Swashbuckler 1700 Posted February 11, 2012 Posted February 11, 2012 Has anybody found any reference to hand hooks? I have always assumed that these were myth (unlike wooden legs and missing eyes and other injuries which were at least reality among pirates). I have read that some 17th century english Privateer had indeed hand hook but is it just a myth? "I have not yet Begun To Fight!"John Paul Jones
peglegstrick Posted February 12, 2012 Posted February 12, 2012 Christopher Newport is a proper historical example of a sea captain who lost an arm and replaced it with a hook. He was apparently the real life model (or one of them) for Barrie's Captain Hook. Newport was technically a privateer, not a pirate, but I think the difference is really just that a privateer was a pirate who sometimes paid his taxes.
MarkG Posted February 12, 2012 Posted February 12, 2012 I can't find any references to Newport using a hook. He did have the nickname "Captain One-Hand". Hooks have been used as artificial hands through the present. Barrow's captain was not the first to wear a hook but I don't know how common they were in the GAoP. My impression was that most pirates and sailors who lost a limb retired. According to "Under the Black Flag", they were often employed as a ship's cook. That is why Long John Silver was a cook.
Swashbuckler 1700 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Posted February 12, 2012 I can't find any references to Newport using a hook. He did have the nickname "Captain One-Hand". Hooks have been used as artificial hands through the present. Barrow's captain was not the first to wear a hook but I don't know how common they were in the GAoP. My impression was that most pirates and sailors who lost a limb retired. According to "Under the Black Flag", they were often employed as a ship's cook. That is why Long John Silver was a cook. Well in some History magasine Newport's hook is mentioned..... Oh and here is ship cook in 1799 But this topic is about hooks.... "I have not yet Begun To Fight!"John Paul Jones
Mission Posted February 12, 2012 Posted February 12, 2012 I have never come across any evidence of a genuine pirate (not a privateer, which is decidedly different) having a prosthetic. This is not to say that none of them had them, in fact the opposite is likely true because amputation was a pretty common operation for men who engaged in battles on land and sea. (And I can probably find a dozen references to regular people having had the operation including noblemen, maids, and so forth.) However, you have to admit that a prosthetic could limit the abilities of seamen to perform some of the duties of a pirate or a regular seaman. This is why they would have been made cooks. (I believe I read that this was a BRN custom.) Note that hooks and peg-legs were not the only types of prostheses that existed at this time. Ambroise Paré has some pretty exotic renderings of prostheses in his book that was published nearly 200 years before the Golden Age of Piracy. (This last one is mostly theoretical - no working model of a spring-operated hand was successfully made that I am aware of up to the GAoP - as we'll see in a minute.) Of course, hooks and peg legs would have been the most practical prostheses to be made at sea. As you'll find below, a foot would probably be assembled for a leg prosthesis. So even if a sailor was given a footless leg prosthetic, he would most likely have eventually had a foot made for it if the author is correct. From the surgical manuals I have read to date, Pierre Dionis has the most to say on the topic in his book Cours de chirurgie which was published in French in 1707 and translated into English in 1733. (It is a fantastic reference.) “We draw two Advantages from this Addition [the prosthesis], the first is ornamental, as when we fix in an artificial Eye or Tooth; the second, is for Necessity, as when we add a wooden Arm or Leg; and ‘tis particularly this last Species of Prosthesis which is necessary, since without its help the Man can’t act. Every one knows how a wooden Leg ought to be made in order to go with it; the last Wars have reduc’d several Persons to a necessity of wearing it: I shall only hint to you, that its upper part is to be hollow, to comprehend the lower part of the Thigh; that it must have Ribbons or Tapes to tie and fasten it to the Thigh; that it must be provided with a small Cushion at the Place where the Knee lies, that the Part may not be hurt by the Hardness of the Wood, which is not to be brittle, but firm and strong for the Security of the Wearer. When we would adjust its Shape, we are to cause one to be cut by the Carver, of the same Figure with the other, observing the Dimensions exactly; on this we put