“Moody” Flag origin?

[Tartan Jack]

When last I looked into it, the origins of the “Moody” red flag was a 1750s French manuscript. But, looking at stuff now, I see earlier dates given.

 

What do we know of the design?

-I’d love to get Foxe’s, Little’s, & Konstam’s (if he’s on here) views, as well as any others.

Thanks,

-Tartan Jack

 

I’ve always found it visually striking.

[Mission]

If you want to know about pirate flags, you'll want Ed's book The True History of Pirate Flags (you can buy it via that hotlink). I don't think any of the authors you mentioned are on the forum unless Ed has decided to log back in, but he looks at every legitimate pirate flag in that book and explains the origins of the illegitimate ones. It's an easy read and not a very expensive book.

[Tartan Jack]

Got it.

(3 copies, actually- thought I lost it, bought another, found the first, & the third recently to allow lending out)

The origins of that one aren’t addressed. Plus, with all the research & stuff found through the digitization of materials, I wondered what has been found.

 

-Used a copy to show the size of the quakers made by Sutler John 15 or so years ago-

[Tartan Jack]

Well, this image is shown on the back page, which led me to asking.

[Tartan Jack]

With the 1737 dating (earlier than I realized).

 

I know Little & Angus Konstam have both also writen on flags & wondered is they have newer found info.

[Mission]

That's a markedly different flag. The elements are there, but the designs are very different. Plus, based on the reference, it's apparently a design for French corsairs, not English pirates. I'll bet it was coopted by one of those 20th century authors and assigned to Moody. (I'd look, but all the reference books I'm not using for my current article are in boxes while I work on refinishing the wood and painting my office. And there are four bookshelves worth of boxes so it would take forever to find.) 

[LootBox]

Bottom left corner, 1711, by Peter Schenk, flag of "Roovers":

https://www.rijksmuseum.nl/nl/collectie/NG-1048
or
https://alteamaps.uk/view_product.php?prod_id=PROD100004366
or
https://www.raremaps.com/gallery/detail/41185/early-appearance-of-the-flag-of-new-england-schouw-park-a-schenk 
or
https://www.geographicus.com/P/AntiqueMap/flagchart-schenk-1711

Similar flags appeared in other nautical flag compilations like Schenk's, sometimes with the wreath on the skull and sometimes without; here's one from 1836 (bottom right as "Rovers"): https://collection.maas.museum/object/434506.

Basil Lubbock's "Blackwall Frigates" from 1922 just labels this flag "1746" with no name. Same with 1923's “Piracy in the West Indies and its suppression” by Francis Bradlee. 

In 1933 Charles Grey's "Pirates of the Eastern Seas" labels this one "Moody."  In 1953 Patrick Pringle's “Jolly Roger” labels it "Christopher Moody". This becomes the standard going forward, though of course until the 20th century it was never assigned to Moody or anyone else and no witnesses reported any Golden Age vessels flying it.