NO MORE HISTORY ???

[Capt. Sterling]

Interested in knowing if anyone else has heard about this... unfortunately I only caught a small bit off the radio and had six others in the car yacking at the top of their lungs, but the gist I got was...

The historic sites either in the US or perhaps just in Virginia, are fighting a new proposition/bill, that would stop the teaching of history in the schools...

anyone know about this and have more details???

[Niko]

Interested in knowing if anyone else has heard about this... unfortunately I only caught a small bit off the radio and had six others in the car yacking at the top of their lungs, but the gist I got was...

The historic sites either in the US or perhaps just in Virginia, are fighting a new proposition/bill, that would stop the teaching of history in the schools...

anyone know about this and have more details???

...Thats ridiculous....

[Capt. Sterling]

Ridiculous? Tis dangerous as hell... that's why I want to know more about it... as it was on the news... unfortunately I couldn't hit rewind...

[Dutchman]

all im finding is a newspaper article that identifes changes to the SOL testing, which comes up for a DOE board vote in June sometime. Seems this will affect third grade world history testing on such topics as Mayans, China, American Indians and Greece all in an effort to save roughly $350,000 per year. I have the GA bill tracker running again trying to find if something was caboosed in on another bill this past year, nothing showing yet.

[Dorian Lasseter]

Didi a quick poke about online... didn't come up with anything, Snopes.com as well...

If there is any truth to this, I agree dangerous as hell...

The moral standards of today are based on what history has taught us.

History is both positive and negative, can't have one without the other.

The hard part is having people learn it from a third person perspective... detached in such a way as to not learn that X people did this injustice to Y people and hold a grudge or even hate the X people today for something that was done in the past.

"Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it." George Santayana

"What we do about history matters. The often repeated saying that those who forget the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them has a lot of truth in it. But what are 'the lessons of history'? The very attempt at definition furnishes ground for new conflicts. History is not a recipe book; past events are never replicated in the present in quite the same way. Historical events are infinitely variable and their interpretations are a constantly shifting process. There are no certainties to be found in the past." Gerda Lerner

"We can learn from history how past generations thought and acted, how they responded to the demands of their time and how they solved their problems. We can learn by analogy, not by example, for our circumstances will always be different than theirs were. The main thing history can teach us is that human actions have consequences and that certain choices, once made, cannot be undone. They foreclose the possibility of making other choices and thus they determine future events." Gerda Lerner

[BlaggardMike]

"Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it." George Santayana

Exactly, I don't think they will stop the teaching of history. Not only would it put hundreds of thousands without jobs but it would destroy a big portion of college education as well.

It will never happen unless they close schools all together. The fact that any body came up with such a contemptible idea amazes me.

[Quartermaster James]

Some might argue it was stopped long ago...

[LadyBrower]

This is one of those "what the hell" issues. So much for me teaching history, does this mean I'll be out of a job?

The again, so many standardized tests ignore history- the focus is math and grammar. At least in NY. They want to know you can define a word and know 2+2. It's too hard to teach and measure concepts and ideas... How are you supposed to get your funding if you can't measure and define the stuff? UGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Animal]

I almost have to agree with you, GS. I loved history as a kid and I think it still continues in my adult life. I think that an interest in history begins at home. If children aren't encouraged to read about history or there is an indifferent attitude towards it from the parents, the child will emulate the parents attitude. I believe only a teacher that makes history interesting to the students can reverse that attitude. During the 1st Gulf War, my son (while in 3rd grade) looked into the history of the region and research the Vietnam era and drew some interesting parallels between the two. Some of his opinions are true today. Scary kid, huh? He had a teacher who was in Vietnam plus my dad and uncles he could tap into. At that time I was taking Time and Newsweek. I kept having to get them from him just so I could read my damn magazines.

Animal

[Tartan Jack]

As I hope to start a PhD in history in the none-to-distant future . . .

I hope I'm not screwed.

History used to be one of the most important subjects in academics. It was the subject that tied all the rest together and the ONLY one wherein math, science, literature, politics, and everything else was tied together and interacted.

History: the study of everything, how everything interacts, and has interacted through time.

[LadyBarbossa]

My nieces and nephew really don't have history classes. Kinda like their Language Arts and whatever the hell they call these classes nowadays... something stupidly fancy. All in all, they learn nothing! And I'm infuriated!

So, Sterling... I wouldn't be surprised if that's the truth.

'Course, look at today.... how many people really understand what put us into the Great Depression. All I get from people is the "so what, who cares, etc". Pisses me off.

~Lady B

[Stynky Tudor]

Some might argue it was stopped long ago...

Hey this was my line. . . or something similar.

I know that the private, religious and public schools I attended all did such a disservice to the subject - sucking the life and interest from it. I had little or no interest until my early/mid-20s when I stumbled into various subjects accidentally - when I realized things were down an out lied about, glossed over or ignored.

