oohhhh pretty

[Dutchman]

anybody got a grand i can borrow? http://cgi.ebay.com/AN-18TH-CENTURY-KIT-OF...1QQcmdZViewItem

again, i'll appeal to anyone who can post a picture of this one. sick computers and inept operators are a bad mix, sorry.

[Coastie04]

Oooh, drooling on the keyboard. And, my wife allowed me to bid on it!!! Unfortunately, I was outbid right away, and can't really afford it, but it was fun to bid at least. Someone will be very lucky when they win!!!

Coastie

[Red-Handed Jill]

Wow - a bit out of my price range...

You asked for pics:

[Misson]

Interesting. Those are the same as some of containers used for pocket surgical kits from the period. Makes sense, I suppose. (If that frightens you, don't even start trying to buy medical kits from period. I know I can't afford 'em...)

[Dutchman]

unfortunately, there is little detail of the guts of the container itself. i wonder.... to the drawing board i go. i wonder if there is a breakdown of one of these showing the parts. my question is the shark skin. is there a modern equivalent? mission, in your wanderings, keep your eyes open for the instruments- they should be pretty easy to find in reproduction. i'll start looking tonight after work. darned day shift nuts everything up.

[Misson]

I have a pretty good kit which is not exactly period, but it's close. Much of my pricier tools (well, pricier when they are authentic) are repro from G. Gedney Godwin. As near as I can figure, their stuff is from the early RevWar or a bit after that.

They have some neat items that include a telescope and compass you can see on their webpage here, but I didn't see any navigational equipment. Still, might be worth a deeper look than I gave it.

My pocket kit is probably late 19th, early 20th century. You can see bits of here:

The kit itself is underneath the handle of the large clyster syringe and contains a very non-period clasp (which is why it was tucked under there). The lancet (11) and scalpels (which you can't see in that picture because I used my more correct Godwin repros(14)) have tortoise-shell handles & steel blades (which are period) and little hooks for flipping them open (which I'm pretty sure are not correct).

However, if you come across someone else selling more period-correct repos, color me fascinated to hear about it.

My real challenge is finding a proper large bone saw. I really, really, really want one like Woodall shows in his book The Surgeon's Mate, but so far am striking out on finding a craftsman to make one. It looks like this:

Real ones go for $700+ (and I mean +!)

[Cascabel]

my question is the shark skin. is there a modern equivalent?

......And why not the real thing ???? They DO still make sharks, ya know !!!

Shark skin is fairly easy to work with. A few years back, I was in need of a piece of shark skin to restore a sword handle. I contacted a friend in Florida, and he promissed to send me a piece the next time he caught one.

Anyhow...., he wound up sending me the ENTIRE shark by UPS, frozen solid, of course, with a note saying "skin it yerself !!!". It was as small hammerhead about 3 feet long. I ate the shark, quite tasty, by the way, and used the skin for several projects. Once it is dried, the skin keeps very well.

>>>> Cascabel

[Dutchman]

ahoy cascabel,

was a pleasure meeting you at pyratecon. i still need to get those police training pictures to you sometime. OK cascabel, i'll one up ya on the ups. come for a visit and i'll take you out fishing so you can catch your own.

seriously though, how do you go about drying it?

mission- i have a machinist friend who likes to tinker. he has made some pieces for me and charges less based on the challenge it seems. can you get me sizes of the saw and i'll see what he thinks.

[Cascabel]

It skins fairly easily. You don't need to try to skin the fin areas, just the fairly flat areas like the sides. Just cut out what you want, and start one edge carefully, and pull it off. The belly is good if you want white skin, but it tends to be thinner. After you get it off, rinse in clean water, and stretch it out on a board to dry. It is fairly thin, but tough. Hold it to the board with clothes pins while drying. If you use tacks, they will rust. Salting it heavily on the flesh side will help to draw out the moisture and preserve it. I have not found it necessary to use a tanning process, as it won't be used for anything flexible (at least by me). When it is completely dry, knock off the excess salt.

When you are ready to use it, cut a piece a bit oversize for your project, and soak it in clean water to soften it. Mostly, you will be using it as a glued-on surface layer over something more ridged, or as a decorative covering. It is used commonly on sword handles to give a non-slip grip, and create an attractive look, plus as a decorative textured surface on things like small containers. Various types of ray also have skin with interesting textures.

>>>> Cascabel

[Coastie04]

Came across this while searching ebay after the navigational kit got my interest up. It looks to be from the same seller, but much more affordable. Mission, I thought you might be interested in delving into dentistry a bit as well.

Tooth Extractor

Coastie

[Misson]

A few years back, I was in need of a piece of shark skin to restore a sword handle.  I contacted a friend in Florida, and he promissed to send me a piece the next time he caught one.   

