The state of 'Pirate Music' today

[Capt Thighbiter]

I think that 'Pirate Music' today is in a similar state as the whole garb issue. For garb, we have the hard core re-enactors, who strive to recreate the clothes and accoutraments that were in actual use during the GAoP. On the other hand we have those who are more interested in representing what the general public thinks pirates dressed like. And lots of shades of difference in between the two outlooks.

For pirate music, we have those who try to re-create the actual music of the period, with period instruments and voicing and arrangements. And on the other side of the coin, we have the pirate 'core' style ( akin to heavy metal with words using the seamans and pirates vernacular).

And of course almost every variation in between the two polarized schools

I think the musicians have a tougher job then the garb folks; unlike garb, which is at least recorded in paintings and prints, that are un-equivical in regards to what is depicted, music of the period, outside of classical music, is not usualy described in enough detail to say 'yes, this is the arrangement and this was the feel to it'. Even the hard core traditionalist in music must admit that sheet music of a period fiddle tune, in example, is open to interpretation as far as voicing, ornamentation and the like. Often I will come across an intersting song, containing lyrics only, with either no musical notation or perhaps a note the the song is sung to the tune of "XXXXXXXX XXXX". If one is lucky, the tune "XXXXXXX XXXX" is known. Often it is not ( at least to me).

Our ( THe Brigands) own approach, when we are not performing a 'modern ' pirate song, is to apply our own twist to songs. We always keep in mind that we are entertainers first. IMHO, it does no good to be 100% historically accurate if the audiences we perform for are bored, disinterested or otherwise un-involved in the song. We employ lots of modern techniques ( tiny rests to emphasise a particular passage, instrument breaks, polyphony at key lines and others) so tht the modern listener has something to hang thier hat on, so to speak. For fiddle tunes, if I can figure out 4 variations on the basic melody line, they all get used in the tune. LOL, I can remember years ago, when visiting a jam session at a traditional music society, I was looked at agast when I pulled out all the variations I have on "Soldiers Joy aka THe King's Head". Like I was painting a moustache on the Mona Lisa. And my own interpretations are influenced by the kind of fiddle tunes that speak loudest to me, Scottish tunes. These are typified by lots of short hammer ons and very abrupt noting. I also like to do what I call musical gymnastics, outlandishly complex melodic runs that are tour de force of melodic variation ( 64th notes, anyone?). So when I perform a traditional tune, or write a new tune, I tend to use those techniques.

Period correct? No. Entertaining? I like to think so, since I am injecting some of myself into the performance.

IMHO, variaton in melody would have been a natural occurence, expecially for ship bound musicians

I've seen and heard some very accomplished musicians play period pieces by the 'book'. And have 5 people last though the whole song. And I've heard some of the pirate 'core' groups scream lyrics out accompanied by riffs stolen right from Ozzie Osborn and get about the same reaction. The key in my opinion is entertainment. I think there is room for all the styles and genre as long as you are entertaining the troops.

I applogise for the long winded post. It's 9:00 Sunday morning, it's beautiful outside and my pain meds have kicked in, so taking my usual Sunday morning motorcycle ride aound Long Island is not a good idea.

LOL maybe writing this isn't either, but one hardly ever breaks a leg while typing.

Anyone else with opinons on this?

[TheBlackFox]

There really are so many varieties of chanty music performance that it would be difficult to pin down whether traditional versions of a song are more or less entertaining than updated versions (IMHO). For me, it depends on the venue and the audience. A fireside bar with an audience of 50 will enjoy an acapella performance with all its nuances. In contrast, a rowdy version of the same music in front of a large crowd, half-crazed with drink, will also find a niche of enjoyment.

Even more complex is that the same chanty is performed differently by similar acapella groups. I've heard a few versions of "Health to the Company" and "Charley Mops" at different tempos and every time I hear a new version, I find my head tilting like the RCA dog at the sound. They're all enjoyable. . . . and don't get me started on how many millions of varieties of "Drunken Sailor" I've heard.

In my position, I get a new CD on my desk almost every week now. A lot of the music is basic chanty music. . .but some have a loud Rock-n-Roll twist and I've heard versions in Rap, Punk, Latin, and some that I could only describe as "best-enjoyed-with-a-hallucinogen -of-choice."