a Shoe and Stocking as on the other, and if it reaches up the Thigh, the Knee being __ cut, we may make it bend when we sit, by taking away one Ring or Ferrel, and putting it in again, when we would go. An Officer of the Army was so habituated to his wooden Leg, that he mounted on Horseback, and exposed himself to all the utmost Dangers which offer’d: He received a Musquet-shot in it, which broke it, and cried out to the Enemy that he was horribly disappointed, for he had another in his Portmanteu." (Dionis, p. 416-7) He also talks about the fancy spring-loaded version a friar was working on that sounded like the one Pare had sketched which I why I say the second version probably never existed. The French would have had much to boast about if it did. "About a year since the Reverend Father Sebastian, a Carmelite-Friar, and one of the Honorary Academicians of the Academy of Sciences, presented an artificial Arm made of Tin, and fill’d with several Springs, by means of which he promised, that being fasten’d to the Stump, the Patient might lead a Horse, Write, and perform the same Functions as with the natural Hand: He assures us that the sole Motion of the Stump set the Springs at work, and would make the Patient move the Fist and Fingers as he pleased. This Machine was not perfected when ‘twas presented to the Academy: If it answers his Promises, the maim’d Persons cannot pay him a sufficient Tribute of Praises.” (Dionis, p. 417) Mycroft: "My brother has the brain of a scientist or a philosopher, yet he elects to be a detective. What might we deduce about his heart?" John: "I don't know." Mycroft: "Neither do I. But initially he wanted to be a pirate."
Swashbuckler 1700 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Posted February 12, 2012 I have never come across any evidence of a genuine pirate (not a privateer, which is decidedly different) having a prosthetic. This is not to say that none of them had them, in fact the opposite is likely true because amputation was a pretty common operation for men who engaged in battles on land and sea. (And I can probably find a dozen references to regular people having had the operation including noblemen, maids, and so forth.) However, you have to admit that a prosthetic could limit the abilities of seamen to perform some of the duties of a pirate or a regular seaman. This is why they would have been made cooks. (I believe I read that this was a BRN custom.) Note that hooks and peg-legs were not the only types of prostheses that existed at this time. Ambroise Paré has some pretty exotic renderings of prostheses in his book that was published nearly 200 years before the Golden Age of Piracy. (This last one is mostly theoretical - no working model of a spring-operated hand was successfully made that I am aware of up to the GAoP - as we'll see in a minute.) Of course, hooks and peg legs would have been the most practical prostheses to be made at sea. As you'll find below, a foot would probably be assembled for a leg prosthesis. So even if a sailor was given a footless leg prosthetic, he would most likely have eventually had a foot made for it if the author is correct. From the surgical manuals I have read to date, Pierre Dionis has the most to say on the topic in his book Cours de chirurgie which was published in French in 1707 and translated into English in 1733. (It is a fantastic reference.) “We draw two Advantages from this Addition [the prosthesis], the first is ornamental, as when we fix in an artificial Eye or Tooth; the second, is for Necessity, as when we add a wooden Arm or Leg; and ‘tis particularly this last Species of Prosthesis which is necessary, since without its help the Man can’t act. Every one knows how a wooden Leg ought to be made in order to go with it; the last Wars have reduc’d several Persons to a necessity of wearing it: I shall only hint to you, that its upper part is to be hollow, to comprehend the lower part of the Thigh; that it must have Ribbons or Tapes to tie and fasten it to the Thigh; that it must be provided with a small Cushion at the Place where the Knee lies, that the Part may not be hurt by the Hardness of the Wood, which is not to be brittle, but firm and strong for the Security of the Wearer. When we would adjust its Shape, we are to cause one to be cut by the Carver, of the same Figure with the other, observing the Dimensions exactly; on this we put a Shoe and Stocking as on the other, and if it reaches up the Thigh, the Knee being __ cut, we may make it bend when we sit, by taking away one Ring or Ferrel, and putting it in again, when we would go. An Officer of the Army was so habituated to his wooden Leg, that he mounted on Horseback, and exposed himself to all the utmost Dangers