Rayon = Natural Fiber?

[Captain Bob]

I've heard on several websites now that rayon is considered a "period" or "natural" fiber when it comes to period costume. I just don't get that. According to several different sources, rayon was the first artificial (that is, man-made) fiber and it was invented in (depending upon your source) 1892 or 1910.

I would like to point out that the GAOP and the renaissance both preceded the invention of rayon. What's the deal, then? Is rayon so very similar to some other period fiber that it will pass even close inspection? Why does rayon get a pass?

~~Captain Redd Roberts (the pyrate formerly known as 'Cap'n Bob").

[callenish gunner]

rayon is not now nor never will be a natural fiber and any lubber telling you that is full of shite ....(stupid people!!!)

[blackjohn]

ok, this is just from memory without fact checking, but I seem to recall rayon is a natural fiber in that it is made from... wood pulp??? But the process to create it is late 19thC. So yeah, the it is natural, but the processing is pretty high tech. Now let me go fact check to see if I got any of that right.

[blackjohn]

pretty close...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rayon

[kass]

Well, okay. Here's the scoop:

Rayon is made from sawdust and the leftovers from the cotton spinning process. So the ingredients that go into it are, indeed, natural.

But the process by which it is made into thread is a modern, chemical process, similar to that by which polyester is made.

Rayon first came into use in the late 19th century (around the 1870s I think) as a substitute for silk. It gained wide popularity during the war years when silk was rationed for parachutes. Nowadays, you're most likely to find it used as a fake linen.

But "period fibre" it ain't. It's not even technically a fibre since it has to be "glued" together, after a fashion, to be made into thread to weave.

So if it comes to choosing between a polyester brocade and a rayon brocade, the rayon brocade will breathe and I would choose it. But the stuff is hell to work with and I'd really rather search around and find real silk.

[Capt. Sterling]

I've heard on several websites now that rayon is considered a "period" or "natural" fiber when it comes to period costume. I just don't get that. According to several different sources, rayon was the first artificial (that is, man-made) fiber and it was invented in (depending upon your source) 1892 or 1910.

I would like to point out that the GAOP and the renaissance both preceded the invention of rayon. What's the deal, then? Is rayon so very similar to some other period fiber that it will pass even close inspection? Why does rayon get a pass?

~~Captain Redd Roberts (the pyrate formerly known as 'Cap'n Bob").

Many American Civil War folks say that modern day rayon very closely "copies" the silk for gowns of their time period... so many units actually allow it to be used... in other words, the texture and "hang" of the fabric is very close to the actual silks used during the ACW. But it still is NOT an actual fabric used during that period and it was certainly not around during the GAoP.

Now, maybe Kass can tell you if it would pass for silk of the GAoP time frame, if you are just going for the "look" but not the authenticity...but from what I've seen of silks myself so far, first hand, from slightly later and through out the 18th century, I would say no.

But honestly, save your pennies, there is NOTHING like using the real product for your kit... and you'll sleep better at night!

[kass]

Rayon doesn't feel like silk, it doesn't wear like silk, and it is a cast-iron bitch to sew. I hate the stuff. Some polyesters more accurately replicate silk than rayons do.

That being said, I have used rayon in the past to replicate silk. Get this. I was doing research on Rev War era silk brocades imported from China. They were woven with floral patterns specifically for the Western European market (so they didn't look "Chinoise"). The fabric width was 29" wide and they had three pattern repeats across the width.

Earlier that year, I got ten yards of a discontinued silk/rayon brocade (22% silk/78% rayon) on sale. I was going to make a lounging robe for my husband.

Just for shits and giggles, I decided to measure the brocade and see how close it came to period silk brocades. Guess what! It was 29" wide with three pattern repeats across the width! And it was imported from China!

Needless to say, Bob didn't get his lounging robe...

Sneezed all the while I sewed it. But does it look right? You tell me:

100% silk brocade is extremely difficult to find. And when we do find it, it usually has some Asian design or some other pattern that is distinctly not appropriate for the GAoP (or medieval or Rev War, etc.). There are some companies selling repro historical brocades, but they start at $150 a yard. Therefore some companies have made cotton/rayon copies of the historical brocades and they shake out at a much lesser price. They breathe like natural fibres (because they are) and they look like silk to everyone but... well... me. I'm looking into acquiring some right now as a matter of fact.

Funny story: at the Pirate Invasion at MD Ren Fest last year, I asked a lady if I could sit down and have a cup of water. She gracious said yes and lent me her own tankard. But then she took my hunting coat between her fingers and said, "Natural fibres would do you a kindness, my dear..." I flipped up the hem of my skirts and showed her where "100% silk" was woven into the selvedge of the fabric.

Just because it breathes doesn't mean it's cool. Silk is an insulator. Wool is cooler!

[Rumba Rue]

Gorgeous dress Kass. Is there a front view?

Silk sucks. It doesn't breath and here in Calif. where the heat index is high, you don't want to use it.

I have a really nice black silk shirt I found at a thrift store to use for some costume stuff, gads, is it hot!

[MadMike]

Try burning a sample of it, if it melts then it contains synthetic materials.

That being said, if it passes the "natural materials" test then I don't give a hoot (I use only natural materials in my garments anyway).

However, we should keep in mind that most modern replica weapons are made using five axis pantograph machines and modern electric lathes (don't forget those diesels on tall ships!).

Yours, Mike

[kass]

Gorgeous dress Kass. Is there a front view?

Sure is, Rue. It just isn't full length:

[Rumba Rue]

Thanks Kass! That dress is scruptious!