MBS Georgian Pistol Parts Set

[Captain Jim]

Ordered this today from Muzzle Builders Supply. I will be posting a review and build notes as the project progresses.

[Matusalem]

Thanks, I saw that site too. That's a nice pistol! How about the hardware? Brass? or silver? WHat's best for GAOP? I have my sites on the French dragoon pistol from those folks. When I get the $$, I'm going to do it. trying to stay french.

And also this French pistol:

http://www.loyalistarms.freeservers.com/17...h%20pistol.html

Believe it or not, I have to technically register this as a handgun,andobtain a pistol license in NJ,as I'm sure that gun laws in your state are probably more friendly to flintlocks. Not in police-state NJ, the laws put blackpower guns in the same category as with Glocks and H&K assault rifles. Go figure.

[HarborMaster]

Ordered this today from Muzzle Builders Supply. I will be posting a review and build notes as the project progresses.

Captain Jim

Aye.., I am looking forward to this thread Captain Jim.

[Captain Jim]

Matuslem, the firearms laws in FL are very friendly. In fact, this pistol is not classified as a firearm under the law. I purchased this set in brass, perhaps the next in silver and ebonize the stock to render a very evil-looking silver on black effect.

I went with this style as it is within our period and is different from the dragoon-syle military pistols of the time. Just something different. I purchased the 20 gauge (.62 caliber) barrel mostly because I like loud and also because a great number of pistols were of calibers that today we normally associate with muskets. Big, slow chunks of lead were the way to go until the advent of smokeless powder raised the muzzle velocities and barrel pressures.

I browned the barrel/lock of my dragoon pistol, but I plan to keep this one armory bright, sealing it with tung oil to keep FL humidity at bay.

[Ol Man From the Sea]

Big, slow chunks of lead were the way to go until the advent of smokeless powder raised the muzzle velocities and barrel pressures.

Ok, help me out here. I thought that a large caliber is needed with a ball to get enough weight. Without rifling you need a ball, cause a ball don't care if it tumbles. With rifling you can use a Miniball or modern ogive and get the weight with a smaller caliber and more length. Barrel pressures went up because of better barrels, and better control of powder amounts, not better powder? Where did I go wrong?

[Captain Jim]

Boy, that's a lot of ballistics to go over. I'm at work so I have to be brief.

In the beginning smooth bores and round balls were normal. Later came the discovery that spinning the ball stabilized things, no more knuckle ball patterns. Rifling raised the pressures slightly by resisting the forward motion of the ball, but thicker barrels were needed to have metal in which to cut the rifling, so barrels got thicker (by trial and error mostly) because of the two factors. Metallurgy got better, resulting in still better barrels. Welded barrels gave way to "fluid steel". Experiments with mini-balls and other "cylindrical" bullets followed to give the rifling more "bite" (and to a lesser degree, add weight.) More bite equals more pressure, especially as less gas was escaping around the bullet due to "expanding base" designs. Better powder, in more predictable formulas in finer grades increased pressures still more. Then came smokeless that burns at a greater rate than does black. Pressure spikes at ignition went through the roof. Shorter barrels were possible because of the short burn duration, and barrels got thinner again due to still better metallurgy. Muzzle velocities kept going up.

The gunpowder/barrel/pressure/velocity relationship in one paragraph, so obviously not in any great depth.

Edit: Energy can be transferred with a bullet in two ways: slow and big vs. fast and small. Of course you can go big and fast for optimum kick, but accelerating a big bullet to very fast creates an uncontrolable gun, or a cannon. So as pressures and muzzle velocities increased smaller, faster bullets could do the work of larger, slower bullets of the past.

[Matusalem]

Not sure whether these particular Connecticut people have ever dealt with the Disney prop department, but they got some nifty stuff, particularly period Queen Anne pistols....something to aspire to:

http://www.ambroseantiques.com/fpistols.htm

Captain Jim, now that I have a complete woodshop down in my basement, I am burning to do one of those kits from the link you mentioned. Any suggestions to get that dark gummy antique look on the wood/metal appreciated.

[Captain Jim]

Antiqueing a piece is not too hard, especially if you are willing to allow a little rust to form on the metal parts, even lightly pit it. (Never, never, never allow the inside of the barrel to pit. Ever.) Ebonizing mix (white vinegar in which steel [rusty nails or steel wool] has been allowed to soak) and an artists brush will turn selected parts of the stock dark, from "slightly dirty" to coal black. Amonia (fumes) will turn brass dark, even black. Burn away parts of the stock near the touch hole to simulate many years of firing. Add some fireplace ash or BP residue to tung oil, brush on the whole gun, wait a bit, then wipe it down, leaving buildup in the cracks and crevices. You may have to do that more than once over several days to get the desired effect. Use close-ups of quality antiques as your guide. Mind you that these are counterfieting methods used by some to make new guns look old. However...