which offer’d: He received a Musquet-shot in it, which broke it, and cried out to the Enemy that he was horribly disappointed, for he had another in his Portmanteu." (Dionis, p. 416-7) He also talks about the fancy spring-loaded version a friar was working on that sounded like the one Pare had sketched which I why I say the second version probably never existed. The French would have had much to boast about if it did. "About a year since the Reverend Father Sebastian, a Carmelite-Friar, and one of the Honorary Academicians of the Academy of Sciences, presented an artificial Arm made of Tin, and fill’d with several Springs, by means of which he promised, that being fasten’d to the Stump, the Patient might lead a Horse, Write, and perform the same Functions as with the natural Hand: He assures us that the sole Motion of the Stump set the Springs at work, and would make the Patient move the Fist and Fingers as he pleased. This Machine was not perfected when ‘twas presented to the Academy: If it answers his Promises, the maim’d Persons cannot pay him a sufficient Tribute of Praises.” (Dionis, p. 417) Here is Wooden legged pirate from C Johnson's book: ".... a Fellow with a terrible pair of Whiskers, and a wooden Leg, being stuck round with Pistols, like the Man in the Almanack with Darts, comes swearing and vapouring upon the Quarter-Deck..." is this real story maybe it is maybe it is not but if there were not those wooden legs Johnson would not be familiar with those.... "I have not yet Begun To Fight!"John Paul Jones
Swashbuckler 1700 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Posted February 12, 2012 I have never come across any evidence of a genuine pirate (not a privateer, which is decidedly different) having a prosthetic. This is not to say that none of them had them, in fact the opposite is likely true because amputation was a pretty common operation for men who engaged in battles on land and sea. (And I can probably find a dozen references to regular people having had the operation including noblemen, maids, and so forth.) However, you have to admit that a prosthetic could limit the abilities of seamen to perform some of the duties of a pirate or a regular seaman. This is why they would have been made cooks. (I believe I read that this was a BRN custom.) Note that hooks and peg-legs were not the only types of prostheses that existed at this time. Ambroise Paré has some pretty exotic renderings of prostheses in his book that was published nearly 200 years before the Golden Age of Piracy. (This last one is mostly theoretical - no working model of a spring-operated hand was successfully made that I am aware of up to the GAoP - as we'll see in a minute.) Of course, hooks and peg legs would have been the most practical prostheses to be made at sea. As you'll find below, a foot would probably be assembled for a leg prosthesis. So even if a sailor was given a footless leg prosthetic, he would most likely have eventually had a foot made for it if the author is correct. From the surgical manuals I have read to date, Pierre Dionis has the most to say on the topic in his book Cours de chirurgie which was published in French in 1707 and translated into English in 1733. (It is a fantastic reference.) “We draw two Advantages from this Addition [the prosthesis], the first is ornamental, as when we fix in an artificial Eye or Tooth; the second, is for Necessity, as when we add a wooden Arm or Leg; and ‘tis particularly this last Species of Prosthesis which is necessary, since without its help the Man can’t act. Every one knows how a wooden Leg ought to be made in order to go with it; the last Wars have reduc’d several Persons to a necessity of wearing it: I shall only hint to you, that its upper part is to be hollow, to comprehend the lower part of the Thigh; that it must have Ribbons or Tapes to tie and fasten it to the Thigh; that it must be provided with a small Cushion at the Place where the Knee lies, that the Part may not be hurt by the Hardness of the Wood, which is not to be brittle, but firm and strong for the Security of the Wearer. When we would adjust its Shape, we are to cause one to be cut by the Carver, of the same Figure with the other, observing the Dimensions exactly; on this we put a Shoe and Stocking as on the other, and if it reaches up the Thigh, the Knee being __ cut, we may make it bend when we sit, by taking away one Ring or Ferrel, and putting it in again, when we would go. An Officer of the Army was so habituated to his wooden Leg, that he mounted on Horseback, and exposed himself to all the utmost Dangers which offer’d: He received a Musquet-shot in it, which broke it, and cried out to the Enemy that he was horribly disappointed, for he