I think I enjoy most of it. I try to keep an open mind and concentrate on the sound, both in quality and talent . . .but sometimes it's really tough when the creative variances almost obliterate the traditional atmosphere of the chanty's intent.

[Bilgemunky]

It seems quite common to view modern pirate enthusiasts as two opposites - the historical reenactors, and the "hollywood" pirates (those who promote the popular image of pirate rather than the historical truth.) What is often overlooked are those folks who aren't trying to recreate anything, but rather take inspiration from piracy and do as they will with it from a fashion or other creative perspective. I've seen punks with bucket boots and spiked leather jackets. I've seen a mod pirate in white leather, funky sunglasses, jolly rogered tights and purple plumage. And I've seen more than a handful of biker pirates (we've all seen these, I expect.) These folks are actually the flip side of the coin, with the Hollywood pirate being much more closely aligned with their worthy adversary the reenactor than most would care to admit.

Historical pirate shanty groups obviously line up well next to historical reenactors - both are trying to recreate and educate true historical piracy. They both also face the challenges and limitations of presenting accurate, documented facets of their craft.

In contrast, I would equate many of the festival pirate bands (Jolly Rogers and such), who sing "chanteyish" music of a traditional-ish nature to the Hollywood pirates - the general public may not realize its not really historical, but likely they sell many more CDs in the end. Such bands are in the business of giving the audience what it wants, and if that means jazzing up the traditional a bit or a lot, so be it.

Pirate-Core, that being the pirate-themed rap, metal, punk, alternative, etc, is really a different beast altogether. No Pirate-Core band I've ever met intends or pretends to be traditional or historically accurate - and any member of the audience that thinks they're hearing period music is a lost cause anyways. Essentially, Pirate-Core is right there with skull&crossbone t-shirts, Disney's Treasure Planet, Pirate-inspired runway fashion, and all other modern artistic endeavours that aim to take what they want from piracy, and then create something new.

So I guess my point is that - love it or hate it (I love it) - Pirate-Core can't be judged on its success at capturing historical elements, as that's not its intent. Festival or Hollywood shanty groups walk a more dubious path, as they intend to entertain, but risk generating a false impression with their audience as to what is and is not a historical chanty. And hardcore purists have their own challenges, as historical music is sometimes dry by today's standards. And thanks to sketchy, incomplete records, oftentimes the only way to guarantee you're not playing a historically innaccurate note is to pack up the banjo and go home, which isn't much fun for anyone.

[Capt Thighbiter]

Both good points, from people that hear more then the average share of pirate music. Anyone else?

BTW Bilgey, I like some of the 'core' music groups too. LOL I wonder how they might take an accoustic version of some of thier tunes - can you say accoustic "Buccaneer Bog" or "Ramming Speed"?

[Bilgemunky]

when worlds collide, eh?

[MadL]

.......What is often overlooked are those folks who aren't trying to recreate anything, but rather take inspiration from piracy and do as they will with it from a fashion or other creative perspective.....

I kinda feel that this is exactly what the pirates themselves did actually 'n that would be how they became th' peoples we now try to imitate.

And I bet their parents always stomped on th' deck yelling down at them "TURN DOWN THAT NOISE!!" too they did

but then on th' other hand, perhaps there was pirates who partook on weekends o' reenacting th' middle 'n dark ages....hmm, wonder if they had a Capt'n Jack Terradactyl?

[Duchess]

I like Bilgemunky's description of there really being three types, in both musical and garbical reenactors. I view this as something like partial credit on a test. Not meaning to imply that any one fails of course.

The Capt. brings up some interesting points what with "open to interpretation" sheet music or none altogether. I suspect that music really is a much more personal thing and was much more flexible than clothing even. After all this same vagueness is inherent in Baroque music of the times as well. No chamber group , though playing on period correct instruments, would play a piece the same as another. Each player brings his or her own history and current desires to the piece each time they play it. Music isn't like clothes, which are made once instead it is made anew each time it is played. And yet an educated listener would still know a Baroque piece when its played.

I suppose what I'm saying is don't feel that adding your own spin suddenly makes something incorrect.

[Dutchman]

i don't like people yelling at me and say its music. place that review in what ever group you like.

we tried a rowing chantey one day and it was an amazing discovery. we had to slow the song down so slow it had no discernable beat or rythm- quite unpallatable as willoughby called it. if we had gone any faster our oarsmen would have been dead in ten minutes trying to keep up.

