Ship hull copper plating

[Swashbuckler 1700]

-When ship hull copper plating was used? If my memory serves me right there is plating on cutty shark’s hull and (I am not completely sure) HMS Victory’s hull, but how old copper hull plating is?

[Captain McCool]

From what I always understood, copper plating was a fairly late development in the Golden Age of Sail. So more like Napoleonic. I don't believe it would have been done during the GAoP. But there are certainly others on here who are far better suited to answer this question accurately than I.

[peglegstrick]

Taken from From Wikipedia:

Deterioration of the hull of a wooden ship was a significant problem during the Age of Sail. Ships' hulls were under continuous attack by shipworm and various marine weeds, all of which had some adverse effect on the ship, be it structurally, in the case of the worm, or affecting speed and handling in the case of the weeds. The most common methods of dealing with these problems were through the use of wood, and sometimes lead, sheathing. Expendable wood sheathing effectively provided a non-structural skin to the hull for the worm to attack, and could be easily replaced in dry dock at regular intervals. Weed, however, grew rapidly and slowed ships. Lead sheathing, while more effective than wood in mitigating these problems, reacted badly with the iron bolts of the ships causing sometimes severe damage.

Even older than the sheathing methods were the various graving and paying techniques. There were three main substances used: White stuff, which was a mixture of train oil, rosin and brimstone; Black stuff, a mixture of tar and pitch; and Brown stuff, which was simply brimstone added to Black stuff. It was common practise to first apply wood sheathing and then pay it with white stuff, although black stuff was occasionally used in this way.

The use of copper sheathing was first suggested in 1708 by Charles Perry, though it was rejected by the Navy Board on grounds of high cost and perceived maintenance difficulties. The first experiments with copper sheathing were made in the late 1750s: the bottoms and sides of several ships' keels and false keels were sheathed with copper plates.

In 1761 the experiment was expanded, and the 32-gun frigate HMS Alarm was ordered to have her entire bottom coppered, in response to the terrible condition in which she returned from service in the West Indies. HMS Alarm was chosen because in 1761 a letter had been sent regarding the ship's condition, saying that the worms from the waters had taken a significant toll on the ship’s wooden hull.Before the copper plates were applied the hull was covered with Soft stuff, which was simply hair, yarn and brown paper. The copper performed very well both in protecting the hull from invasion by worm and in preventing the growth of weed for, when in contact with water, the copper produced a poisonous film, composed mainly of oxychloride, that deterred these marine organisms. Furthermore, as this film was slightly soluble it gradually washed away, leaving no way in which marine life could attach itself to the ship. However, it was soon discovered by the Admiralty that the copper bolts used to hold the plates to the hull had reacted with the iron bolts used in the construction of the ship, rendering many bolts nearly useless. In 1766, due to the poor condition of the iron bolts, Alarm's copper was removed.

After this experiment, and deterred by the unanticipated and not understood electrolytic reaction between the copper and iron, lead sheathing was tried again, though it was found to be unsuitable to the task, as the plates tended to fall from the hull alarmingly quickly. In 1768 a ship named the Dolphin was sheathed in the same way and sailed for a few years around the world. It came back with corrosion on the iron components of the hull; they were basically irreparable and had to be replaced. In 1769 another attempt was made at coppering a ship's hull, this time on a new ship that had been constructed using bolts made from a copper alloy. The results were far more favourable this time, but the onset and intensification of the war with America prevented the re-bolting of the Royal Navy's ships necessary to allow a full-scale coppering programme.

[Swashbuckler 1700]

OK interesting so it is quite old but not in use in gaop..

[Mission]

I recall reading somewhere about a second layer of wood being added to a ship to defend against the worms, but never metals. I am guessing the second layer of wood comment is from Edward Barlow, but I didn't note it because it is not related to medicine.

What are you gathering all these odd bits of info for, Swashbuckler 1700? Are you writing a book or something?

[Swashbuckler 1700]

I recall reading somewhere about a second layer of wood being added to a ship to defend against the worms, but never metals. I am guessing the second layer of wood comment is from Edward Barlow, but I didn't note it because it is not related to medicine.

What are you gathering all these odd bits of info for, Swashbuckler 1700? Are you writing a book or something?

Nah...I was just curious... And I am buiding mental picture of real historical pirates....

[Swashbuckler 1700]

I just read Brian Lavery's book "ship" and i foung some interesting info that in early 17th century Piet Heijn invested a form of copper covering but it did not work very well. In 1670s lead plates were tried but that was just a mess. Less of the story seems to be correct and so does the wikipedia when books says that the RN ship Alarm was firt real copper plated vessel ..And that was in 1761.

[DSiemens]

Before the copper a mixture whale oil, pine resin, and sulphur. This gave ships the white coloring below the water line. This mixture would last three years before needing to be replaced. Trouble with the white stuff is it was uneven and could slow the ship down. The copper made the ship faster but was more expensive. It wasn't really tried a lot until the 18th century.

[Commodore Swab]

We have found lead sheeting on the wreck we are excavating (Spanish Galleon Sank circa 1733). On some of the pieces of lead there is what appears to be a burlap impression. The holes left from the nails indicate this would have been between the lead and the hull. Most are about 1/16 inch thick but some pieces have been found that are closer to 3/16. Most do not have any impression of burlap on them.