Queue (hair) Wrappings?

[jendobyns]

Fox: don't think I have ever seen any pictures from the GAoP specifically but the queue has been around through many cultures since nearly the beginning of time, and worn in many many different styles...perhaps not specifically "British", "French", or "Spanish", but I am pretty sure they were not the only ones on the waters during GAoP, or aboard a pirate ship. I am pretty sure you have seen many of ancient Chinese wearing a queue. And there was one document I read some years ago that described a period when the British Navy in its early days had troubles with some sailors, as I recall they where trying to get more organized (with uniforms and such) and when the order was given for the men to cut their queues they "nearly had a revolt on their hands"....can't recall just when or where I had read that. But braids, pony tails and such have long been worn by men throughout history and cultures. If you read up on the history of wigs you will find a lot about the era's fascination with long hair, curls, and ribbons dating back as far as Queen Elizabeth herself.

Certainly, I have no problem with anyone portraying a Chinese pirate or Victorian sailor wearing a queue.

But in the original post you asked about a very specific hair style (short queue wrapped in black), and the correct way to obtain it. All of the advice (and good advice it is too) has been based on a later period interpretation. It may well be that there isn't a 'correct' GAoP way of doing it.

Have to say I agree with you there, we need to dig further to find something appropriate for GAoP. Sadly, it's a period that is about as easy to pin down as jello when it comes to some details. I have a meeting at a site tomorrow which was established in the 1680's as a tobacco port. It has a decent library, so I'll see if I can find anything useful while I'm there.

Edited March 9, 2011 by jendobyns

[Tartan Jack]

No one wore hair queues in the GAoP?

Define hair queues.

If you mean, effectively, a pony tail, then yes, there are probably GAoP era references (though I struggle off the top of my head).

If you mean the solid pony tail, usually black, seen on all self-respecting sailors in old movies (as implied in the original post), then they seem very much to be a later fashion.

I know it is commonly portrayed in the Napoleonic Wars period Royal Navy (see Horatio Hornblower films, for example). But, how much earlier was it?

As I recall, in period, sailors were often commented upon and recognized by their short hair . . .

[Mission]

No, I mean non-attached (to the skull) hair queues as seen, let us say, on working landsman, let us say, as a trained surgeon?

So...does no one know if landsmen wore these things?

[capn'rob]

I'd like to offer me tuppence. Once we'uns wuz deprived o' our daily hot showers in the day o' Men wi' Hearts o' Oak. The early days of the sailing Navy. The treatment o' ones traditional long hair o' the sailor wuz to slick the whole mess wi' good Stockholm Tar and braid in four strand round sennit. The kerchief and later in the days when uniforms had the attachment, this was for protection from said Tar. The purpose: First, stays in place and out o' yer eyes. Then, wi' out those hot showers and no shampoo and conditioner (damn their eyes) the natural oils were kept in and the salt kept out. A simple rinse o' spirits would remove the Tar and then, Only Your Hairdresser Knew For Sure!

[Capt. Sterling]

Thomas Brown, in his "Letters from the Dead to the Living," presents a pen-portrait of beaux as they appeared at the commencement of the eighteenth century. Some of the passages are well worth reproducing, as they contain valuable information concerning wigs. "We met," says the writer, "three flaming beaux of the first magnitude. He in the middle made a most magnificent figure—his periwig was large enough to have loaded a camel, and he bestowed upon it at least a bushel of powder, I warrant you. His sword-knot dangled upon the ground, and his steinkirk, that was most agreeably discoloured with snuff from the top to the bottom, reach'd down to his waist; he carry'd his hat under his left arm, walk'd with both hands in the waistband of his breeches, and his cane, that hung negligently down in a string from his right arm, trail'd most harmoniously against the pebbles, while the master of it was tripping it nicely upon his toes or humming to himself." About this period in cold weather men wore muffs as well as wigs. A ballad, describing the frost fair on the Thames in the winter of 1683-84, mentions amongst those present:—

"A spark of the Bar with his cane and his muff."

