garb- full on reenactor? Or Hollywood type?

[Capt. Bo of the WTF co.]

Lady B,

No, but if there hadn't been so many witnesses, and she'd of called me Captain Morgan one more time... (we were camped at a Catholic Church grounds and they had a rather large cemetery there if ya know what I mean!)

I keep forgetting to adress the topic dangitt! I use a lot of my colonial stuff for my pyrate look. I have been adding a piece here and there as time goes by to get me closer to the period. I'll never go "all the way" though. Some of the stuff we simply don't know, and other stuff is just not available/affordable/reasonable. I guess it would be accurate to say I fall into the "close-enough" area of in-between. I will probably use my 19th century dragoon boots when I do my horseback impressions too. For the most part, as long as you are honest about your gear when someone does ask, close enough most often is good enough. I won't let anyone go away thinking I am a 100% accurate portrayal when I am not. personal responsibility is my battle cry.

Bo

Edited February 17, 2009 by Capt. Bo of the WTF co.

[Mary Diamond]

I gotta laugh everytime I see 10-20 Capn' Jacks at the same event,

We were at an event one time and they had four Jacks tied to a rope and were dragging them around. I quickly rounded up four lads, tied them to a rope and had them swish about as we walked behind the Jacks. Finally the guy towing the Jacks turned around and looked at us and asked what we were doing?

I told him, my four Queens beat his four Jacks.

[bosun red]

authintic to period or not? that is the question!

When at fair can you trust the shopes to sell items that are period or hollywood?

i picked up a leather belt from the leather smith. it looks cool but somehow i don't think a 8 inch wide, buckels in back, and studed with skulls is very functional or approriate. considering the cost of such items is thier rule of thumb what is period and what is hollywood? i would like to add as period a piece as possible when building my kit.

[MadL]

I gotta laugh everytime I see 10-20 Capn' Jacks at the same event, but, Hey, ......IH

Good sir, a Jack 'er two up yer sleeve be one thing, BUT Six t' Sixteen o' them?!!

::load'n me pistol...do naught move....damn it, th' shot be stuck...hold on now...stay where ye are....damn it, who cast this shot?!!! stay there now....:::

When at fair can you trust the shopes to sell items that are period or hollywood?

I have a period correct London Bridge fer sell, only driven over by a little ol' wench from Pasadena on Sundays...

....do naught move Iron Hand....we aint done yet over them extra Jacks o' you's yet....

[Patrick Hand]

When at fair can you trust the shopes to sell items that are period or hollywood?

At Faire, the Merchants are going to sell whatever sells..... And most of it is going to be Hollywood....

The Merchants at Faire are trying to make a living, not do the historical research for everyone....So if you are looking for historically accurate goods, you should know what you are looking for....

[bosun red]

When at fair can you trust the shopes to sell items that are period or hollywood?

At Faire, the Merchants are going to sell whatever sells..... And most of it is going to be Hollywood....

The Merchants at Faire are trying to make a living, not do the historical research for everyone....So if you are looking for historically accurate goods, you should know what you are looking for....

Thanks,thats what i thought. i guess after reading all the posts i reluctantly have decided my crew and i fall into the fantasy camp. i love history and whant to be historicaly correct but it is just to expensive to buy the right stuff all the time plus we manly do this for a fun activity all the family can participate in. if my kids whant to be a belly dancing gypsy, fairy, or a mermaid i just can't stop them we have to much fun.

[MadL]

.....we manly do this for a fun activity all the family can participate in. if my kids whant to be a belly dancing gypsy, fairy, or a mermaid i just can't stop them we have to much fun.

::I be go'n t' hell...'er jail...'er Both!::

Bugger That!

A SHORT LIFE 'N A MERRY ONE!! AHRRRR!

[Quartermaster James]

it is just to expensive to buy the right stuff

Short of hand sewn garments, my experience has been that the more historically accurate stuff costs little more (and, actually, often less) than the fantasy stuff. It also lasts longer, wears better, and just becomes more authentic with age - so over the long run it's much cheaper.

Trust me, no disrespect intended, I've bought my share of fantasy stuff.

