Cumulative Cross-Cultural Considerations & Corsair Crews

[Picaroon Lagoon]

I know, I know… “There are a lot o’ long words in there, miss. We’re naught but humble Pirates”, so I’ll speak plain…. Prompted in part by the recent and excellent discussion on the prevalence of multiple languages in use amongst Pirates, and in part by some recent projects and discussions that were influenced by other cultures. I wonder how much cross-cultural ‘borrowing’ likely occurred amongst well traveled Pirates. I’m reminded for instance of Bligh’s crew of the Bounty taking up Tahitian customs such as tattoos, it may also be fair to say Dampier ‘brought back’ new customs that remain part of our western culture even today, but to what extent? Do we have examples of Pirates adopting ‘primitive’ technologies (the way Columbus’ adopted the use of hammocks for his return voyage)? 
 

I won’t go on ad nauseam, but I welcome any discussion, as I think this may prove an interesting topic much like our previous discourse on linguistic variations. 

[Mary Diamond]

Truly, you do bring such interesting topics to bear! Please do continue 😊

[Picaroon Lagoon]

10 hours ago, Mary Diamond said:

Truly, you do bring such interesting topics to bear! Please do continue 😊

Thank you for saying so; I truly appreciate your positive feedback! A few recent posts didn’t seem to gain much (if any) traction and I was (almost) becoming discouraged. 
 

With regards to the topic above, it was borne from some recent activities, experiences, and discussions…. For example, I recently crafted a recreation of the primitive tranquilizer dart that the Pelegosto warrior shoots into the neck of William Turner Jr. In the film ‘Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Man’s Chest’ and it got me thinking….. Even though my project was based in pop-culture and fantasy, I actually did do research into various darts used by various indigenous, primitive, tribal peoples and during all of this I began to wonder…. How much and/or how often did similar exposure to native peoples affect and/or influence true historical Pirates who encountered them? We all know that the Buccaneers were so named after adopting indigenous cooking practices, so it seems there is definitely a precedent for cross-cultural exchange….

With the widespread travels of many Pirate crews, such opportunities wouldn’t be limited to primitive peoples either. Another recent experience which prompted my original post on this topic was born from a discussion I was having with a Pirate reenactor over on Instagram. We were discussing fire starting with flint and steel and our own fire starting kits. I crafted my own fire steel based on historical examples of Japanese styled fire tools, because presumably such an item might have easily been traded, bartered, or even plundered by a ‘Western’ Pirate who had travelled to the East. So again I found myself pondering how widespread and to what extent such cultural exchanges transpired(?) 

So there you have it! The inspiration for the tired ramblings of my initial post! Once again, I thank you for your kind words and encouragement! 

[Stynky Tudor]

On 7/1/2023 at 3:44 PM, Picaroon Lagoon said:

I wonder how much cross-cultural ‘borrowing’ likely occurred

Personally I think this has happened a lot more than people want to admit/give credit to.

For instance I was taught that that the Europeans created (block) printing around 1400, igniting the religious reformation, blah, blah, blah. There was no mention that Asia/China had already been making block prints for more than a thousand years.

Semi recently I heard (on NPR I think) an anthropologist theorized that things like our modern ideas of independence, individualism, voting and our system of government can be traced back to concepts already in practice by the indigenous peoples of the Americas. And even went on to blame the French (sailors) for bringing those ideas back to Europe - spurning on the Age of Enlightenment and inciting both the French and American Revolutions.

And no, I don't have any citations for this, just my (faulty) recollections of a radio conversation while on the road.

20 hours ago, Picaroon Lagoon said:

A few recent posts didn’t seem to gain much (if any) traction and I was (almost) becoming discouraged.

Try not to get discouraged, message boards (or at least the Pub) doesn't tend to get rapid Social Media like responses - especially as the days get long and we head into Pirate Event Season. I for one actually appreciate your' inquiries. 

[Picaroon Lagoon]

9 hours ago, Stynky Tudor said:

I don't have any citations for this, just my (faulty) recollections of a radio conversation while on the road.

But was it ‘Pirate Radio’? 😂🤣

9 hours ago, Stynky Tudor said:

Try not to get discouraged, message boards (or at least the Pub) doesn't tend to get rapid Social Media like responses - especially as the days get long and we head into Pirate Event Season. I for one actually appreciate your' inquiries. 

Thanks mate, I appreciate that. 

[madPete]

I think there's a lot of readers, not so many posters. It takes a while to build that back up. It seems once people get excited about events, they start posting and reading the other forums and posts. I guess we need another Pirates of the Caribbean movie!

Like you said, too many irons in the fire, so I sometimes pick and choose based on what I'm seriously into at the moment.

[Mary Diamond]

On 7/5/2023 at 11:24 AM, Picaroon Lagoon said:

I crafted my own fire steel based on historical examples of Japanese styled fire tools, because presumably such an item might have easily been traded, bartered, or even plundered by a ‘Western’ Pirate who had travelled to the East. So again I found myself pondering how widespread and to what extent such cultural exchanges transpired(?) 