Down to the middle of the eighteenth century wigs continued to increase in size. It will not now be without interest to direct attention to a few of the many styles of wigs. Randle Holme, in his "Academy of Armory," published in 1684, has some interesting illustrations, and we will draw upon him for a couple of pictures. Our first example is called the campaign-wig. He says it "hath knobs or bobs, or dildo, on each side, with a curled forehead." This is not so cumbrous as a periwig we have noticed. Another example from Holme is a smaller style of periwig with tail, and from this wig doubtless originated the familiar pig-tail. It was of various forms, and Swift says:—

"We who wear our wigs

With fantail and with snake."

Periwig with Tail.

A third example given by Holme is named the "short-bob," and is a plain peruke, imitating a natural head of hair. "Perukes," says Malcolm, in his "Manners and Customs," "were an highly important article in 1734. Those of right gray human hair were four guineas each; light grizzle ties, three guineas; and other colours in proportion, to twenty-five shillings. Right gray human hair, cue perukes, from two guineas; white, fifteen shillings each, which was the price of dark ones; and right gray bob perukes, two guineas and a half; fifteen shillings was the price of dark bobs. Those mixed with horsehair were much lower. It will be observed from the gradations in price, that real gray hair was most in fashion, and dark of no estimation." As time ran its course, wigs became more varied in form, and bore different names.

We find in the days of Queen Anne such designations as black riding-wigs, bag-wigs, and nightcap-wigs. These were in addition to the long, formally curled perukes. In 1706 the English, led by Marlborough, gained a great victory on the battlefield of Ramillies, and that gave the title to a long wig described as "having a long, gradually diminishing, plaited tail, called the 'Ramillie-tail,' which was tied with a great bow at the top, and a smaller one at the bottom." It was at the great battle fought before the town of Ramillies that France lost the whole Spanish Netherlands, and Europe gained a wig from the vanity of Louis XIV., of whom Thackeray irreverently speaks in his "Henry Esmond," as "a little, wrinkled old man, pock-marked, and with a great periwig and red heels." Lord Lyttelton in his letters thus refers to the French king: "Louis XIV. annexed great dignity to his peruke, which he increased to an enormous size, and made a lion's mane the object of its similitude. That monarch, who daily studied the part of a king, was never seen uncovered but by the barber who shaved him. It was not his practice to exchange his wig for a nightcap till he was enclosed by his curtains, when a page received the former from his hand and delivered it to him in the morning before he undrew them. The figure of the great Bourbon must at times have been truly ridiculous." It is stated in Read's Weekly Journal of May 1st, 1736, in a report of the marriage of the Prince of Wales, that "the officers of the Horse and Foot Guards wore Ramillie periwigs by His Majesty's order." This wig survived until the days of George III. We meet, in the reign of George II., other forms of the wig, and more titles for them; the most popular, perhaps, was the pig-tail. The pig-tails were worn hanging down the back, or tied up in a knot behind as shown in our illustration. This form of wig was popular in the army, but in 1804 orders were given for it to be reduced to seven inches in length, and finally, in 1808, to be cut off. It is recorded that when the Reform Bill of 1832 received the Royal assent, the Lord Bathurst of the period solemnly cut off his pig-tail, saying, "Ichabod, for the glory was departed."

AT THE SIGN

OF THE BARBER'S POLE

STUDIES IN HIRSUTE HISTORY

BY

WILLIAM ANDREWS

AUTHOR OF "BYGONE ENGLAND

which can be found here...

http://www.gutenberg.org/files/19925/19925-h/19925-h.htm

and yet, I cannot find any references to these type of items being worn by the common sailor... I am seeing mostly short hair or down to the top of shoulders

Edited March 11, 2011 by Capt. Sterling

[Capt. Sterling]

Top plate and sorry cannot make these bigger, perhaps someone else can...there are two gentlemen, note gentlemen, in bag wigs..

easiest to see if the second man in from the left foreground

detail of a man in the background which can be seen above the man bending down to speak to someone

a detail from a picture c. 1702-03 showing two men in bag wigs

a detail from above picture

some more illustrations of bag wigs... still haven't found a common sailor wearing one

Edited March 11, 2011 by Capt. Sterling

[MadL]

Ok, so it would appear that wigs, tails, bag wigs, and bows did appear during the GAoP, just so far none specifically depicted on a "common sailor"...but then since when was a 'pirate' a 'common sailor'?