had another in his Portmanteu." (Dionis, p. 416-7) He also talks about the fancy spring-loaded version a friar was working on that sounded like the one Pare had sketched which I why I say the second version probably never existed. The French would have had much to boast about if it did. "About a year since the Reverend Father Sebastian, a Carmelite-Friar, and one of the Honorary Academicians of the Academy of Sciences, presented an artificial Arm made of Tin, and fill’d with several Springs, by means of which he promised, that being fasten’d to the Stump, the Patient might lead a Horse, Write, and perform the same Functions as with the natural Hand: He assures us that the sole Motion of the Stump set the Springs at work, and would make the Patient move the Fist and Fingers as he pleased. This Machine was not perfected when ‘twas presented to the Academy: If it answers his Promises, the maim’d Persons cannot pay him a sufficient Tribute of Praises.” (Dionis, p. 417) Oh and this François or Francis Le Clerc, known as Jambe de Bois ('Peg Leg'), was a 16th century French privateer..... "I have not yet Begun To Fight!"John Paul Jones
Swashbuckler 1700 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Posted February 12, 2012 O and here is Foxe'x article: http://www.piratesinfo.com/cpi_pirate_myths_pirate_legends_944.asp "I have not yet Begun To Fight!"John Paul Jones
Swashbuckler 1700 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Posted February 12, 2012 I have never come across any evidence of a genuine pirate (not a privateer, which is decidedly different) having a prosthetic. This is not to say that none of them had them, in fact the opposite is likely true because amputation was a pretty common operation for men who engaged in battles on land and sea. (And I can probably find a dozen references to regular people having had the operation including noblemen, maids, and so forth.) However, you have to admit that a prosthetic could limit the abilities of seamen to perform some of the duties of a pirate or a regular seaman. This is why they would have been made cooks. (I believe I read that this was a BRN custom.) Note that hooks and peg-legs were not the only types of prostheses that existed at this time. Ambroise Paré has some pretty exotic renderings of prostheses in his book that was published nearly 200 years before the Golden Age of Piracy. (This last one is mostly theoretical - no working model of a spring-operated hand was successfully made that I am aware of up to the GAoP - as we'll see in a minute.) Of course, hooks and peg legs would have been the most practical prostheses to be made at sea. As you'll find below, a foot would probably be assembled for a leg prosthesis. So even if a sailor was given a footless leg prosthetic, he would most likely have eventually had a foot made for it if the author is correct. From the surgical manuals I have read to date, Pierre Dionis has the most to say on the topic in his book Cours de chirurgie which was published in French in 1707 and translated into English in 1733. (It is a fantastic reference.) “We draw two Advantages from this Addition [the prosthesis], the first is ornamental, as when we fix in an artificial Eye or Tooth; the second, is for Necessity, as when we add a wooden Arm or Leg; and ‘tis particularly this last Species of Prosthesis which is necessary, since without its help the Man can’t act. Every one knows how a wooden Leg ought to be made in order to go with it; the last Wars have reduc’d several Persons to a necessity of wearing it: I shall only hint to you, that its upper part is to be hollow, to comprehend the lower part of the Thigh; that it must have Ribbons or Tapes to tie and fasten it to the Thigh; that it must be provided with a small Cushion at the Place where the Knee lies, that the Part may not be hurt by the Hardness of the Wood, which is not to be brittle, but firm and strong for the Security of the Wearer. When we would adjust its Shape, we are to cause one to be cut by the Carver, of the same Figure with the other, observing the Dimensions exactly; on this we put a Shoe and Stocking as on the other, and if it reaches up the Thigh, the Knee being __ cut, we may make it bend when we sit, by taking away one Ring or Ferrel, and putting it in again, when we would go. An Officer of the Army was so habituated to his wooden Leg, that he mounted on Horseback, and exposed himself to all the utmost Dangers which offer’d: He received a Musquet-shot in it, which broke it, and cried out to the Enemy that he was horribly disappointed, for he had another in his Portmanteu." (Dionis, p. 416-7) He also talks about the fancy spring-loaded version a friar was working on that sounded like the one Pare