Edited February 27, 2009 by Quartermaster James

[William Brand]

I was called pyrate at Rev-war/colonia/F&I events long before I got into this. Joe and Jane public don't know the difference anyway. My least favorite though was when this drunk chick kept following me around calling me Captain Morgan! GAWD I hate that crap! I was really thankful when I crossed a ditch in the dark and she fell in and passed out. I left her there to her fate too!!! Stupid wench!

Bo

I'm generally a pretty chivalrous guy, but I'm glad I wasn't drinking anything when I read this, because I laughed about the ditch.

But more on topic. I haven't found that period stuff costs a lot more, because, as Quartermaster James has already pointed out, it lasts forever. Also, people who love the art of historical representation will sometimes give you stuff just to see your kit improved. We trade, barter, share and give stuff away.

[MadL]

I do naught so much find that period stuff be 'more expensive' as it be 'Hard to find'.

At Faire, the Merchants are going to sell whatever sells..... And most of it is going to be Hollywood.

The Merchants at Faire are trying to make a living, not do the historical research for everyone...

Th' statement be sad but true as I had hoped to find th' "better stuff" at faire but quickly found that is not the case.

Me own current garb, aside from shoes (Loyalist Arms)/hat (Capt'n Jack hats)/boarding axe (Loyalist Arms, just about everything else be either a derivative of Jack Sparrow or as me breeches what actually be rev/colonial (but passes now that they be button not drop). I have our own Mary Diamond working me a shirt as me current one even be Piraty of the Caribbean style (with large collar and incorrect cut front).

Out here in th' west ye either learn t' make yer own or scour th' web to find custom made. Trouble for many of us is that we do not have time t' make all our own stuff, then for me, now that I have 'time' now I have no money for supplies (still need some canvas for a ditty bag, and leather fer me new stage sword).

But for price, what I paid for me Jack style frock, me current shirt and vest; I could have gotten better 'period' articles by now if they were available at fair...back before me layoff, when I had coin in hand 'n was seeking such items.

Faire need more PC Vendors! (pc as in 'Piraticaly Correct')

[Patrick Hand]

Trouble for many of us is that we do not have time t' make all our own stuff,

but it is just to expensive to buy the right stuff all the time

AAAARrrrrrgh..... now me head hurts.....

Are ye just making a pirate costume fer next weekend.... or are ye plannin' on playin' Pyrate fer a bit longer than that?

I don't think yer alla bunch a' lazy slobs....

I just think yer frustrated about where to start...

luckly, te found th' rightr place iff ye wanna be a Pyrate.....

Expensive ter do it right?.... too much time.....

OK... cotton cost about $2.00 per yard.... linen....about $8.00.... so yeah it cost more.... But the question is... which gives you he most satisfaction...?

I've always been from the cotton camp... figure it out in cheap cotton first, then go (and you have something to wear) to the linen and wool...... There is a stinkin' learnin' curve hear... but luckly... most of us have figgured that out first.... so just ask.....

Sure it takes some time to make it yourself... but it is less expensive, and going to be better than anything you can buy.....

Hollywood or Authentic.... making it yer self is cheaper...ergh... cost less, and wot... a few night o' work, an' ye have somethin' cool.....(how many hours of work do you have to do to buy some cheap crap... when you can spent the same time making something that is good....)

[Quartermaster James]

Faire need more PC Vendors! (pc as in 'Piraticaly Correct')

Faire ain't no place to shop.

Eat, drink and get laid, yes. Shop, no.

Here's a small list of vendors providing off the shelf and some tailored 18th century goods.

Caveat emptor! Do your research before you buy! Know if that gear is right for your impression!

http://www.bellandcompanytraders.com/index.html

http://www.blackbearhistoricalclothing.com

http://www.jarnaginco.com

http://www.cobbcreek.com

http://www.flyingcanoetraders.com

http://www.fortdowning.com

http://www.fugawee.com

http://www.gggodwin.com

http://www.jpsoule.com

http://jas-townsend.com

http://www.just2tailors.com

http://www.piratemonkeysinc.com/pirate/shop.htm#top

http://www.smilingfoxforgellc.com

http://www.smoke-fire.com

Edited February 28, 2009 by Quartermaster James

[MadL]