  Anyhow....,  he wound up sending me the ENTIRE shark by UPS,  frozen solid, of course, with a note saying "skin it yerself !!!".    It was as small hammerhead about 3 feet long.    I ate the shark, quite tasty, by the way, and used the skin for several projects.  Once it is dried, the skin keeps very well.

What a great story! (Stories like that are the reason I find re-enacting and re-enactors so much fun.)

[Misson]

Came across this while searching ebay after the navigational kit got my interest up.  It looks to be from the same seller, but much more affordable.  Mission, I thought you might be interested in delving into dentistry a bit as well.

Tooth Extractor

Coastie

Thanks, Coastie! I'll add it to my watch list. I usually spend Saturday mornings searching the eBay medical antique and medical devices categories on eBay and then add them to my watch list for further consideration. (I almost never place a bid within more than 24 hours of auction close. For some reason one bid seems to increase interest and bidding in something on eBay, so I find it's better to wait and see what happens.) From my experience, tooth extractors tend to go for $60 - $150. The fact that this already has a bid although it appears to have just been posted suggests it will go for over $100 from what I've seen.

Tooth extractors actually quite popular for some reason. (My thought is that it's because they're so barbaric looking.) Although my impression is that that handle style is typical of the early/mid 19th century. I could be wrong, though. I wonder why he believes it to be late 18th? ("Sir, what is the provenance of this piece?" )

[Cascabel]

A few years back, I was in need of a piece of shark skin to restore a sword handle.   I contacted a friend in Florida, and he promissed to send me a piece the next time he caught one.   

  Anyhow....,   he wound up sending me the ENTIRE shark by UPS,  frozen solid, of course, with a note saying "skin it yerself !!!".     It was as small hammerhead about 3 feet long.    I ate the shark, quite tasty, by the way, and used the skin for several projects.   Once it is dried, the skin keeps very well.

:angry:

What a great story! (Stories like that are the reason I find re-enacting and re-enactors so much fun.)

......And the rest of the story is that I very carefully removed and cleaned the set of jaws from the shark with the intention of making a pendant or other piece of jewelry out of them. They were perfect miniatures of full sized jaws with multiple rows of teeth. I had propped them open and laid them out in the sun to dry, and one of my cats immediately grabbed them and ran under the porch and ate them !!! .......Oh, well.........................

>>>>> Cascabel

[Dutchman]

so tell us cascabel,

what did you do with the cat hide????

ok i have a ray skin in the works. i'm going to collect me instruments and design the box before cutting into it though. avoid the cart before the horse syndrome.

[Silver]

that is a great kit. there are two item in it that are not named. i think one is a early version of the mechenical pencil the other loks as if will fit in the end of the pencil?

[Dutchman]

the two unmarked pieces are extra fittings that go in the large set of dividers. the extra pieces fit in where the wingnut is. the brass tube is indeed an early mechanical pencil. the second is a shorter leg for the divider. if you look carefully that fitting is a divider in itself. this makes a parralel arc -or- if you go all the way around, a circle within a circle. i have seen other period kits with extra legs that bend 90 degrees down (i'm not sure what purpose it serves though), a small wheel mounted on the end for measuring, and a blade for cutting circles.

[callenish gunner]

yes dutch the brass one is a lead holder the other is an inking point it would draw various thicknesses of inked lines.... the tips would work like a metal pen nib holding the ink between them ....they didn't change too awfully much in 300 years before the advent of the rapidograph technical pens ....i worked as a designer /technical illustrator for almost thirty years and in the beginning of my career we used tools like those and drew on gessoed linen then along came drafting mylar and rapidograph pens......damn !!! i'm older than i thought

[Dutchman]

callenish,

thank you for clarifying the inking point. your version is abundantly clear in operation. how does the first one (from the kit) hold its proper distance without the use of a set?

and the big question- since after your clarification of my description of the beforementioned picture, what in the world was the second item i tried to describe that we now have no picture of?

[callenish gunner]

The second item in the photo I posted is an extention beam to draw circles larger than the compass arms could reach. The picture is just a detail from a larger set of instruments. The earlier inking rule held it's distance by shear skill of the draftsman/cartographer and by friction... .. the later models used the set screw to keep the points accurately spread in the right set of hands the lines were consistent over long lengths and with precise line weight .........the first ships drafts i did i used those sorts of later points that was in 1962 in school by '66 i was working in a shipyard drawing plans for a few ships and large fishing boats....

[callenish gunner]

[Misson]

Tooth Extractor

Coastie

From my experience, tooth extractors tend to go for $60 - $150. The fact that this already has a bid although it appears to have just been posted suggests it will go for over $100 from what I've seen.

Tooth extractors actually quite popular for some reason.

And that one is now going for $202.50. That is the highest I've seen a tooth extractor go for on eBay, although I've only watched a few because they often fetch such high prices. Still, I appreciate the link!

On another note, the mechanical pencil wasn't invented until 1822, long after period. (Being an engineer, these things interest me. )