thinking Shipboard Victuals when I began the thread, but am very happy with the general foodstuffs/cheese knowledge imparted thus far... Truly, D. Lasseter Captain, The Lucy Propria Virtute Audax --- In Hoc Signo Vinces Ni Feidir An Dubh A Chur Ina Bhan Air "If I whet my glittering sword, and mine hand take hold on judgment; I will render vengeance to mine enemies, and will reward them that hate me." Deuteronomy 32:41 Envy and its evil twin - It crept in bed with slander - Idiots they gave advice - But Sloth it gave no answer - Anger kills the human soul - With butter tales of Lust - While Pavlov's Dogs keep chewin' - On the legs they never trust... The Seven Deadly Sins http://www.colonialnavy.org Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. Sterling Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 In that case, here's a few quickies... if you want the actual recipe pm me.. 17th century shows recipes for: Dutch Pudding made with lean beef Scotch Collops made with lean lamb or mutton Brawn made with lean pork Chicken Cullis Salads were coming into favour 18th century Plum Pottage: for beef made by all classes Dishes made by Tradesman Class and above: Potted Venison Stewed Venison Jugged Pigeons Oyster Loaves Anchovies with Parmesan Cheese Whole Fish in Pastry Fried Celery Salamangundy oh and Potted Cheshire Cheese with Sherry "I being shot through the left cheek, the bullet striking away great part of my upper jaw, and several teeth which dropt down the deck where I fell... I was forced to write what I would say to prevent the loss of blood, and because of the pain I suffered by speaking."~ Woodes Rogers Crewe of the Archangel http://jcsterlingcptarchang.wix.com/creweofthearchangel# http://creweofthearchangel.wordpress.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hester Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 The first written reference to Stilton cheese was in William Stukeley’s Itinerarium Curiosum, letter V, dated October 1722. Other references made about the same time clearly indicate that Stilton was a hot item even then. And, as a point of literary piratical interest, one of those other early references was by Daniel Defoe in 1727: http://www.stiltoncheese.com/UK/pr/uk.cfm ... leading me to christen my breakfast concoction of a half English muffin "island", topped with Stilton and grilled under the broiler, upon which is then stranded a poached egg, "Eggs Defoe". Cheers, Hester ... who knows what her breakfast will be tomorrow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hester Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 half English muffin "island", topped with Stilton and grilled under the broiler, upon which is then stranded a poached egg, "Eggs Defoe".Cheers, Hester ... who knows what her breakfast will be tomorrow! Turns out that we were out of English muffins, so instead, I had Stilton with leftover Xmas fruitcake for breakfast. But, that got me thinking ... wouldn't fruitcake be period-appropriate shipboard food too? -- Not for the general crew perhaps, but maybe as a personal luxury brought aboard by the officers. Fruitcake is certainly venerable enough, popular in the 17th and 18th centuries. And it's the ultimate durable foodstuff -- soak it in brandy, cover it in marzipan, and you've pretty much embalmed it for a century. Plus, it just tastes better the older it gets! So, is there any documentary evidence of fruitcake being taken on ship voyages during the GAoP? Cheers, Hester Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelsbagley Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 I found this on the web about fruitcake.... Which means it may not be a reliable sourcce.... http://whatscookingamerica.net/History/Cak...s/Fruitcake.htm 1700s - In Europe, a ceremonial type of fruitcake was baked at the end of the nut harvest and saved and eaten the next year to celebrate the beginning of the next harvest, hoping it will bring them another successful harvest. After the harvest, nuts were mixed and made into a fruitcake that was saved until the following year. At that time, previous year's fruitcakes were consumed in the hope that its symbolism would bring the blessing of another successful harvest. Also I found this timeline of foods which may be interesting to some... http://www.foodtimeline.org/ Again a web source, so it could use some primary source confirmation... I randomly checked a few of the links on the timeline, I found at least one of the links leads to a photocopy/scna/photo of a newspaper article that is dated to 1685, and at a glance most of the other links seem to cite sources... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 If you're looking for GAoP shipboard cheeses the Royal Navy specified a ration of Suffolk cheese, or 2/3 the weight in Cheshire cheese. Suffolk cheese is ideal for long voyages in every respect but one: it is cheap, it is durable (by which I mean it's very hard), it doesn't go off easily. The downside to it is that it's apparently vile and nobody liked it - I've never eaten it myself, but apparently Pepys' servants refused to. Cheshire cheese is more expensive, crumbly, and not especially long lasting, but it does have the distinct advantage of being lovely... especially with a slice or two of Granny Smith. Foxe"With this Fore-Staff he fansies he does Wonders, when, God knows, it amounts to no more but only to solve that simple Question, Where are we? Which every chi'd in London can tell you." - Ned Ward The Wooden World Dissected, 1707ETFox.co.uk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Maria Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Cheshire cheese is more expensive, crumbly, and not especially long lasting, but it does have the distinct advantage of being lovely... especially with a slice or two of Granny Smith. Alos it melts beautifully and is good for Welsh Rarebit. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Thankyou Maria, I believe I now know what I'll be having for dinner tonight :) Foxe"With this Fore-Staff he fansies he does Wonders, when, God knows, it amounts to no more but only to solve that simple Question, Where are we? Which every chi'd in London can tell you." - Ned Ward The Wooden World Dissected, 1707ETFox.co.uk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Maria Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Glad to oblige Ed! I might even make it myself tonight! Hmmm I do have that bottle of Pirrat Ale that went flat... BTW anyone have a good recipe for Welsh Rarebit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelsbagley Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Since this talk has digressed a bit, I have a friend who has been pining over a good Welsh Rarebit recipe for some time... I helped her look around online for such a thing a short time ago, and we did find a few receipes, but I'm not sure if any of them were quite right. If any of you would be willing to share your recipe, I'm sure my friend would greatly appreciate it. I may even give it a go myself. You can Private message me the recipe, or if you would prefer post it in the appropriate section of the pub as I'm sure there would be others that would appreciate it as well.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. Sterling Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 From Colonial Williamsburg: Chowning's Tavern Welsh Rabbit with Beer Welsh rabbit, or rarebit, has nothing to do with rabbit, but it is indeed a rare bit. There are quite different versions of its origin. Although Welsh by name, the "rabbit" is traditionally Old English, made from Cheddar or Cheddar type cheese produced for centuries at Cheddar in the English West Country, quite a step away from the Welsh border. In 1774 Mrs. Hannah Glasse, in her Art of Cookery Made Plain and Easy, advised: "Toast the bread on both sides, then toast the Cheese on one side, lay it on the Toast and with a hot Iron brown the other side." Another English cookbook makes this instruction clearer: "hold the red-hot fire shovel over it." 1 tablespoon butter 1 pound sharp Cheddar cheese, grated 3/4 cup beer, divided dash of cayenne pepper or Tabasco sauce 1 teaspoon dry mustard 1/2 teaspoon salt 1/2 teaspoon Worcestershire Sauce 1 egg, slightly beaten 1 teaspoon cornstarch melt the butter in the top of a double boiler. Add the cheese and all but 1 tablespoon of beer. Cook over hot, not boiling, water until the cheese melts. Combine the seasonings with the remaining tablespoon of beer and stir into the cheese. Combine the slightly beaten egg with the cornstarch; stir into the cheese mixture and let it thicken slightly. Server immediately over toast or broiled tomato halves. serves 4 "I being shot through the left cheek, the bullet striking away great part of my upper jaw, and several teeth which dropt down the deck where I fell... I was forced to write what I would say to prevent the loss of blood, and because of the pain I suffered by speaking."~ Woodes Rogers Crewe of the Archangel http://jcsterlingcptarchang.wix.com/creweofthearchangel# http://creweofthearchangel.wordpress.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelsbagley Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Thanks for sharing the recipe Cpt. Sterling! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matty Bottles Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 In a side note, I remember reading that the OED says the earliest name of the dish was, indeed, 'rabbit,' as a slur at the Welsh, who apparently couldn't afford - or were not skilled enough to catch - to eat rabbit. 'Rarebit' is actually the corrupted term, although a corruption of a slang term, nonetheless. Well, now that I've watsed some band width, I'm going to eat some grilled cheese. "The time was when ships passing one another at sea backed their topsails and had a 'gam,' and on parting fired guns; but those good old days have gone. People have hardly time nowadays to speak even on the broad ocean, where news is news, and as for a salute of guns, they cannot afford the powder. There are no poetry-enshrined freighters on the sea now; it is a prosy life when we have no time to bid one another good morning." - Capt. Joshua Slocum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hester Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Mmmm... Welsh Rarebit! I have a brass toasting fork with a Robin Hood finial that we could use to toast the bread over the fireplace. Cheers, Hester ... who prefers her rarebit on English muffins. Do they date to the GAoP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Tightpants Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 You really can't go wrong with this book. It is my absolute favorite. You can also click here for a facsimile online, though you'll have to page through it. Gode Cookery has already been mentioned, and is a good place to great receipts. While it admittedly has a medieval slant, it has a nice glossary and a bunch of C17 English receipts. Here is a facsimile of Gervase Markham, ca. 1675. Markham's English Huswife was first published in 1615. English cookery didn't progress much in the 17th century; indeed, there wasn't much change until the 19th century (this was predominantly economic in origin, but that's extremely detailed and extremely boring). Try this PDF for some interesting plain facts about food and eating during the period. (PDF) Someone asked about English Muffins. "English muffins" as Americans know them today are most closely connected with the