Patrick, I think ye be missing th' point; some o' us live in a thing call'd th' City and have savage captains what drive us like slaves, force us t' set our alarms for 3:30/4:00am, hit th' road by 5:30am, traverse stormy freewayS for more then an hour, then crack th' whip on our backs till 5pm, then traverse them stormy seas once again (what always seems t' take twice th' time go'n th' other way), then without wenches 'er slaves o' our own once home we have t' slave again over a hot stove ourselves, 'n wash, 'n take out th' trash...then if we be lucky (and if not forced t' bring home some work with us..) then we may get an hour before bed t' work on garb. Then if we be one who live th' life o' a pauper then our only work place may be a spot on th' floor - no fancy dandy 'shop' or cutting table - so all in all, we would go t' faire naked for th' first couple years if we do not purchase pre-made first, then focus on making our own. And I do find cutting large sheets o' fabric on a carpeted floor rather difficult when th' line need be straight....o'course one o' them fancy dandy special fabric cutters with built-in straight edge would help, especially for one such as I that can barely cut a straight line in a piece o' paper.

Aye, true it be that for those who grew up in a world where such things were just daily life, or for those who have had such tailor'n tackle since high school do find it odd when they meet those who only tackle in life be that what they go fish'n with and that what they woe th' high school tarts with.....might I ask ye Patrick; how much 100baseT do ye have lay'n around yer home? Do ye have a punch down in yer tackle? What brand multi-meter do ye use? How many micro-filters have ye replaced in yer vaccum? 'n how many hours a night have ye spent trouble shooting other's code?

There are also some o' us 'pirates' out here that do naught live in a home what has one o' them things called a "back yard" or even have a place t' call a "shop" from where we can partake our activities from. Some of us even need travels for mile t' reach a place that we can fire off our powder without go'n t' jail! Apartments 'n small condos tend t' limit many activities, or at th' least slow them down due t' cramp'd quarters.

But naught that these are all 'excuses'; more 'reasons' that some seek pre-made items, something like a ship having a "blacksmith" for blacksmithing stuff and a "tailor" for tailoring stuff and a "cookie" for cooking stuff. Aye, tis nice t' be all o' them and power to those who have th' time, the knowledge, the space, and the tools! But I for one am a 'one thing at a time' sort; first I 'buy' t' get started, then I seek forums such as this t' begin that 'learning curve' ye speak of (between me other learning curves what actually pay me bills, and support me pirate "hobby" - among me other hobbies)

But true ye be; "ye come to th' right place", for I have scoured these seas and this be th' one I have come t' set port and do me learn'n, naught found any better have I....now it just be a matter o' gathering th' necessary 'tools' and 'supplies' and again....'time' (at this moment in time, for me be th' hurdle o' 'supplies' as I know have most tools - barring that for blacksmithing, that will take me more 'coin', 'equipment', and 'space')

[Patrick Hand]

There are also some o' us 'pirates' out here that do naught live in a home what has one o' them things called a "back yard" or even have a place t' call a "shop" from where we can partake our activities from

Eergh... I live in a RV.... I have a work table that is 24" by 50".... yeah, I do have a sewing machine.... but in Winter, I can't afford to heat alla th' RV, so I do a lot of hand sewing sitting on my bed.....

I have what could kinda be called a front yard.... it's right next to the Parking lot of my Bosses restaurant.....

I work a 9 to 5 as a costume designer (Animal Mascots) so I have a bit of a head start on the sewing bit.... and I waRsh dished Friday and Saturday nights, sometimes getting drafted to work on Wednesday, or Thursday.... You'd think with a full time job, and a part time job, I should have plenty of money.... not so,... I'm owed a lot, but times are tough, so I'm getting by on about $100.00 per week....

I'm single, so I have to waRsh my own dishes, and cloths, and kinda clean-up after myself.... My biggest hinderence is spending too much time on-line, when I should be working on other projects.... But somehow, I still get them done....

Basically, I'm cheap..... why would I want to spend $40+ on a Renn. Faire shirt, when I can make an authentic one outta linen for about $24.00 ...spending a few nights working on it? I don't need it for this next weekend, so I can work on it when I have the time....

