If not Hogarth.... who?

[Gentleman of Fortune]

Maybe this topic might be more for the lumieres than here but....

I have discussed the Golden Age of Piracy with some re-enactors/living historians who are dedicated Hogarth fanatics and base a lot of their impressions off of his work.

Hogarth was born in 1697? and really got started in 1720 with his most popular work from 1730 on.

Being that this is kind of late for Golden Age, and that the Golden Age is between to major fashion trends (Baroque and Roccoco). How much weight should one give Hogarth.

Now I know I am gazing at the navel here but I am kind of curious.

In the Hogarth prints I have seen the stocking are tucked under breeches, the shoe buckles are fairly large etc etc (which are all right on for mid 18th Century).

Anyway.... just curious if anyone had any ideas on this.

BlackJohn? ???

[blackjohn]

That's a d--n fine question. Lets face it, at best he's a decade too late. Which is a shame because my alma mater's library has practically everything he's done.

There are a few earlier artists who I'd consult first... Watteau... Laroon... I believe they are both from the opening decades of the 18thC.

Of course I really do love Hogarth, esp the one of the sailors in the rowboat.

Blackjohn

[kass]

Definitely Laroon! I use his "Cryes" alot and they are used extensively at the 1690s house where I do some volunteer interpretting. He really shows a great cross-section of the population -- from wealthy merchants to people just barely getting by, courtesans to street walkers, dandies to Quakers. It's a great resource for what people wore.

John, I believe Laroon's Cryes are from the final decade of the 17th century. I don't have the exact date here, but something in the 1690s sticks in my multi=period-poisoned brain. :)

[Gentleman of Fortune]

I love you guys!

[blackjohn]

Hoho... thanks. Odd as this may sound, that's the second time this day someone said that, in relation to my piratin' activities. I guess I must be doing something right?!?!

There must be other artists from the period. Let me check my notes.

Blackjohn

[blackjohn]

John, I believe Laroon's Cryes are from the final decade of the 17th century. I don't have the exact date here, but something in the 1690s sticks in my multi=period-poisoned brain. :)

I think you are right about that date. As far as I'm aware, the war is the dividing line for fashion at this point. To my eye, there are noticeable differences before and after.

Blackjohn

[kass]

I love you guys!

The Pirate Brethren thank you! How could we resist helping a Gentleman of Fortune.

Of course if you find any other artists of the period, Gent, please share with us too.

[kass]

To me, John, it's not so much the war as it is the end of the century (of course I don't usually think in terms of wars as dividing lines). In the late 17th century, clothing looked... well... 17th century. Along comes 1700 and the clothing starts to look 18th century. The mantuas start looking like robes anglais. The frock coats start getting wider in the skirts when before they were rather straight-bodied.

It honestly seems a rather natural evolution, but you're right: it takes place abruptly around the time of the war and then progresses much more slowly for the rest of the 18th century. Of course until the French Revolution screws everything up.

I guess a Dutch Duke and a Scottish Prince battling for the Throne of England in an Irish field was just too much cosmic calamity for fashion to bear, eh?

[Gentleman of Fortune]

So... where are the Extant clothes for the 1690-1720 period?

I was kind of dissapointed that the Bath fashion museum and the V &A have a majority of 1750-1790s stuff on display.

Are there any existing sailors clothes from our period?

[kass]

I'm guessing that the extant clothes from our period were recut and made into the extant clothes of the 1750s-1790s. It's just a guess but taking into consideration the gorgeous fabrics and embroidery and brocades and that our frock coats were larger than the frock coats worn in the later half of the 18th century, I'd say clothing wasn't discarded but passed down to later generations and recut. Like I said, though, this is just a guess as to why there is a dearth in this time period.

The only existing sailor's item of clothing of which I know is a linen shirt dating to the ealry 17th century. But frankly, shirts didn't change too much from the 16th through 18th centuries.

I don't know about other sailor's clothing of the period, but I just started looking into civilian fashions myself.