had sketched which I why I say the second version probably never existed. The French would have had much to boast about if it did. "About a year since the Reverend Father Sebastian, a Carmelite-Friar, and one of the Honorary Academicians of the Academy of Sciences, presented an artificial Arm made of Tin, and fill’d with several Springs, by means of which he promised, that being fasten’d to the Stump, the Patient might lead a Horse, Write, and perform the same Functions as with the natural Hand: He assures us that the sole Motion of the Stump set the Springs at work, and would make the Patient move the Fist and Fingers as he pleased. This Machine was not perfected when ‘twas presented to the Academy: If it answers his Promises, the maim’d Persons cannot pay him a sufficient Tribute of Praises.” (Dionis, p. 417) Oh i believe that those pictures are pics of some more sophisticated and more expensive protestic that would not be in major use.... "I have not yet Begun To Fight!"John Paul Jones
Swashbuckler 1700 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Posted February 12, 2012 But this was topic about hand hooks "I have not yet Begun To Fight!"John Paul Jones
Mission Posted February 12, 2012 Posted February 12, 2012 Here is Wooden legged pirate from C Johnson's book: ".... a Fellow with a terrible pair of Whiskers, and a wooden Leg, being stuck round with Pistols, like the Man in the Almanack with Darts, comes swearing and vapouring upon the Quarter-Deck..." is this real story maybe it is maybe it is not but if there were not those wooden legs Johnson would not be familiar with those.... Good find! One I clearly missed. Which story is that from? (I may be wrong, but doubt Foxe will find evidence for or against such a mundane detail.) I still maintain privateers are a different species. If they are operating properly, they have a legal letter and only take ships of the nations their letter of the marque details. As for hand hooks, I had never seen evidence of them before you guys mentioned Christopher Newport, of whom I don't recall hearing of before now. (But then I am focusing on books published near or during the GAoP as my references and Newport pre-dates period by about 80 years or so.) Most of the surgical manuals don't mention prostheses except Pare (who seems to have been fascinated by them) and Dionis. I guess it's a French thing... Mycroft: "My brother has the brain of a scientist or a philosopher, yet he elects to be a detective. What might we deduce about his heart?" John: "I don't know." Mycroft: "Neither do I. But initially he wanted to be a pirate."
Swashbuckler 1700 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Posted February 12, 2012 (edited) Here is Wooden legged pirate from C Johnson's book: ".... a Fellow with a terrible pair of Whiskers, and a wooden Leg, being stuck round with Pistols, like the Man in the Almanack with Darts, comes swearing and vapouring upon the Quarter-Deck..." is this real story maybe it is maybe it is not but if there were not those wooden legs Johnson would not be familiar with those.... Good find! One I clearly missed. Which story is that from? (I may be wrong, but doubt Foxe will find evidence for or against such a mundane detail.) I still maintain privateers are a different species. If they are operating properly, they have a legal letter and only take ships of the nations their letter of the marque details. As for hand hooks, I had never seen evidence of them before you guys mentioned Christopher Newport, of whom I had never heard before. Most of the surgical manuals don't mention prostheses except Pare (who seems to have been fascinated by them) and Dionis. I guess it's a French thing... Well It is in Edward England's story and this mention is also added in Foxe's article so I thik he thiks that it is good source.... And well between privateer and pirate there is only difference that privateers give some loot to goverment and don't use Pirate Flag... Edited February 12, 2012 by Swashbuckler 1700 "I have not yet Begun To Fight!"John Paul Jones
Swashbuckler 1700 Posted February 12, 2012 Author Posted February 12, 2012 (edited) So both pirates and privateers had wooden legs but to me hooks are mystery... And this topic is about hooks Edited February 12, 2012 by Swashbuckler 1700 "I have not yet Begun To Fight!"John Paul Jones
Swashbuckler 1700 Posted February 13, 2012 Author Posted February 13, 2012 (edited) I think that ths topic needs some magic touch off mr.Foxe.....maybe he would know about pirate hooks and peglegs and this is topic about hooks Edited February 13, 2012 by Swashbuckler 1700 "I have not yet Begun To Fight!"John Paul Jones