If you are portraying a pyrate during the GAoP, your gun will be relatively new, 0-5 years old. It won't be antique for another 300 years or so. Your entire kit should look used but not old. On the other hand, if you are portraying a "returned from the dead" halloween pyrate then the antique, grimy and stored in the attic look is good. Talcum powder dust...

[Matusalem]

Captain Jim, many thanks, that is exactly what I wanted to hear. My hobbies seem to revolve around fine woodworking, expecially of the nautical variety.

....first, I have to deal with the police-state laws of NJ: 1. Aquire hand-gun license (which means I get fingerprinted), 2. apply for purchase permit. All must be done since I live directly behind my town's police dept. and a few of my neighbors are cops. Then, if I ever make PIP, (which d I saw you last year there...if that was you bespectacled) I must find a way to get in and out of airports. I just want to stay within the law. Blackpowder guns get treated the same as H&K assault rifles here in NJ. I even have to register my .177 cal CO2 air pistol, which I never did.

I've seen reenactors of all genres a trillion times, so I'm pretty familiarized with the experience, I've fired more than a half dozen guns, including a 45 automatic, 30/30, so I never thought guns were a big deal. It's just with my state, that I will get looked at and possibly treated as if I was the VT shooter applying for a Barrett 50 cal. All I want to do is make noise and look like a real pirate, then lock it away.

[Littleneckhalfshell]

"Believe it or not, I have to technically register this as a handgun,andobtain a pistol license in NJ,as I'm sure that gun laws in your state are probably more friendly to flintlocks. Not in police-state NJ, the laws put blackpower guns in the same category as with Glocks and H&K assault rifles. Go figure."

I was just wondering, Just for the fun of it, considering the large caliber of most flintlock pistols of the period, and the restrictive gun laws, as well as the dangers involved in 'live fire' events, would it be feasiable to make a "paint ball muzzel loader pistol" ? Even here in NJ you can go into any WallyMart and buy a paint ball gun.

The gun pictured at the beginning of the thread is nice, would love to have one, but not sure I would want to carry it at events, nor sure you could get around bringing it out of state without excessive worry about what varied gun laws you were trespassing upon.

I know that there are 'non firing' replica period pistols, but..... seems a lot like carrying a wooden knife or cutlass. I know Paint ball is not period, but if there were such a thing as a muzzel loader paint ball gun, it could open a whole new area of 'role play' play.

[callenish gunner]

a paintball muzzleloader is like kissing your 80 year old maiden aunt and slipping her tongue...it's just WRONG!!!

if you carry at events and never load it or never drill the venthole it is a replca piece

[William Brand]

Here I was reading along and content to read about muzzle loading weapons and then Hugh puts that image in my head.

[callenish gunner]

[Captain Jim]

Then, if I ever make PIP, (which d I saw you  last year there...if that was you bespectacled)...

Matusalem, you're welcome. And that just may have been me, as I usually wear specs. This is me (and me lovely wife, Patti) from the year before, standing in the Hog's Breath.

Yep, in a bar with gun, cutlass, belt knife and boarding axe. And the police are everywhere. I love Key West.

And if you don't have the vent drilled it is not a gun under Federal law or, I suspect, Jersey law. So you could...Oh, never mind, just move out of Jersey.

So, are you planning to antique or go "period used?"

Oh, and Hugh? EEWWWWW!!!!

[Ol Man From the Sea]

a paintball muzzleloader is...

Hugh, did ya have ta go so hard on the poor guy? Isn't his being from Jersey bad enough for him? Now I have to close my eyes and turn my head if I see a paintball. YUCK!

Littleneckhalfshell, Talk to both your State and Local Police, do as they say. Even if you are right and they are wrong, you will still pay.

I was a gun dealer in Illinois about 10 years ago. Had the "joy" of being told by the State Police that I shall list all black powder arms in my log books, then being told by the ATF that I shall not list any black powder arms in my log books. What a mess!

[callenish gunner]

there are times when you just have to stop ideas that have just gone wrong ...it's often not a pretty job but it has to be done

[Matusalem]

Captain Jim wrote:

Matusalem, you're welcome. And that just may have been me, as I usually wear specs. This is me (and me lovely wife, Patti) from the year before, standing in the Hog's Breath.

Indeed! I was at Ft Zach, and you were the funniest and wittiest man there....a true inspiration. The picture of you and your beautiful wife says it all! I was only there for a day. I can't wait to go back. I have a very busy work & life schedule and have to choose where to spend the money I got, but I'm working on PIP no doubt. I'm writing to you from SW Florida as I write this.

As for Mr Hugh, the Callenish Gunner, I couldn't help but spit my coffee laughing this morning (very good, y'old salt!), but feel some sympathy for us NJ residents who live in the most over-regulated, over-taxed, over-polluted state in the bloody God-damned union! There's enough chemicals in our breathing air to keep us on a buzz for a year.