Wartooth Posted January 20, 2005 Share Posted January 20, 2005 Am looking for evidence of Prussian names on crew lists and such. Have yet to come across anything. See plenty of scottish, english, dutch, etc ... but no German. Any help is greatly appreciated. Wartooth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Posted January 20, 2005 Share Posted January 20, 2005 Are you looking for any particular period? Specifically golden age or pirates in general? Also, do they have to be definitely Prussian or will German names suffice? Foxe"With this Fore-Staff he fansies he does Wonders, when, God knows, it amounts to no more but only to solve that simple Question, Where are we? Which every chi'd in London can tell you." - Ned Ward The Wooden World Dissected, 1707ETFox.co.uk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tudor MercWench Smith Posted January 20, 2005 Share Posted January 20, 2005 I'd too be intersted in this, being mainly of German/Prussian desent meself. It'd be great if there were german pirates . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coastie04 Posted January 20, 2005 Share Posted January 20, 2005 There was a post about a German pirate, Klaus Stoertebeker, not too long ago. German Pirate Skull Don't know if there's much in the way of his crew's names. Coastie She was bigger and faster when under full sail With a gale on the beam and the seas o'er the rail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wartooth Posted January 20, 2005 Author Share Posted January 20, 2005 Are you looking for any particular period? Specifically golden age or pirates in general?Also, do they have to be definitely Prussian or will German names suffice? Any time period from Golden Age through the War of 1812. Doesn't have to be Prussian. However, most german sailors of that time would most likely be from the Prussian state due to its proximity to the coastlines. I sort of doubt that any sailing men originated in Bavaria or Saxony ... but who knows? Wartooth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Posted January 20, 2005 Share Posted January 20, 2005 What I really meant was that if one finds a German name in a crew list, but with no other information it would be difficult to say whether that person was Prussian or not. You might start with the voyage of George Shelvocke. In order to legitimise his letters of marque from the Holy Roman Emporer he signed on 90 Flemings, but there's a good chance of a few Germans amongst them. Klaus Stortebaker is too early if you want post Golden Age people. the following names are gathered from a post by Jan Maat on the Pirate Origins thread of Piratesinfo.com I have removed all non German names Here are some names of a lot of pirates who mutineered on board the dutch East India ship Nijenburg in 1763. The mutiny had many phases, and the two lists below show the people put on trials in either Holland or in Surinam. The two groups of people parted in Brazil, that is why they went different places: The ones who ventured into Brazil were rounded up by the governor of Pernambuco and handed over to the dutch. The other group sought refugee in french Cayenne, but were discovered and handed over to the dutch in Suriname. IN HOLLAND: Simon Ahlberg, 18, sailor, Germany, sentenced to hanging; hanged. Jacob Boos, 18, sailor, Germany, sentenced to hanging; hanged. Jan Michel Heydigsvelt, 20, sailor, Germany, sentenced to hanging; hanged. George Jacob Koot, 23, sailor, Germany, sentenced to hanging; hanged. Frederik Stijssel, 18, sailor, Germany, sentenced to hangin; lashed, burnmarked, lost his wage, banished. Albert Anthonie Eksteyn, 17, drummer, Germany, sentenced to death; lashed, lost his wage, banished. Jan Christoffel Behr, 21, sailor, Germany, sentenced to hanging; hanged. Johan Jacob Brouwer, ca. 23, soldier, Germany. Sentenced to hanging; hanged. Frans Cramer, 30, sailor, Germany. Sentenced to hanging; hanged. George Cremer, 22, sailor, Germany. Sentenced to breaking on the wheel; hanged. Johann Croos, 28, soldier?, Germany. Sentenced to breaking on the wheel; broken on the wheel. Anthonie Everhardi, 22, sailor, Germany. Sentenced to breaking on the wheel; hanged. Frederik Heyzer, 25, sailor, Germany. Sentenced to breaking on the wheel; hanged. Adam Tewinger, ca. 25, sailor, Germany. Sentenced to hanging; hanged. Andreas Zirchel, ca. 20, sailor, Germany. Sentenced to breaking on the wheel; broken on the wheel. Godfried