Fox Posted February 14, 2012 Posted February 14, 2012 Normally I don't respond to a summons unless it is accompanied by naked dancing round a fire and the sacrifice of a black cockerell or a goat, but... I haven't so far added to this thread because I have nothing to add. I've never come across a reference to a pirate with a hook, but there are a lot of pirates whose hands don't get mentioned either. Or did you want me to comment on the question of pirates/privateers? But this thread is about hooks... Foxe"With this Fore-Staff he fansies he does Wonders, when, God knows, it amounts to no more but only to solve that simple Question, Where are we? Which every chi'd in London can tell you." - Ned Ward The Wooden World Dissected, 1707ETFox.co.uk
Swashbuckler 1700 Posted February 14, 2012 Author Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) Normally I don't respond to a summons unless it is accompanied by naked dancing round a fire and the sacrifice of a black cockerell or a goat, but... I haven't so far added to this thread because I have nothing to add. I've never come across a reference to a pirate with a hook, but there are a lot of pirates whose hands don't get mentioned either. Or did you want me to comment on the question of pirates/privateers? But this thread is about hooks... Sorry that I forgot the relevant rituals... I was able to find some thing related hooks of 17th or 18th protestic Odd coincidence happened when I was reading some illustrated history book...there was mid 18th century W. Hogart's illustration and it had guy with both Hook and wooden leg He was dressed in wig and coat so he was probaply officer or perhaps some navy person.... here it is (with not so good quality) http://www.history.o...ges/polling.jpg Here with colors http://upload.wikime...Hogarth_031.jpg Note man's (in the left in pic 1 and pic 2 is mirror image and he is on the right ) hand on the book... Edited February 14, 2012 by Swashbuckler 1700 "I have not yet Begun To Fight!"John Paul Jones
Mission Posted February 14, 2012 Posted February 14, 2012 One thing to be wary of with Hogarth is that he was a satirist and often exaggerated things. (Either I'm not seeing it right, or that guy is completely missing his right hand!) In addition, that man could have been either a seaman or a soldier. (If I have the uniform wrong, someone feel free to correct me. I don't claim to know the clothing styles.) Although, Swashbuckler, this is about hooks and pirates and that man doesn't strike me as being a pirate! Having said that... I would love to hear Foxe's take on Privateers vis-a-vis this discussion. As he will no doubt tell you from our decade-long acquaintance, I am strongly opposed to staying on topic in a forum, even when that is part of my job description. :) (Forums are like conversations, not lectures.) Mycroft: "My brother has the brain of a scientist or a philosopher, yet he elects to be a detective. What might we deduce about his heart?" John: "I don't know." Mycroft: "Neither do I. But initially he wanted to be a pirate."
Fox Posted February 14, 2012 Posted February 14, 2012 Unless someone knows better, that's a Chelsea Pensioner uniform, so the guy is a soldier whose wounds entitled him to a place in the state hospital. Later pictures of Greenwich pensioners (the naval equivalent of a Chelsea Pensioner) tend to show them with wooden legs and hooks too. It's a kind of 18th century artists' convention on how to portray wounded servicemen. I will respond on privateers and pirates when I've given it some more thought... Foxe"With this Fore-Staff he fansies he does Wonders, when, God knows, it amounts to no more but only to solve that simple Question, Where are we? Which every chi'd in London can tell you." - Ned Ward The Wooden World Dissected, 1707ETFox.co.uk
Swashbuckler 1700 Posted February 14, 2012 Author Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) Unless someone knows better, that's a Chelsea Pensioner uniform, so the guy is a soldier whose wounds entitled him to a place in the state hospital. Later pictures of Greenwich pensioners (the naval equivalent of a Chelsea Pensioner) tend to show them with wooden legs and hooks too. It's a kind of 18th century artists' convention on how to portray wounded servicemen. I will respond on privateers and pirates when I've given it some more thought... So If wounted soldier would used those (practically in same time period) why not wounted sailor or pirate alike but certainly they were rare... and Foxe has your stance toward wooden legs changed after you wrote this: http://www.piratesin...legends_944.asp ? Edited February 14, 2012 by Swashbuckler 1700 "I have not yet Begun To Fight!"John Paul Jones