I would recommend to you ‘Kaempfer’s Japan: Tokugawa Culture Observed’ by Engelbert Kaempfer (1999 edited, translated, annotated by Beatrice M. Bodart-Bailey), for insight into the culture and trade with Japan.

 

On 7/5/2023 at 11:24 AM, Picaroon Lagoon said:

Thank you for saying so; I truly appreciate your positive feedback! A few recent posts didn’t seem to gain much (if any) traction and I was (almost) becoming discouraged. 

As MadPete and Stynky said, responses may take a while! Please do not get discouraged. Your contributions are thought provoking and with merit!

[Mission]

On 7/6/2023 at 9:18 AM, Stynky Tudor said:

Personally I think this has happened a lot more than people want to admit/give credit to.

....

And no, I don't have any citations for this, just my (faulty) recollections of a radio conversation while on the road.

And therein lies the problem. 

As when I first responded to your question about multi-lingual sailors, I don't know of any examples of cultural borrowing of the top off my head. But I don't really look for this sort of thing either.

It does sort of remind me of an episode I love to bring up when someone starts talking about pirates wearing black, albeit for a very different reason. To wit:

"I had then but one Bundle [of my possessions] left [after the pirates took the rest of his possessions], in which was a black Suit of Cloaths, and other things which this Gang [La Bouche, Cocklyn and Davis] had spared. They being gone out of the Cabin, a Pirate, who was tolerably sober, came in soon after, and seeing my Bundle, said, He would see what was in it; which in prudence I did not oppose. He

__

then took out my black Cloaths, a good Hat and Wig, and some other Things. Wereupon I told him, 'Captain Cocklyn's Quarter-master had given them to me; and I hoped he would not deprive me of them; for they were of no service to him in so hot a Country, but would soon be of great use to me, as I should soon return to England." I had hardly done speaking, when he lifted up his broad Sword, and gave me a Blow on the Shoulder with the flat side of it; whispering at the same time these Words in my Ear, "I give you this Caution, never to dispute the Will of a Pirate: For, supposing I had cleft your Scull asunder for your Impudence, what would you have got by it but Destruction? Indeed you may flatter your self, I should have been put to death for killing a Prisoner in cold Blood; but assure your self my Friends would have brought me off on such an Occasion." I gave him thanks for his Admonition, and soon after he put on the Cloaths, which in less than half an hour after, I saw him take

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off and throw overboard. For some of the Pirates seeing him dress'd in that manner, had thrown several Buckets of Claret upon him." (William Snelgrave, A New Account of Some Parts of Guinea, 1724, pp. 235-7)

 

Now, the reason I bring this up is because the pirate who took the black clothes was adopting a behavior which was different than what he would normally adopt - in this case, wearing more formal, black clothing. His fellow pirates responded by pouring wine on him so he removed the clothing and threw it over the side. He resisted adopting the new behavior because of peer pressure. I also recall an episode where some sailors were making fun of the type of hats the Dutch wore, indicating that they resisted borrowing Dutch behaviors. (Although I don't remember where that was, so you may want to discount it.) Anyhow, I am inclined to think that cultural (or even intercultural) borrowing was limited. However, I could well be wrong.

The case of the buccaneers practicing bucaining seem to me to have been as much of necessity as trying something new. Dampier, OTOH, was an experimenter and tried all SORTS of things out of the norm, which sort of supports your theory. Although, most of the time, he appears to have gone back to his regular practices. In the end, people are people. Some are curious, some are not, some adventurous, some not, etc.

The idea of people 'cross-cultural borrowing' is more esoteric than multilingualism. I was able to answer the multilingualism question by doing searches for relevant words. I don't see that being possible here. As a result, proving (or rather, disproving the idea that it never happened, which is how you would go about this) basically requires reading through the period sources to find examples to support it.

So, sir, I challenge you to find the answer to your question and share it when you do. Below is a link to my page which lists the sailors' books from the period that I use to write articles about the topics that interest me. The majority of them can be found in PDF form for free on Google Books. (I make it easy by linking to them.) Read them. Find examples to support your theory. Even if you don't prove it, you will have learned a great deal about the sailors and pirates of the time and gained a fine understanding of life at sea during this time. As a result, you'll know far more than most people do. It's win/win. 🙂

https://piratesurgeon.com/pages/surgeon_pages/pirate_bibliography.html

 

 

 

 

[Mission]

Incidentally, the English had tinder boxes for starting fires. If you'd like to know more, this topic may interest you:

 

[Stynky Tudor]

13 hours ago, madPete said:

I think there's a lot of readers, not so many posters.

Just a quick review of the Pub's numbers/statistics and who's online, we definitely have a lot of horde of unregistered lurkers that either stop by to gleam a specific piece of information or are regular readers following threads. There are ways to lock this down and force folks to login, but forced participation for the sake of a numbers game runs counter to what we're actually about here.