Gebhardt, 24, sailor, Germany. Sentenced to 3 times keelhauling, 200 lashes, and public humiliation; 3 times keelhauled, 200 lashes, banished. Johannes Wijant, 20, soldier, Germany. Sentenced to death; Thrown 3 times from the main mast, 150 lashes, banished. August Schenk, 19, sailor, Germnay. Sentenced to death; released. IN SURINAME AUGUST - SEPTEMBER 1764: Johan Sigismund Ihsle, 25, soldier, Germany. Beheaded. Frederik Adolf, ca. 42, quartermaster, Germany. Hanged, then beheaded. Koenraad Felt, ca. 32, sailor, Germany. Hanged, then beheaded. Cornelis Poelij, 23, soldier, Germany. Hanged, then beheaded. Jacob Schneider, 21, steward, Germany. Hanged, then beheaded. Karel Scholtz, 40, soldier, Germany. Hanged, then beheaded. Hendrik Hoebert, 27, soldier, Germany. Lashed, lost his wage and had to pay remedies. Hans Jürgen Heysler, 24, sailor, Germany. Free of guilt, released, lost wages. Paulus Frantsz, 24, sailor, Germany. Free of guilt, released, lost wages. Jan Otto Liep, ca. 18, soldier, Germany. Free of guilt, released. Coenraad Wedeking, ca. 28, soldier, Germany. Free of guilt, released. Others: Johan Godfried Wolman, soldier, Germany. I don't know what happened to him. The information is gahered from Bruijn, J. R. & van Eyck van Heslinga, E. S.: Muiterij. Oproer en berichting op schepen van de VOC (Bussum 1980) Foxe"With this Fore-Staff he fansies he does Wonders, when, God knows, it amounts to no more but only to solve that simple Question, Where are we? Which every chi'd in London can tell you." - Ned Ward The Wooden World Dissected, 1707ETFox.co.uk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wartooth Posted January 21, 2005 Author Share Posted January 21, 2005 Thank you, Foxe. That is a big help. Most of the names listed are Dutch, but several are indeed German. :) Wartooth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wartooth Posted January 21, 2005 Author Share Posted January 21, 2005 Hmmm ... just noticed a Jacob Schneider listed. There was a lad by that name in my geneology research on my father's side of the family. Born mid-18thC, but no record of a death or marriage. Coincidence? Yeah, probably. Wartooth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mission Posted January 21, 2005 Share Posted January 21, 2005 For what it's worth, here is the whole listing of Germanic pirates from the piratesinfo.com Pirate Nationalities (Origins) thread that I started in the Scholarly forum. (This is the post that Foxe is referring to - it was built by many posters over the course of about a year and is still building. I've been thinking about copying the whole thing over here and notifying everyone who helped my build it that I am running a new thread on it...but the entire original thread is quite long, as you can imagine.) -GERMANY- Adolf, Frederik ++ Ahlberg, Simon ++ Behr, Jan Christoffel ++ Berkelich+ Bernevor+ Beydenstorp+ Bodijn, Jean ++ Boniface, Klaus + Boos, Jacob ++ Brouwer, Johan Jacob ++ Crabbe, Henning + Cramer, Frans ++ Crekauwe+ Cremer, George ++ Croos, Johann ++ de Ruyter, Paulus ++ Degenert+ Eksteyn, Albert Anthonie ++ Everhardi, Anthonie ++ Felt, Koenraad ++ Femeer, Nicholas + Foucquet, Anthonie ++ Frantsz, Paulus ++ Fronder, Jacob ++ Gebhardt, Godfried ++ Grubendal, Fikke + Grubendal, Henneke + Gunnar+ Gylge, Nicolaus + Hanslein/Henszlein, Klaus [Little Jack]* Henszlein , Klein Heydigsvelt, Jan Michel ++ Heysler, Hans Jürgen ++ Heyzer, Frederik ++ Hoebert, Hendrik ++ Hoffmann, Hans + Hovenschild, Kord + Howfoote, Hans + Howfoote, Peter + Ihsle, Johan Sigismund ++ Ketelheud+ Kieffer, Peter ++ Knut, Dietliff + Koot, George Jacob ++ Kraseke+ Kremer, Rode + Kule+ Liep, Jan Otto ++ Meygendorp, Hans + Milies, Nicholas + Myres, Klaus + Norman, Henning + Pacqué, Johannes ++ Pilgrimson, Everade + Poelij, Cornelis ++ Prybe+ Rainbek+ Ransouwe, Luder + Rantzow, Eler + Sanewitze, Rambold + Scharbouwe, Henneke + Scheld, Klaus + Schenk, August ++ Schiffer, Josef + Schneider, Jacob ++ Scholtz, Karel ++ Schonenberg+ Schutke, Heyno + Schutke, Olav + Sedorp, Hartwich + Skinkel, Lydeke + Sleyre, Gerhardt + Sprokkel, Joseph ++ Staal, Hendrik ++ Stijssel, Frederik ++ Stokeled, Bertram + Störtebeker, Klaus Talong, Jean Louis ++ Tewinger, Adam ++ Tidemanns, Heinrich + Tymme, Klaus + Valck, Joseph ++ van den Berg, Heinrich + van Gelder, Hans + van Mezee, Bertholt + van Mezee, Henneke + van Pomeren, Heinrich + Voet, Bartolomaeus + von der Loewe, Johann + von