As I recall it has been stated that Pirates enjoyed mocking, mimicking, and simply thumbing their nose at "gentlemen" and at royalty....I don't recall any images of pirates wearing silk, lace, and other refineries yet we know they stole them and of course would not have them long once they made safe port somewhere, but until then or should they need to come ashore in less-then-friendly ports, would it not make reason that if they so wished then they would wear them?

Also I had read long ago, not "sailor lore" per-se, but speaking of common landlubber folk that those who could not afford a wig would sometimes attempt to grow their own 'tail' (queue, whatever).

It seems to me that to search for "images" or even writings of EVERY conceivable concept of a "pirate at sea" (or on land for that matter) would be a search in vain. Simply because most writings and images would be done to not put too much emphasis on mocking the royalty, but rather to make them look evil, disgusting so as not to offend the king (queen, monarch, etc). I know I would not want to be the editor of a parchment and image that made a loathsomely pirate appear more grandeur then the king!! But we do know Calico Jack was quite the dandy, and others had what about Captain Kidd, did he dress as a "common" sailor? Then what about the thousands of other pirates, some that perhaps vanished before even falling under the British Navy's radar....if there were queues Before the GAoP and queues After the GAoP as well as queues on "gentlemen" During the GAoP......hmmmmmmm

**oh, and as far as my original post, where I asked about "a specific style..." - twas a starting point mate, lighten up fer I am seeking the 'method of', and that be that....aye, I still be seeking the how to fer wrapping me queue (without use o' tar, just the cloth) so it stays put on an active day.

Edited March 14, 2011 by MadL

[Capt. Bo of the WTF co.]

Read some of the runaway ads from the Virginia and Pennsylvania gazzettes. "wears his own hair" comes up in many of the ads. Also see portraits by Peale, and there are some others but my brain is sleepy and I need to get off here and get some sleep. Anyhow, many folks did in fact wear their own hair long.

Patrick... I first heard that tune when my uncle and his biker buddies snuck me into the drive-in to see Easyriders in 1969. I was in third grade I think, and I sang that tune all summer long. (it was at the desert commune with Luke Askew as the leader, and if you look at some of the others, Dan Haggerty-Grizzly Adams-is in there too).

Bo

[Slopmaker Cripps]

One thing to keep in mind with the runaway ads is that terms like "long" and "short" are relative....and changed throughout the 18th century. So even if it says he wore his own hair long, what that length would be in say 1736 compared to 1770 may be two different animals.

Will have to dig them up again, but there have been a number of good articles adressing this whole long versus short hair topic for the RevWar era crowd...and while they post-date the GAOP, they do raise some interesting points that should be considered when looking at hair during the earlier part of the century.

-Adam C.

[Swashbuckler 1700]

Let's see can I offer queues.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/44890094@N08/sets/72157622836818796/with/4272966919/

There was some ponytails. Date is unknown me not 100% sure but it is 99% from gaop. I think circa 1700 or likely earlier.

Cavarlymen in 1704. I have read that queues were cavarly mens fashion in gaop

But as for sailor queue I agree with Foxe: It was few decades later fashion.

I don't use these as nothing more as period pictures and I am not defending sailor's queues since these pirates are fine dressed and more like gentlemen than sailors (and many pics from same sources don't put queues to others than these and those who have more sailor like outfit look more like sailors and they have no queues.)

Roberts in 1725 Dutch GHoP

http://jcb.lunaimagi.../what/Artifacts, industry, and human activities/Pirates/where/[Amsterdam];sort:Normalized_date%2CCreators%2CPublisher%2CTitle;lc:JCB~1~1,JCBBOOKS~1~1,JCBMAPS~1~1,JCBMAPS~2~2&mi=7&trs=22

England picture made 1736 for GHoP

Bonnet in 1725 picture

Edited May 16, 2012 by Swashbuckler 1700