[MadL]

Ok Patrick, then ye understand well me own working area and conditions - so how do ye lay out a sheet o' cloth, draw th' straight lines, then cut them straight? Every time I try I get wiggly lines so I just figured them what do it had proper tables and cutters (like I seen on various costume designer tutorial pages), I find carpeted floors t' be very unforgiving when ye trying t' work over a yard long chunk o' cloth - what tips can ye give for those of us without fancy dandy working areas but just a carpet floor, perhaps small (very small) table, 'n a pair o' scissors (no fancy dandy cutting board)??

[Ransom]

Living in a small house, I cut most of my big stuff on the dinning room floor. I fold the fabric as I pin the pattern to it, then unfold and cut as I go. Our extra room is a combination computer room, sewing room, and art room...all that in 12'X12', so big projects get shuffled off to where ever they will fit. Like I said, mostly the floor.

I also live twelve miles out of town, and the town is small, so if I really need something, I have to drive to the next biggest town...45 minutes away. That's where the nearest fabric store is.

The bottom line, MadL, is that you make due. You fit in the time, you find the space, and you just do it. Few of us have a perfect sewing room, or all the time and money in the world to make garb. And a lot of us live in places where there isn't a lot of easily found materials, so count yourself lucky you live in a metro area where things are close to hand.

[Bloody Sam Rackham]

I be usin' th' Dining Room table. It not be but 4' in diameter. I let th' cloth drape off th' end. Straight line cuttin' comes with practice. I usually pin th' pattern to th' cloth an' follow th' lines when I cut. Gets a straighter line that way.

[MadL]

Pattern!??! Avast, aye be true that it mostly be th' "Man" in me, after all I refuse t' stop and ask for directions (wander'd a mall fer three day once, living on cinnamon roll and mocha while sleeping in Lazy Boy, before find'n me way out).

But nonsense aside; I have two problems that have come up when I try using pattern, 'clothing' pattern particularly:

1) I never seem to find one in 'my size', and end up having to follow the directions for "add xx here" and "subtract xx there", which brings back to me issue of 'drawing a straight line free hand on an uneven surface' (I once had a 4' size table, but recent years I no longer have that - it was not in my side o' th' divorce papers....).

2) the part o' "Pin the pattern to the fabric" and "Fold it then unfold it as you go" - that makes sense when I read in print, but my attempts in past to do so I end up with wrinkles and 'bunches' that toss off my measurements and calculations.

Now I know this is all 'me', for I have never actually 'seen' one do it nor did I take 'home ec' in skool, I never even learn'd how t' sow until th' Army when they made us sew on our first set o' patches (I actually did quite well with those small squarish pieces - I was quite proud o' meself!). So I am sure there is something in Where I stick th' needles, or how far I tend t' pin it where I end up screwing things up.

Now me wee bro used t' make costumes years ago for Ren, but I was too busy with martial arts and snow ski and shark fishing back then t' pay him any attention, now he lives cross country so I can not go watch how he does it....perhaps I need t' find me a local tailor what will let me watch while they take one from begining t' end.....and next time, stop and purchase a map o' that blasted mall!!!

[Patrick Hand]

There are two ways that I can get the cloth cut in a straight line...

For shirts and such.... I tear the fabric whenever possible.... that way I'm sure everything goes along with the grain of the fabric. Period shirts are just a buncha squares and rectangles anyway, so tearing the fabric works better than trying to cut it...

OK... some fabric, just doesn't wanna tear right.... so I fold the fabric and cut along the fold....(one blade of the scissors on the inside and the other on the outside of the fold...

Soap is your friend.... ('specially those little tiny bars ye gets in Motels)

I don't use patterns, I draft from measurements and by eye.... so I use soap to mark where I'm going to cut....(sometimes the hardest part is remembering which line I was going to cut.... because I draw all over the fabric...) I can mark the shoulder and arms eye, them move the cloth and mark the rest.... then check everything to make sure I got it all right before I cut the fabric....

For light colored cloth, get one of those disappearing fabric pens.... (Pick one up next time yer gettin yer fabric...)