Mission Posted February 14, 2012 Posted February 14, 2012 Unless someone knows better, that's a Chelsea Pensioner uniform, so the guy is a soldier whose wounds entitled him to a place in the state hospital. Later pictures of Greenwich pensioners (the naval equivalent of a Chelsea Pensioner) tend to show them with wooden legs and hooks too. It's a kind of 18th century artists' convention on how to portray wounded servicemen. I will respond on privateers and pirates when I've given it some more thought... So If wounted soldier would used those (practically in same time period) why not wounted sailor or pirate alike but certainly they were rare... and Foxe has your stance toward wooden legs changed after you wrote this: http://www.piratesin...legends_944.asp ? I doubt he's changed his views since he's basically saying the same thing I already told you. (Nor do I see how his quote you cited disagrees with any of his comments in that article from 2009.) While I had never read Ed's comment at Piracy.com (I left that site in 2004), I found the same material via my own research, so I'd say it stands on its own. Point being, a prosthetic was far more common at this time period than people seem to think, particularly for anyone involved in battles. This is not to say that none of them had them, in fact the opposite is likely true because amputation was a pretty common operation for men who engaged in battles on land and sea. (And I can probably find a dozen references to regular people having had the operation including noblemen, maids, and so forth.) Mycroft: "My brother has the brain of a scientist or a philosopher, yet he elects to be a detective. What might we deduce about his heart?" John: "I don't know." Mycroft: "Neither do I. But initially he wanted to be a pirate."
Swashbuckler 1700 Posted February 26, 2012 Author Posted February 26, 2012 (edited) Unless someone knows better, that's a Chelsea Pensioner uniform, so the guy is a soldier whose wounds entitled him to a place in the state hospital. Later pictures of Greenwich pensioners (the naval equivalent of a Chelsea Pensioner) tend to show them with wooden legs and hooks too. It's a kind of 18th century artists' convention on how to portray wounded servicemen. I will respond on privateers and pirates when I've given it some more thought... So If wounted soldier would used those (practically in same time period) why not wounted sailor or pirate alike but certainly they were rare... and Foxe has your stance toward wooden legs changed after you wrote this: http://www.piratesin...legends_944.asp ? I doubt he's changed his views since he's basically saying the same thing I already told you. (Nor do I see how his quote you cited disagrees with any of his comments in that article from 2009.) While I had never read Ed's comment at Piracy.com (I left that site in 2004), I found the same material via my own research, so I'd say it stands on its own. Point being, a prosthetic was far more common at this time period than people seem to think, particularly for anyone involved in battles. This is not to say that none of them had them, in fact the opposite is likely true because amputation was a pretty common operation for men who engaged in battles on land and sea. (And I can probably find a dozen references to regular people having had the operation including noblemen, maids, and so forth.) Speaking period naval persons with missing limbs I have long time ago came across Blas de Lezo (to let you know or if you did know this to refresh your menory read the wiki) http://en.wikipedia....ki/Blas_de_Lezo Edited February 26, 2012 by Swashbuckler 1700 "I have not yet Begun To Fight!"John Paul Jones
peglegstrick Posted February 27, 2012 Posted February 27, 2012 François le Clerc From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia François or Francis Le Clerc, known as Jambe de Bois ('Peg Leg'), (died 1563) was a 16th century French privateer , originally from Normandy. He is credited as the first pirate in the modern era to have a "peg leg". He was often the first to board an enemy vessel during an attack or raid. It was this brazen style that eventually caused him to suffer the loss of a leg and severe damage to one arm while fighting the English at Guernsey in 1549. Although many pirates would have had their careers ended by such an injury, le Clerc refused to retire and instead expanded the scope of his piracy by financing the voyages and attacks of other pirates as well. Despite his wounds, Le Clerc led major raids against the Spanish, who nicknamed him "Pie de Palo" ("Peg Leg"). In 1553, he assumed overall command of seven pirate craft and three royal vessels, the latter commanded by himself, Jacques Sores and Robert Blundel. This same year he attacked the port of Santa Cruz de La Palma, in the Canary Islands, which he