 

[Mission]

Thinking on it, I remembered some other episodes of borrowing other cultural practices which argue against body decoration by sailors (albeit rather indirectly). They both come from buccaneer Lionel Wafer's account which focusing on his life among the Cuna natives of Panama.

"...we had four Women to carry our Provision, and my Cloaths, which were only a Linnen Frock and pair of Breeches. These I saved to cover my Nakedness, if ever I should come among Christians again; for at this time I went naked as the Savages, and was painted by their Women; but I would not suffer them to prick my Skin [a real tattooing], to rub the Paint in, as they use to do, but only to lay it on in little specks." (A New Voyage and Description of the Isthmus of America, Lionel Wafer and George Parker Winslow, p. 58)

"The four English Men with me were presently known and caress'd by the Ships Crew; but I sat a while cringing upon my Hams among the Indians, after their Fashion, painted as they were, and all naked but but only about the Waist, and with my Nose-piece (of which more hereafter) hanging over my Mouth. I was willing to try if they would know me in the Disguise; and 'twas the better part of an Hour before one of the Crew, looking more narrowly upon me, cry'd out, Here's our Doctor... I did what I could presently to wash off my Paint, but 'twas near a Month before I could get tolerably rid of it, having had my Skin so long stain'd with it, and the Pigment dried on in the Sun: And when it did come off, 'twas usually with the peeling off of Skin as well." [emphasis mine] (Wafer and Winslow, p. 64-5)

Two points of interest here:

First, the natives that Wafer was living with wore a crescent-shaped nose ring which covered part of their mouth. He noted that it had to be lifted when eating and drinking and was quite impractical - suggesting, in combination with the fact that he ran around in similar clothes (or lack thereof), that he had allowed himself to be tattooed as a part of looking like his hosts - he had really "gone native." Note particularly the comment about his concerns about coming "among Christians again."

Second, I emphasize a point in the second quote to show that Wafer wanted to be rid of his "temporary" tattoo as soon as he was recognized as a member of the crew. This indicates it was unacceptable even among the sailors and suggests he wanted to fit in again when he got back among English sailors.

Another sailor was apparently not quite so wise and "suffered them to prick their Skin" which he then wanted removed.

"One of my Companions desired me once to get out of his Cheek one of these imprinted Pictures, which was made by the Negroes, his Name was Bullman; which yet I could not effectually do, after much scarifying [making small incisions and then drawing blood from them using heated bleeding bowls placed on the skin to create a vaccuum] and fetching off a great part of the Skin." (Wafer and Winslow, p. 136-7)
 

[Mary Diamond]

Lovely responses, as usual, Mission! I quite enjoyed hearing about the tattooing. And the William Snelgrave account is a reassurance for all who come new to the hobby - it is quite acceptable to wear clothes of the same cut, color and material as others. Differentiation can come as specialization is developed.

[Picaroon Lagoon]

Playing catch up, so please bear with me. 
 

First of all, thank you for all the kind words and encouragement from so many of you! I’m still relatively new here, but the sense of ‘esprit de corps’ I’ve seen (and received) never ceases to astound! 
 

On 7/7/2023 at 12:27 PM, Mary Diamond said:

I would recommend to you ‘Kaempfer’s Japan: Tokugawa Culture Observed’ by Engelbert Kaempfer (1999 edited, translated, annotated by Beatrice M. Bodart-Bailey), for insight into the culture and trade with Japan.

Thank you for the suggestion! Sounds like fascinating reading! 
 

On 7/7/2023 at 12:55 PM, Mission said:

Below is a link to my page which lists the sailors' books from the period that I use to write articles about the topics that interest me. The majority of them can be found in PDF form for free on Google Books. (I make it easy by linking to them.) Read them.

 

On 7/7/2023 at 12:55 PM, Mission said:

you will have learned a great deal about the sailors and pirates of the time and gained a fine understanding of life at sea during this time. As a result, you'll know far more than most people do. It's win/win. 🙂

https://piratesurgeon.com/pages/surgeon_pages/pirate_bibliography.html

Awesome! Thank you for making such resources available and for likewise calling my attention to them! 
 

On 7/7/2023 at 12:55 PM, Mission said:

Find examples to support your theory.

It was more inquiry than theory, however I shall accept your challenge to read and learn more and perhaps discover a more definitive answer in the process. 
 

On 7/7/2023 at 1:00 PM, Mission said:

Incidentally, the English had tinder boxes for starting fires. If you'd like to know more, this topic may interest you:

Thank you, I shall also bring this to the bloke I was speaking about this to on Instagram; perhaps it draw a new person to the pub and generate more such discourse! 
 

On 7/7/2023 at 1:00 PM, Stynky Tudor said:

Just a quick review of the Pub's numbers/statistics and who's online, we definitely have a lot of horde of unregistered lurkers that either stop by to gleam a specific piece of information or are regular readers following threads. There are ways to lock this down and force folks to login, but forced participation for the sake of a numbers game runs counter to what we're actually about here.

Indeed! Leave the Press Ganging to the Royal Navies and capitalist merchants says I!