Yer Dittybag is also yer Friend

OK, it can be a box or something, but a place ter keep alla your sewing stuff in.... Even in tight quarters, it's amazing how easily alla the really small stuff disappears (an' when ye be wantin' ter use it the most...) "A place for everything, and everything in it's place"Ye may wanna slug that smug jerk who keeps sayin' that... but it really does make sewin' so much easier....

Oh yeah.... also put alla th' parts inna box or bag if ye have to stop working on a project (even just overnight).... So ye can find alla th' tiny pieces that otherwise grow legs and walk away.....

[MadL]

There are two ways that I can get the cloth cut in a straight line...

For shirts and such.... I tear the fabric whenever possible.... that way I'm sure everything goes along with the grain of the fabric.

I think Kass mentioned that in one of her tutorials. When I was cutting me market wallet I was trying t' figure out what she meant, was looking at th' square yard o' fabric and try'n t' find "the grain", but I don't think I quite understand 'the grain' of fabric (I can find grain in wood) - can ye elaborate on how t' identify 'the grain' in a piece of cloth.

I know I have has times when cutting cloth that it just refuses to cut straight so I think I know how t' identify 'Against the grain', but naught till After the fact - how can I identify th' direction Before I begin cutting? - I work mostly with linen and hemp cloth...

[michaelsbagley]

There are two ways that I can get the cloth cut in a straight line...

For shirts and such.... I tear the fabric whenever possible.... that way I'm sure everything goes along with the grain of the fabric.

I think Kass mentioned that in one of her tutorials. When I was cutting me market wallet I was trying t' figure out what she meant, was looking at th' square yard o' fabric and try'n t' find "the grain", but I don't think I quite understand 'the grain' of fabric (I can find grain in wood) - can ye elaborate on how t' identify 'the grain' in a piece of cloth.

I know I have has times when cutting cloth that it just refuses to cut straight so I think I know how t' identify 'Against the grain', but naught till After the fact - how can I identify th' direction Before I begin cutting? - I work mostly with linen and hemp cloth...

Edit, the grain is usually the vertical length of the fabric ( I reread the above posts and realized you were not talking about "Bias").

Some fabrics (like denim) have a very obvious diagonal texture to them... The grain is still vertical, and you should ignore the giagonal texture (look at your jeans when you get a chance).

The Bias (what you use when you want more stretch) is almost always on the diagonal of a fabrics length.

[Ransom]

Might I suggest, MadL, that you go to your local library and find a book on simple, basic sewing. A beginner's primer, if you will. I think that would help you understand easier what all of us are talking about. Good books will have plenty of illustrations so you can see exactly what the text means. They will also have a glossary in the back, so you can learn what the different terms mean.

Just my two pence worth, but I really think it would help you.

[Capt. Sterling]

Madl, one of the easiest ways to line up the pattern piece with the grain of the fabric is to find the grain line drawn on the pattern piece (usually a thick black line with arrow points on either end) and run it PARALLEL to the selvage ... which is the finished edge of the fabric.... if you want to be really fussy, you can actually measure the distance, or just eyeball it depending on your fabric's pattern/print/design...

I do not recommend tearing fabric instead of cutting it... I have seen good shirt weight linen ruined by doing this and a number of silks as well.. if you want a straight edge on the cut end of a length of fabric, pull one thread out from selvage to selvage...then cut along the space left by the thread you just pulled... it will give you the straightest edge across the unfinished edge. Not always the simplest option though, some of the threads can be hard to pull...

[Capt. Sterling]

oh btw ...lengthwise grain runs parallel to the selvage...

crosswise grain is perpendicular to the selvage and can be found by pulling the thread as described above

and bias is found by finding the thread line running at a right angle to the lengthwise and crosswise grain...

For most garment pattern pieces you will be running along the lengthwise grain unless you choose to "railroad" your pattern pieces... which means you are placing pattern grain line parallel to the crosswise grain...

Be aware of what your pattern calls for as the grain effects the way the fabric/finished garment hangs when wearing and this, depending on what you are making and what fabric you are using can make or break an article of clothing.

Edited March 2, 2009 by Capt. Sterling

[Dutchman]

not really sure if this is with the topic, but one of the most valuable things in my sewing box is a strong magnet to retrieve wayward needles. i found a ferriers magnet on a wrist band. they use it to hold nails- is a great addition.