looted and set on fire, destroying a large number of buildings. This strong fleet raided San Germán in Puerto Rico and methodically looted the ports of Hispaniola (Cuba) from south to north, stealing hides and cannon as they travelled. They sacked Santiago de Cuba in 1554,[1] occupied it for a month, and left with 80,000 pesos in treasure. So completely devastated was Cuba's first capital that it was soon completely eclipsed by Havana and never recovered its former prosperity. Richer booty was taken on the return voyage as the corsairs plundered Las Palmas on Grand Canary Island and captured a Genoese carrack. He and his crew of 330 men were the first Europeans to settle the island of Saint Lucia, and used the nearby Pigeon Island to target Spanish treasure galleons.[2] In 1560, while awaiting a Spanish treasure fleet carrying a cargo of bullion, he caused a great deal of damage to settlements along the coast of Panama. In April 1562, Protestants in several Norman cities rebelled against their Roman Catholic king. Queen Elizabeth I of England dispatched British troops to occupy Le Havre until June 1563. Le Clerc joined the English invaders and ravaged French shipping. In March 1563, he asked for a large pension as a reward for his actions. Wounded in his pride when Elizabeth turned down his request, he sailed for the Azores Islands. He was killed there in 1563, while hunting down Spanish treasure ships.
Swashbuckler 1700 Posted February 27, 2012 Author Posted February 27, 2012 François le Clerc From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia François or Francis Le Clerc, known as Jambe de Bois ('Peg Leg'), (died 1563) was a 16th century French privateer , originally from Normandy. He is credited as the first pirate in the modern era to have a "peg leg". He was often the first to board an enemy vessel during an attack or raid. It was this brazen style that eventually caused him to suffer the loss of a leg and severe damage to one arm while fighting the English at Guernsey in 1549. Although many pirates would have had their careers ended by such an injury, le Clerc refused to retire and instead expanded the scope of his piracy by financing the voyages and attacks of other pirates as well. Despite his wounds, Le Clerc led major raids against the Spanish, who nicknamed him "Pie de Palo" ("Peg Leg"). In 1553, he assumed overall command of seven pirate craft and three royal vessels, the latter commanded by himself, Jacques Sores and Robert Blundel. This same year he attacked the port of Santa Cruz de La Palma, in the Canary Islands, which he looted and set on fire, destroying a large number of buildings. This strong fleet raided San Germán in Puerto Rico and methodically looted the ports of Hispaniola (Cuba) from south to north, stealing hides and cannon as they travelled. They sacked Santiago de Cuba in 1554,[1] occupied it for a month, and left with 80,000 pesos in treasure. So completely devastated was Cuba's first capital that it was soon completely eclipsed by Havana and never recovered its former prosperity. Richer booty was taken on the return voyage as the corsairs plundered Las Palmas on Grand Canary Island and captured a Genoese carrack. He and his crew of 330 men were the first Europeans to settle the island of Saint Lucia, and used the nearby Pigeon Island to target Spanish treasure galleons.[2] In 1560, while awaiting a Spanish treasure fleet carrying a cargo of bullion, he caused a great deal of damage to settlements along the coast of Panama. In April 1562, Protestants in several Norman cities rebelled against their Roman Catholic king. Queen Elizabeth I of England dispatched British troops to occupy Le Havre until June 1563. Le Clerc joined the English invaders and ravaged French shipping. In March 1563, he asked for a large pension as a reward for his actions. Wounded in his pride when Elizabeth turned down his request, he sailed for the Azores Islands. He was killed there in 1563, while hunting down Spanish treasure ships. Yeah. he has been mentioned here earlier. Interesting privateer... "I have not yet Begun To Fight!"John Paul Jones
Jib Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 For modern pirates of a more fantastic nature I seem to recall a fellow who sold hand hooks that you could strap on your limb to give the appearance of having a hook. These items looked super cool but I have heard of faires and events that don't allow them.
peglegstrick Posted February 28, 2012 Posted February 28, 2012 Used to be a guy who had a website called "the iron hook" that made hooks & wooden peglegs (for cheaters...bent your leg & it went on your knee) ...but it (the site) had been shut down.
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