Quartermasters - the evidence

[Jack Roberts]

Hey Mission can you explain that first sentence? Conditions of the Roving? Filibusters? I'm a little lost.

[michaelsbagley]

Hey Mission can you explain that first sentence? Conditions of the Roving? Filibusters? I'm a little lost.

I'm going to go out on a limb here, but since the book was translated from French, "Filibuster" in French is an equally appropriate term for "pirate" or "privateer". "Conditions of the Roving" is likely in reference to conditions for engaging in the act of Privateering or Pirating. I hope I am correct in my assumption, but as Mission has the book, his take may clear things up more.

[Mission]

Filibuster is (as I understand it) the French word for privateer. Labat is outlining the conditions for becoming a French privateer. (There is more following the above quote about what a man is paid for losing a limb, digit, eye, etc. which I didn't reprint.) Note that he later calls crews who are just taking any ship pirates, so there is definitely a difference between a pirate and a filibuster in this book.

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Thinking more on what I quoted, I would guess that this statement is probably the source of the idea that the QM is second in rank to the captain since it's the only place I've seen it so baldly stated. What this means to the QM position vis-a-vis the GAoP pirates is impossible to pinpoint, though. On the one hand, it could be that modern pirate authors have taken this statement and just applied it to every GAoP pirate group, which is sloppy. OTOH, as Littleneckhalfshell alluded in the Religion during the GAoP thread, with Buccaneers, filibusters and pirates most likely consorting in the safe Caribbean ports, the idea could have filtered through the various groups as being a good one and been applied broadly amongst them. This is all if Labat's statement (which is pretty sweeping) is truly accurate for every filibuster crew.

Which is all just more proof of my dictum that the more period 'facts' you uncover about pirates from 300+ years ago, the less certain you actually become of anything. For example, I think it's really funny that some of the pirates and privateers were so piously religious (Er, after a fashion. See the above linked thread.) despite the fact that many people think they were all a bunch of atheists. At the bottom of all this, people are people, they are creative and thinking creatures. Put in the same situation, different people will do different things. (Rules are made to be broken, especially by people like pirates. And even that is a generalization!)

[Jack Roberts]

Thanks Mickey and Mission (ooohh alliteration)! I'm interested in the topic so my persona is correct and it seems to fit with my character's situation. (I'm Quartermaster of the Archangel and the Archangel is a privateer) We've talked that Jack would be the second in command and taking care of the stowage aboard ship. (ie loading and unloading) I was concerned that maybe I was inaccurately portraying the QM but kind of info helps to confirm I'm on the right track. Especially for a Privateering vessel.

[Mission]

Jack, I've been tweaking Foxe a bit on this. This is mostly because we've actually been discussing it... well, he's been complaining about it and I have been reading his complaints about it... ever since he started talking about creating his own website back in our bad old piratesinfo daze.

That aside, his site is one of the better sources for accurate, researched info on such things IMO. He provides a nice outline of the QMs job here. Just ignore all his opining about the extra duties of a QM. (But if you really want to be safe, I wouldn't assume that what's being discussed here will necessarily be true for every crew as it doesn't seem to have been so.)

[Jack Roberts]

The way I understand Foxe's position is a chain of command aboard a "Pirate Ship". I'm looking at a Privateering vessel, one owned by the Capt'n. From what I've gathered in this thread and Foxe's site (Thanls for the Linky Mission.) It's seems plausible to have a powerful QM in my persona's situation. Please feel free to correct me. (Chime in any time Foxe, )

SO perhaps in the situation of a Capt'n hiring the crew that he wants perhaps the Quartermaster could have extra power aboard. Not a rag tag group of random pirates together. Perhaps I should start to look at merchant vessels and see what QM's were like on them.

[Fox]

The way I understand Foxe's position is a chain of command aboard a "Pirate Ship". I'm looking at a Privateering vessel, one owned by the Capt'n. From what I've gathered in this thread and Foxe's site (Thanls for the Linky Mission.) It's seems plausible to have a powerful QM in my persona's situation. Please feel free to correct me. (Chime in any time Foxe, )

SO perhaps in the situation of a Capt'n hiring the crew that he wants perhaps the Quartermaster could have extra power aboard. Not a rag tag group of random pirates together. Perhaps I should start to look at merchant vessels and see what QM's were like on them.

As noted so often, very few things hold true for all crews. Labat quoted above (thanks Mission) says that the QM was second in command, and evidence of Kidd's privateering venture also suggests a strong QM position. On the other hand Woodes Rogers' circumnavigation included so many officers that it's hard to figure out an actual 'chain of command'. I suspect it depends very much on period; port of origin; and vessel ownership. To take the argument a little further in the wrong direction, QMs in the Royal Navy had plenty of responsibility, but very little actual 'command'.

So, in answer to your question, certainly plausible, but you could equally play it other ways.

[Mission]

This is from Captain England's account in the 3rd Edition of the General History. I don't think it proves anything one way or the other, but I find it interesting that the Captain and QM were both commanding the prisoner, who played James Bond in one movie. (If I remember correctly, the QM had charge of the prisoners according to one account I read.)

"Mr. Lasinby, who was one of Captain Mackra's Officers, and detained, was under the Deck at this Time, and commanded both by the Captain and QuarterMaster of the Pyrates, to tend the Braces on the Booms, in hopes, it was believed, a Shot would take him before they got clear, asking the Reason why he was not there before? And when he would have excused himself, threat'ned on the like Neglect to shoot him, at which the other beginning to expostulate farther, and claim their Promise of putting him ashore, got an unmerciful beating from the Quarter-Master. Captain Taylor, who was now Successor to England [because the pirates deposed England], and whose Priviledge it was to do so, being lame of his Hands and unable." (Johnson, p. 130)