[MadL]

we tried a rowing chantey one day and it was an amazing discovery. we had to slow the song down so slow it had no discernable beat or rythm- quite unpallatable as willoughby called it. if we had gone any faster our oarsmen would have been dead in ten minutes trying to keep up.

ye need an evinrude mate

[Bilgemunky]

Aye, I'm not much a fan of yelling either, for the most part. Some pirate metal is indistinguishable from non-pirate metal - all banging guitars with "YALDK!!!!WAHHHHHGGGG!!!!DEEEVOTNATELLL!!!!!!!!!" sort of lyrics. Not my thing. But a bit of angry gravel can do a lot to turn a friendly sea shanty into a pirate song. But then, so can singing about peglegs and rum.

[TheBlackFox]

Music. . .like wenches. . .always get more beautiful the more rum ye drink, mates.

I'm just sayin' is all.

[MadL]

Music. . .like wenches. . .always get more beautiful the more rum ye drink, mates.

I'm just sayin' is all.

I Drink T' That Mate!!

[MadL]

Some o' me favorite songs I ha'e heard on BilgeMunky Radio:

All Me Grog (sung by kids)

Bathtub Pirates

Break Out The Rum

Boom The Guns Go

Castrating Katie

Henry Martin

I Wanta Be A Hollywood Pirate

Lured To The Death

Monohan The Mutanier

Pirate Lullaby

Pirate Heaven

Bilge's read'n o' Poebeard's 'The Raven'

Pride of Griphindor

The Mouse

Time Flys When Yer Having Rum

Tortuga

Wenches and Grog

Whores of Sailor Town

Bell Bottom Trousers

Going Back To The Sea

Buccaneer's Ball

Captain Slaymore

Dark Lady

(not all names are most likely correct but they be what I know them as)

'n o'course he plays Pirate Jenny, the Jolly Rogers, the Pirates Royal, Capt Boog, Bilge Pumps, Pirates of New Providence, 'n th Skeleton Crew Band. But I heard/have all o' them before tuning into BilgeMunky Radio.

'n can not forget me Favorite o' all: "Adventures of BilgeMunky" Episodes 1 & 2 (still wait'n fer episode 3 I be )

what I ha'e not hear on BilgeMunky nay ha'e I found on CD but did manage t' blunder from he's website is a couple o' tunes from one who goes by 'Bonehead'; "If The Bottle Don't Get Me, You Will" 'n "All Good Things Come To An End". Nay to I belie'e t' ha'e heard the Bilge e'er play "The Worst Pirate Song"?? Nor th' song from the' 2007 Pirate Palooza "Pirate Annie's Chest" (not that be a roar'n Good one it be!)

[Bilgemunky]

what I ha'e not hear on BilgeMunky nay ha'e I found on CD but did manage t' blunder from he's website is a couple o' tunes from one who goes by 'Bonehead'; "If The Bottle Don't Get Me, You Will" 'n "All Good Things Come To An End". Nay to I belie'e t' ha'e heard the Bilge e'er play "The Worst Pirate Song"?? Nor th' song from the' 2007 Pirate Palooza "Pirate Annie's Chest" (not that be a roar'n Good one it be!)

Harrr - Worst Pirate Song and Pirate Annie's Chest have both been featured on Bilgemunky Radio, mate! Bonehead, on the other hand - I'm familiar, but their website never had an email. If you know how to contact them, DO let me know!

[MadL]

Alas BilgeMunky, I found their site quite by accident while sail'n stormy seas at work one day. I tore their ship apart from bow t' stern 'n e'ery where below I did but all I could find was these two songs...I think there may ha'e been a third but was not much impressed with it meself.

Now I can no longer e'en find that wee piece o' land no more, shame, twas a nice site it was, excellent graphics. I intended t' keep an eye on it should any more songs come up t' surface...perhaps the devil came demand'n he's collar bone back

They had a good sound for a new age group, not loud, words that could be heard, 'n a good splash o' salty pirate flare...."If the bottle don't get me, you will"; now them be some words true'r then paint fer sure, 'specially with a saucy red-head wench at th' bottom as th' song goes

[Bilgemunky]

Alas, yer correct on all accounts - spot on in your summary of the site and the sounds, and also accurate in your observation that they've been swallowed by the waves. My own bookmark of their site seems dead as dead.

