LadyBarbossa Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 Some folks on a PotC Costuming chat list are curious why Jack Sparrow and Barbossa's left hands are gloved and protected. I'm sure someone answered this at some point in time a couple years ago, but that thread is lost now I'm sure. So, if someone can clearly elaborate on the subject once more... greatly appreciate it. Is there a reason for it? ~Lady B Tempt Fate! an' toss 't all t' Hell!" "I'm completely innocent of whatever crime I've committed." The one, the only,... the infamous! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainJackRussell Posted June 10, 2007 Share Posted June 10, 2007 I guess there is. As far as my experiences in historical fencing there are many techniques to disarm the opponent or get his sword out of the line or occupied simply the left hand is used. The right hand, often protected by basket or hilt, is delivering an attack then with high efficienzie. Friendly blows, Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capnwilliam Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 This is true for earlier periods like the Elizabethan era, Capt. Jack, but by the GAOP, I doubt that there was much use of the off-hand in a sword fight: unless it contained a pistol! Capt. William "The fight's not over while there's a shot in the locker!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainJackRussell Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Sorry, I disagree... Just take a look at fencing manuals (Ott, Hutton etc.) and you'll clearly see it is still in common. Period is early to late 18th. I just have the fencing manuals as .pdf, too large to put on my webspace, but, if wanted, I take some screenshots. Friendly blows, Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyratePhil Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 One point to consider is, how many of those who eventually "went pirate" had formal training in European fencing techniques? Espada y daga etc. is all very nice and proper but it takes a long time to master it sufficiently to use in an actual land-based fight, let alone on a gyrating ship. Here's an idea: they wore the glove on their left hand in the movie because it looked cool! I mean, ALL the hot warrior-types in the movies wear fingerless gloves, right, so why not pyrates? ...Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum... ~ Vegetius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Jim Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 It will probably muddy the waters a bit to point out that Sparrow wears a sort of "palm protector" on his right hand while Barbossa's is on the left. So Barbossa's might be for parrying (but without fingers, risky: perhaps that's how he lost the fingers) but Sparrow's is more of a "batting glove" to improve grip. Purely speculation, of course, and with no real basis in history. Anyway I agree, It's supposed to look cool. My occupational hazard bein' my occupation's just not around... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyratePhil Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Wow - didn't notice the different sides - good eye! ...Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum... ~ Vegetius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Jim Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Wow - didn't notice the different sides - good eye! Thanks. As a retired fighter and weapons man I am trained to spot stuff like that. Notice next time you watch the first movie that they both are right handed but often draw their guns lefty. This is especially noticeable in the final showdown when Barbossa gets killed: he and Sparrow both draw left-handed. My occupational hazard bein' my occupation's just not around... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyBarbossa Posted June 11, 2007 Author Share Posted June 11, 2007 Sparrow glove doesn't encompass his whole hand. Just the palm of it. Both generally do wrap around the wrist. Honestly, I don't see how a wrap would "protect" a hand against a sharp cutlass or saber. I wasn't sure if it was only weapons related or not. I thought I heard somewhere that it also had something to do with shipboard duties. What? I don't know. ANY info would be appreciated as these people are utterly confused. ~Lady B Tempt Fate! an' toss 't all t' Hell!" "I'm completely innocent of whatever crime I've committed." The one, the only,... the infamous! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelsbagley Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Sparrow glove doesn't encompass his whole hand. Just the palm of it. Both generally do wrap around the wrist. Honestly, I don't see how a wrap would "protect" a hand against a sharp cutlass or saber. I wasn't sure if it was only weapons related or not. I thought I heard somewhere that it also had something to do with shipboard duties. What? I don't know. ANY info would be appreciated as these people are utterly confused. ~Lady B It's not so much as protection from a sword thrust, but the defensive manuevers talked about (if i am not mis-reading the posts) is that an opponents sword is swatted out of the way. When sword fighting (more fencing style) the tip of the sword is often waved around just out of range in an opponent's face to try and psych an opponent out or gain positioning. By swatting the point of the blade away, you (if you are lucky and quick about it) can possibly get a thrust in with the opponents blade out of the way. Does that make more sense? So if the sword fighting option is what it is supposed to be, it is there NOT so much as "armour", but as a mild safety defense to prevent scratches when swatting a blade out of the way. And I think the other option you are talking about is a sailor's palm (used to reduce rope burn on hands?). There is a thread about sailor's palm somewhere in twill if memory serves me well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Hand Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 And I think the other option you are talking about is a sailor's palm (used to reduce rope burn on hands?). A Sailors Palm only covers part of the palm, and it has a chunk of rawhide, and a lead thimble on it..... They are used for sewing heavy canvas...... What Sparrow is wearing isn't a Sailors Palm..... I also think it was just to look cool...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PyratePhil Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Thanks. As a retired fighter and weapons man I am trained to spot stuff like that. Notice next time you watch the first movie that they both are right handed but often draw their guns lefty. This is especially noticeable in the final showdown when Barbossa gets killed: he and Sparrow both draw left-handed. Embarrassingly enough I should be able to make the same claim, UNretired, but I don't think I will today. Well, the left-handed draw is for keeping the sword-hand open, no? ...Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum... ~ Vegetius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BILLY BONES Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 As with any dragoon or cavalry troops in the 18th and 19th centuries, the right hand was always for the sword or saber. The left for the pistol or revolver. Of course, in the 18th and early 19th, only pommel holsters were used. Not that pirates necessarily gave a crap. Now having been an armorer on 2 & 3, I can tell you that the actors probably drew with the left out of conveniance at the time, although Barbossa liked to wear his pistol for a lefty draw. I believe Johnny wore his glove so that the audience would ask just such questions as you're asking. It gives a small history or backstory,-- oh--- and it looks cool. Capt. William Bones Then he rapped on the door with a bit of stick like a handspike that he carried, and when my father appeared, called roughly for a glass of rum. This, when it was brought to him, he drank slowly, like a connoisseur, lingering on the taste, and still looking about him at the cliffs and up at our signboard. "This is a handy cove," says he, at length; " and a pleasant sittyated grog-shop. Much company, mate?" My father told him no, very little company, the more was the pity. "Well, then," said he, "this is the berth for me." Proprietor of Flags of Fortune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Jim Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Well, the left-handed draw is for keeping the sword-hand open, no? In the aforementioned scene their sword hands were full, hence the left draw. It really falls to how you practice. If you practice left to keep your hand open or to allow you to fight and shoot at the same time then left hand work would give one an advantage. Since these are professional pyrates, I would expect them to practice to their advantage over and above basic fight skills. But that's just the ol' Bushido talkin'. My occupational hazard bein' my occupation's just not around... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capnwilliam Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 Here's an idea: they wore the glove on their left hand in the movie because it looked cool! I suspect you figured out the real reason! It's always risky trying to figure out real life reasons for reel life situations. Capt. William "The fight's not over while there's a shot in the locker!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 As a good friend of mine recently said "When someone shows me a source for ghost ships crewed by the damned in the 18thC Caribbean I'll start discussing the historical merits of PotC". It looks cool. Foxe"With this Fore-Staff he fansies he does Wonders, when, God knows, it amounts to no more but only to solve that simple Question, Where are we? Which every chi'd in London can tell you." - Ned Ward The Wooden World Dissected, 1707ETFox.co.uk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlislekid Posted June 12, 2007 Share Posted June 12, 2007 Cutlass cuts HURT, Right hand for sword fighting, left hand for main gauche or pistol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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