ancient Welsh tradition of cooking small round yeast cakes known as bara (bread) maen (stone) on bakestones. "English muffins" were later cooked on griddles, as opposed to muffin tins. Crumpets, scones & tea cakes are very closely related to English muffins. See English Bread and Yeast Cookery, pp. 341-361 and Food and Drink in Britain From the Stone Age to the 19th Century, C. pp. 229-274. The English muffin is round and made from a soft yeast-leavened dough enriched with milk and butter. It is usually cooked on a griddle, which gives it a flat, golden-brown top and bottom, and a white band around the waste and a light, spongy interior...This method appears as early as 1747 and was recommended by Hannah Glasse. ---Oxford Companion to Food, Alan Davidson [Oxford University Press:Oxford] 1999 Mrs. Glasse's original recipe was not called English muffins. She also includes instructions for proper opening (warning: do not use a knife). To make Muffings and Oat-CakesTo a Buschel of Hertfordshire white Flour, take a Pint and a half of good Ale-yeast, from pale Malt if you can get it, becuase it is whitest; let the Yeast lie in Water all night, the next Day pour off the Water clear, make two Gallons of Water just Milk warm, not to scald your Yeast, and two Ounces of Salt, mix your Water, Yeast and Salt well toghether for about a quarter of an Hour, then strain it, and mix up your Dough as light as possible, and let it lie in your Trough an Hour to rise, then with your Hand roll it, and pull it into little Pieces about as big as a large Walnut, roll them with your Hand like a Ball, lay them on your Table, and as fast as you do them lay a Piece of Flannel over them, and be sure to keep your Dough cover'd with Flannel; when you have rolled out all your Dough, begin to bake the first, and by that Time they will be spread out in the right Form; lay them on your Iron, as one Side begins to change Colour turn the other, and take great Care they don't burn, or be too much discolour'd; but that you will be a Judge off in two or three Makings. Take care the middle of the Iron is not too hot, as it will be, but then you may put a Brick-bat or two in the middle of the Fire to slacken the heat. The Thing you bake on must be made thus. Build a Place just as if you was going to set a Copper, and in the Stead of a Copper a Piece of Iron all over the Top fix'd in Form, just the frame as the Bottom of the Iron Pot, and make your Fire underneath with Coal as in a Copper; observe, Muffings are made in the same Way, only this, when you pull them to Pieces roll them in a good deal of Flour, and with a Rolling-pin roll them thin, cover them with a Piece of Flannel, and they will rise to a proper Thickness; and if you find them too big or too little, you must roll Dough accordingly, these must not be the least discoloured. And when you eat them, toast them with a Fork crisp on both Sides, then with your Hand pull them open, and they will be like a Honey-Comb; lay in as much Butter as you intend to use, then clap them together again, and set it by the Fire, when you think the Butter is melted turn them, that both Sides may be butter'd alike, but ton't touch them with a Knife, either to spread or cut them open, if you do they will be as heavy as Lead, only when they are quite butter'd and done, you may cut them across with a Knife. ---The Art of Cookery Made Plain & Easy, Hannah Glasse, facismile first edition 1747 [Prospect Books:Devon] 1995 (p. 151) Thomas' brand English muffins were introduced to New York City in the late 19th century: Although tea muffins that were once popular in England resembled the American "English muffin," there is no single muffin in Britain by this specific name [...] Most of the store-bought varieties [of English muffin] derive from those made by the S. B. Thomas Company of New York, whose founder, Samuel Bath Thomas, emigrated from England in 1875 with his mother's recipe and began making muffins at his Ninth Avenue bakery in 1880. The name was first printed in 1925. ---Encyclopedia of American Food and Drink, John F. Mariani [Lebhar-Friedman:New York] 1999 (p. 123) So no, English muffins are a bit late for GAoP. But you can have them for F&I and AWI! I like mine toasted and slathered with butter. Call me when they're done. Stand and deliver! Robert Fairfax, Freelance Rapscallion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. Sterling Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 Some interesting new developments in England during the 17th century were the invention of the pudding cloth during the early part of the century, Denys Papin's ingenious culinary invention the digester or pressure cooker (circa 1682), and ice cream which began to be made around the early 1660s... also the use of salads were seen on the table with increasing frequency. P. Brears, Food and Cooking in 17th Century Britain History and Recipes... for English Heritage. "I being shot through the left cheek, the bullet striking away great part of my upper jaw, and several teeth which dropt down the deck where I fell... I was forced to write what I would say to prevent the loss of blood, and because of the pain I suffered by speaking."~ Woodes Rogers Crewe of the Archangel http://jcsterlingcptarchang.wix.com/creweofthearchangel# http://creweofthearchangel.wordpress.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Not to mention experiments with frozen chicken :) Foxe"With this Fore-Staff he fansies he does Wonders, when, God knows, it amounts to no more but only to solve that simple Question, Where are we? Which every chi'd in London can tell you." - Ned Ward The Wooden World Dissected, 1707ETFox.co.uk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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