[Ransom]

It seems quite common to view modern pirate enthusiasts as two opposites - the historical reenactors, and the "hollywood" pirates (those who promote the popular image of pirate rather than the historical truth.) What is often overlooked are those folks who aren't trying to recreate anything, but rather take inspiration from piracy and do as they will with it from a fashion or other creative perspective. I've seen punks with bucket boots and spiked leather jackets. I've seen a mod pirate in white leather, funky sunglasses, jolly rogered tights and purple plumage. And I've seen more than a handful of biker pirates (we've all seen these, I expect.) These folks are actually the flip side of the coin, with the Hollywood pirate being much more closely aligned with their worthy adversary the reenactor than most would care to admit.

Historical pirate shanty groups obviously line up well next to historical reenactors - both are trying to recreate and educate true historical piracy. They both also face the challenges and limitations of presenting accurate, documented facets of their craft.

In contrast, I would equate many of the festival pirate bands (Jolly Rogers and such), who sing "chanteyish" music of a traditional-ish nature to the Hollywood pirates - the general public may not realize its not really historical, but likely they sell many more CDs in the end. Such bands are in the business of giving the audience what it wants, and if that means jazzing up the traditional a bit or a lot, so be it.

Pirate-Core, that being the pirate-themed rap, metal, punk, alternative, etc, is really a different beast altogether. No Pirate-Core band I've ever met intends or pretends to be traditional or historically accurate - and any member of the audience that thinks they're hearing period music is a lost cause anyways. Essentially, Pirate-Core is right there with skull&crossbone t-shirts, Disney's Treasure Planet, Pirate-inspired runway fashion, and all other modern artistic endeavours that aim to take what they want from piracy, and then create something new.

So I guess my point is that - love it or hate it (I love it) - Pirate-Core can't be judged on its success at capturing historical elements, as that's not its intent. Festival or Hollywood shanty groups walk a more dubious path, as they intend to entertain, but risk generating a false impression with their audience as to what is and is not a historical chanty. And hardcore purists have their own challenges, as historical music is sometimes dry by today's standards. And thanks to sketchy, incomplete records, oftentimes the only way to guarantee you're not playing a historically innaccurate note is to pack up the banjo and go home, which isn't much fun for anyone.

Huzzah, Bilgemunkey. This is probably the most intelligent explination of the difference between period and non-period, in both music and garb, that I have ever heard. This should be bookmarked at the head of Twill, and a few other places.

As for the music, I like pretty much all of it, except pirate head-banger stuff. Bashing drums, and shrieking and yelling words I can't understand, has no appeal at all.

My favorite CDs of the moment are:

Live Scallywags by Pirate Charles

Down Among the Dead Men by Pirates of New Providence

The Paddy West School of Seamanship by The Seadogs

(BTW, I hope Bildgmunkey gets my name again for the Secret Santa exchange. I scored big time last year. Some very kewl CDs from the pirate who knows his music. )

[MadL]

Ye can actually look at it as hand'n down a story from generation t' generation ye can. Like the mermaids 'n sirens o' th' sea, th' stories ha'e been told from one generation t' th' next, then th' next, 'n so on ' so on th'e stories ha'e been told. With each generation th' stories change slightly, some generation more then th' rest, but changed none th' less, until now most folk don't e'en believe in th' fish people no more, they think they be just sea cows off th' Florida keys 'n noth'n more....but t' us true historians, we knows they out there we do, we knows bet'er then t' fall under th' sweet spell o' th' siren's song when we's hear it. But t' common folk they be just Disney cartoons, lit'le red-head'd girls who don't e'en drink rum at'll.

Aye, in th' next 300 year it would be interesting t' see what people (should there be still any people) think a "real pirate" look'd n' sound'd like, t'would be right interesting indeed. Will they be sing'n shanty song 'bout "Oil Run'n Through The Gulf", 'er perhaps sing'n 'bout "The Great Tobacco Trades - the Brown Gold Rush", perhaps maybe e'en songs 'bout th' great "Prohibition O' the 21st Century". But one thing be certain, they will be sing'n shanty songs 'bout how Gasoline cost less then Rum!!!

....hmmm, me wonders... in 300 year folk might think pirates where really just giant purple monkeys all dressed up like Jack Sparrows 'n plunder'n th' airwaves