A sailors normal day?

[callenish gunner]

Sterling go to Staples,or the like, and get a ream of parchment stock and print the pdf out and then stich and bind it in Morrocan leather since you obviously have nothing else to do!!!

[Raphael Misson]

I don't much like .pdfs either, but they're better than nothing. (And, in the case of Dampier, they're better than spending $25K, which is the only price I could find for the original on-line!)

I wish I could point you to a good copy of Rogers' original book. The only .pdf I found was from the 19th century and it looks badly tampered with by the editor.

I wonder what the copyright status is when one of the large, expensive-to-subscribe-to databases scans something into a .pdf? Surely they can't own any copyright to the original manuscript?

[Raphael Misson]

Oh boy! I discovered a new set of sea journals! I ordered it through inter-library loan today. While not necessarily the "common seaman's" life, they sound very interesting to me, particularly the last one.

Three sea journals of Stuart times, being, first, the diary of Dawtrey Cooper, captain of the Pelican of the navy of His Majesty King Charles I. Kept during the expediton under the Earl of Lindsey to relieve La Rochelle in the year of our Lord 1628. Secondly, the journals of Jeremy Roch, captain of the King's navy, describing some remarkable voyages and adventures at sea during the reigns of their Majesties Charles II, James II and William III, together with a description of the grand engagements between the English and Hollander in the year 1666, in which he took an active part. Thirdly, the diary of Francis Rogers, London merchant. Kept on his voyages to the East Indies, the West Indies and elsewhere in the years 1703 and 1704, describing many strange sights and adventures in different parts of the globe. Edited and transcribed from the original manuscripts by Bruce S. Ingram. (1877)

[Raphael Misson]

As I motor through Edward Coxere's book, I am struck by the difference between his views of the men he sailed with and his pay and the views of Edward Barlow. Barlow complains fairly consistently throughout his journal about the Captains he sailed under, officers and particularly the Pursers. He is even set ashore to find his own way home mid-voyage by a Captain on one journey (whom Barlow says is another poor Captain in his litany of poor Captains). Barlow rarely has any money and regularly complains about his wages and plans for making money going wrong. Coxere, on the other hand, always talks about how good (or at least decent to him) and interesting his officers are. He highlights how one captain goes to great lengths to keep Coxere from being pressed by a gang (where Barlow is one of two men taken off a ship at one point in his journal by such a gang.) He always seems to have money enough from his voyages and strikes several good bargains on his behalf. He explains that he is well treated by officers, even when other men are not being so treated.

Now, these men sailed only 20 years apart. Could it have been that different? Or is it just their perception and what they did in response to their environment that made their situations what they were? It hearkens to Shakespeare's wonderful quote, "There is nothing either good or bad but thinking makes it so" and to that old hoary concept, what you put out into the world comes right back to you in spades.

[LadyBarbossa]

Hmm... have that book "Two Years Before the Mast"... haven't gotten far in reading it though.

I know this is not period by any means, more a second hand info... by Richard O'Neill book "Patrick O'Brian's Navy" in response to Patrick O'Brian's series "Master and Commander" on how the Navy was run at that time... supposedly. I guess, it's somewhat gives an idea on a common sailor's routine... well at least in the Navy... loose use of it but can be helpful I suppose in understanding how the time was handled.

On page 76 there was graph that showed a seperation of "Idlers",Larboard watch and Starboard Watch their timetable as to when they ate, when they slept, when their watch was or was working, when they drilled, and when their leisure time was.

Now... again not sure how accurate this be for sure. But it's a neat idea.

What say ye to this, mates? How close was this to the real thing?

Thank ye for the PDFs though... invaluable info there.

~Lady B

[Mission]

Thought I'd raise this up as I was recently recommending Barlow. What does everyone think of Two Years Before the Mast by Richard Henry Dana? I know it's about a 100 years past period, but is there enough worthwhile stuff in there to make it worth the read?

[Daniel]

I personally doubt that Dana is worth the effort. He has a very labored, Victorian prose style that, for me, is tougher to penetrate than Charles Johnson or Daniel DeFoe. And it's so far removed from GAoP in both time and location that the book's pure research value is questionable. But it didn't help that I listened to the book on CD read by a very poor narrator; with a hardcopy that allows you to go back and reread some of Dana's more cumbersome locutions, it might be more bearable.

Barlow's journals are coming up now in my reading of Rodger's Command of the Ocean; he seems to have been quite the pessimist, and he has a hilarious quote disparaging physicians and surgeons. Just to be clear; is he the same Barlow whose East Indiaman tangled with Captain Kidd at the mouth of the Red Sea?

[Mission]

Just to be clear; is he the same Barlow whose East Indiaman tangled with Captain Kidd at the mouth of the Red Sea?

Yes.

He is a bit pessimistic (sometimes more than a bit), but he gets into details which I enjoyed. Plus the style in the published books is easy to read. His are probably the best sailor's journals I've read. I was writing a fictional piece here on the forum at the time and his book very much informed mine. I've also picked bits and pieces of his style and put them into the Surgeon's Journals on occasion.

[Bos'n Cross]

it upsetts me that i cant get a hold of barlow's, or coxere's journals.....despair............the internets has faiiiiiilllled me......

[Mission]

it upsetts me that i cant get a hold of barlow's, or coxere's journals.....despair............the internets has faiiiiiilllled me......

Dude, library. Besides, you work for an historic site, surely they have the ability to get hold of books for research. Take the initiative! (It took me almost a year of trying different angles to finally get a copy of Woodall's book The surgions mate, but I did figure it out.)

[Mission]

Here's another bunch of sea journals that I've never seen before, free for the asking: A Collection of Voyages and Travels, Assembled by Daniel Coxe.

This contains TEN journals. Nearly the first half of the book is taken up by priest Dominic Navarette's Journal of his sea and land voyages in China from 1700. I have already read some of this and I found it to be pretty tedious going for the most part. I stopped reading that a couple dozen pages after he landed.

However, following that there's a Journal for travels in the middle east beginning in 1473, one for Chili from 1642&3, a short one from Formosa (Taiwan), date unknown to me, another for Japan, John Monck's voyage beginning in Greenland in 1619, A description of Ukraine and parts of Poland, one to the Congo in 1667, yet another in the Congo in 1689, and Sir Thomas Roe's Journal of travels in the East Indies from the earth 17th century.

They're all pre golden age of piracy, but you never know what insights you might find in a sea journal.