[Capt. Bo of the WTF co.]

if true; Guess they won't be needing me after all the time I've just spent in college to teach this subject. That's my ususal luck, late and outta date.

Bo

Edited June 21, 2009 by Capt. Bo of the WTF co.

[Joe Pyrat]

Some might argue it was stopped long ago...

Sad, but to a great extent true.

[Silken Jack]

Some might argue it was stopped long ago...

Hey this was my line. . . or something similar.

I know that the private, religious and public schools I attended all did such a disservice to the subject - sucking the life and interest from it. I had little or no interest until my early/mid-20s when I stumbled into various subjects accidentally - when I realized things were down an out lied about, glossed over or ignored.

History has been defined as the lies we tell about the dead. I'm not quite that cynical, but I do believe that the same story can be told from different viewpoints.

But the so-called Enlightenment is finally winning over basic human values. We don't need educated hands -just people who can build the technology for their masters. Voltaire would be thrilled, the swine.

[LadyBrower]

Some might argue it was stopped long ago...

Hey this was my line. . . or something similar.

I know that the private, religious and public schools I attended all did such a disservice to the subject - sucking the life and interest from it. I had little or no interest until my early/mid-20s when I stumbled into various subjects accidentally - when I realized things were down an out lied about, glossed over or ignored.

History has been defined as the lies we tell about the dead. I'm not quite that cynical, but I do believe that the same story can be told from different viewpoints.

But the so-called Enlightenment is finally winning over basic human values. We don't need educated hands -just people who can build the technology for their masters. Voltaire would be thrilled, the swine.

This was a tangent at dinner the other night. It's true, education ihas long been directly associated with power and used as a means of control. History is important in this, particularly to "the masses" to understand for example, revolutions, what worked what did not, the how, the why and the results. History is a fundamental component of human civilizations. Cave drawing and oral legends show this quite clearly, there is an urge to understand where we come from as people and where we are going. Though the dissolution of any history class standard would make this even more difficult (as kids don't always feel the desire to pay attention...kid's today, eh?) I think there will still be some amount of drive.

Reenacting, for example brings this to life for a lot of kids. I remember one of the teachers in my elementary school was a Civil War reenactor, and he set up a mini camp, wore his kit to school, and did some demonstrations (including firing the musket). That was back in oh, 3rd grade maybe? and it made a HUGE impact. Kid's at our events are very interested, keeping that interest and allowing childen (hell, adults too) to think for themselves about the past and how it has effected THEM is really REALLY important.

History won't go away. But it's really annoying that the powers that be could think of allowing the class to dissapear from schools. It's rediculous.

And thats the end of my rant.

[Joe Pyrat]

My favorite definition of history is "A conceited look at the past by the side that won." Now there is trend toward rewriting history to fit the current ideas of what is politically correct which seems to lead to an even more warped view of the past. Throw in that fiction, repeated enough, takes on historical significance, such as the Black Bart moniker for Bartholomew Roberts, walking the plank, etc. All this combines to make delving into histories mysteries much more difficult for the novice or even the would be professional resulting in more works of fiction masquerading as histories.

[captjustinkase]

Arts and Music programs are being cut from schools all across the country in an attempt to save money. Sport programs are also being cut in some areas.

Heck with the debates over the last few years of Intelligent Design vs Darwinism being taught in school I am not surprised that the subject of History is the next possible subject to be cut.

I will be honest, while in school I hated the subject. Maybe I eeked out a C grade in most History subjects. I remember almost failing my senior year of high school with American Government History.

It was not until after high school that I got into history, and that was when I began participating in Medieval recreation. Yeah first I joined because I got to hit other people with sticks (shanais), but eventually I took my persona seriously and begun doing research. And I tell you that sucked.

One author said one thing and backed up his research. Another author said something totally opposite based on the same evidence.

Most of us can easily understand the frustration with history trying to research what was fact and fiction just for the GAoP, but we still push forward.

But after reading this thread I thought to myself, could I have lived and functioned in today’s society without knowing what caused the American Revolution, the Great Depression, the War of the Roses. I have to say yes.

It is not necessary to learn about history to function, to even learn moral lessons.

Now would my life have been less interesting? Would I have found the friends, family (Heck I met my wife at a fighter’s practice), and joy I have had in my life these last 15 years without History. And to that I can say No.

So that is my goal, that is my mission when I put on my kit and go to talk to the children. I do my best to get them interested in history, to drive that spark in their imagination into a flame that will help History survive, if not in school, at least in the hearts and minds of the next generation.

And now I get off my soapbox.

[blackjohn]

Some schools of thought believe history is overrated.

[Joe Pyrat]

That explains why so many keep making the same mistakes over and over again.