der, Heinrich Luhe+ von Kaland, Bosse + von Luchow, Heinrich + von Luchow+ von Manteuffel, Henning + von Moltke+ von Preen, Gottschalk + von Rumpshagen, Leopold + von Stuck, Arnold + von Wethemonkule, Hans + Wedeking, Coenraad ++ Wedige, Schiffer + Wessels, Godeke /Godeke Michels Wigbold+ Wijant, Johannes ++ Wilmer+ Wisle, Godekin + Wolman, Johan Godfried ++ Wrede, Volmer + Wyttekop+ Zilkauw+ Zirchel, Andreas ++ Zwarte, Klaus + * New pirates added thanks to research by poster Silver Steele - see Silver Steele's post (at piratesinfo.com) for further information. + New pirates added thanks to poster Marcus. From various books, including _Orkneyinga Saga_ & Alan Orr Anderson's source material (twelfth-century pirates and earlier); _Early Sources in Scottish History_ & _Scottish Annals from English Chroniclers_ (pirates up to 1286); _Calendar of Scottish Papers_ & _Pitcairn's Criminal Trials_ (16th Century pirates); Eric Graham's _Maritime History of Scotland_ (post 16th century pirates). See Marcus' post below for more detailed dates and information. German pirates added from the book _Seekriege der Hanse_. ++ Prates added thanks to poster Jan Maat. From the book _Oproer en berichting op schepen van de VOC_ by J. R. Bruijn & van Eyck and E. S. van Heslinga. See Jan's posts below for a great deal more information on these pirates. More pirates added from _Jan (or Juan) Mendoza's navigation-book_ (http://www.kb.dk/elib/mss/treasures/verden/53_33.htm). Added pirates to ENGLAND, SCOTLAND, WALES, IRELAND and DENMARK from the book _John Gow - The Orkney Pirate_, by George Watson. Mycroft: "My brother has the brain of a scientist or a philosopher, yet he elects to be a detective. What might we deduce about his heart?" John: "I don't know." Mycroft: "Neither do I. But initially he wanted to be a pirate." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Posted January 21, 2005 Share Posted January 21, 2005 Mission, I didn't post the whole list because a lot of those names are medieval and renaissance pirates which Marcus contributed. Also, if you brought the list over here you'd only need to bring the first post, including the editorial notes, the rest of the messages would then be redundant. Wartooth, I deleted all the names that were Dutch, those left should all be of German nationality even if their names sound Dutch Foxe"With this Fore-Staff he fansies he does Wonders, when, God knows, it amounts to no more but only to solve that simple Question, Where are we? Which every chi'd in London can tell you." - Ned Ward The Wooden World Dissected, 1707ETFox.co.uk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mission Posted January 21, 2005 Share Posted January 21, 2005 Perhaps the Dutch pirates should be removed from the German pirate list, then? I thought these were all German pirates! There's a seperate category for Dutch pirates in the original post... Or are you referring to Jan's post? I agree Foxe, only the first post would be relevant. I'm still not decided on bringing it over, though. It's awfully long... I'd like the folks over here to have a look at it though. Maybe we can fill in more names. : Mycroft: "My brother has the brain of a scientist or a philosopher, yet he elects to be a detective. What might we deduce about his heart?" John: "I don't know." Mycroft: "Neither do I. But initially he wanted to be a pirate." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Posted January 21, 2005 Share Posted January 21, 2005 You want MORE names?!?! You're clearly mad sir! {For those who haven't seen the full list the German section Mission posted is one of the shorter ones...} Foxe"With this Fore-Staff he fansies he does Wonders, when, God knows, it amounts to no more but only to solve that simple Question, Where are we? Which every chi'd in London can tell you." - Ned Ward The Wooden World Dissected, 1707ETFox.co.uk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wartooth Posted January 21, 2005 Author Share Posted January 21, 2005 Wartooth, I deleted all the names that were Dutch, those left should all be of German nationality even if their names sound Dutch Sorry, most of the names are indeed Dutch ... or at least Flemish. I studied Dutch and German for a couple of years (still learning German). But I can't thank you boys enough. This was a tremendous help. Wartooth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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