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Sailor's Knife


Captain Midnight

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I've been thinking of making a sailor's sheath knife based on historical patterns, and was wondering if any of you might know of any extant originals to use as reference? I'm looking for a plain, utilitarian single edged knife that would have been used for chores and whittling and such aboard ship, not a double edged dagger or anything like that. I've Googled it, and have come up with pretty much nothing. I've found plenty roach bellied trade knives and their like, but that's not exactly what I'm looking for. I would like the knife to be appropriate for the 17th or 18th centuries.

Have any knives ever been turned up archaelogically which were specifically seaman's knives? Perhaps from the Whydah wreckage, or the Queen Anne's Revenge, or any other ships? Can anyone help me out? Thanks so much in advance! :ph34r:

"Now then, me bullies! Would you rather do the gallows dance, and hang in chains 'til the crows pluck your eyes from your rotten skulls? Or would you feel the roll of a stout ship beneath your feet again?"

---Captain William Kidd---

(1945)

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Somewhere I've seen reference to a sailor grinding a knife from a broken file and I've thought of doing the same for some time. It's good steel, could be made razor sharp, but would still have the rough hewn look of something purpose made. The sailors knives I've had experience with rigging range from being very blunt ended to being completely squared off like a straight razor. With the exception of stabbing something there is almost nothing that a dagger point is good for on a tool (which is how a sailing knife should be seen) that can't be done better with a marlinespike which would also be a neat do-it-yourself metal or woodworking project. The knives are a little thicker and heavier than a typical pocketknife and in one case was ground as a perfect wedge all the way back to the back. The knives I'm talking about are all 19th and 20th century though so they are just a general guideline. However, having used one quite a bit they are the perfect tool for the job.

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Thanks for that, Morgan. Yes, the blunt or very dull-pointed knives are exactly what I am referring to. Are there any pics anywhere of historical knives such as this? I've also seen them referred to as "rigging knives", "deck knives", etc., and described as being used for such chores and crafts as marlinspike, etc. But I'm trying to tie this style to the historical record before I actually craft one and use it along with my pirate impression. Plus, I'd like to replicate an actual GAoP blade, or at least one that was very close to the time frame... :lol:

"Now then, me bullies! Would you rather do the gallows dance, and hang in chains 'til the crows pluck your eyes from your rotten skulls? Or would you feel the roll of a stout ship beneath your feet again?"

---Captain William Kidd---

(1945)

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I wish I could be more sure of the time frame. I'm positive it was a well established style in the 19th century. I've seen several photo's of ones of that era. The grind a file down also came from the 19th century. Anything older though and I'm afraid you'll run in to the same dilemma that I did when trying to research serving mallets which is that for something as banal as that there just doesn't seem to be much info. I'll post this question over on Brion Toss's website. He's the closest thing to a celebrity as you're likely to find in the rigging industry and he has done alot of "traditional" work and he or someone there might know. I also have some local sources here in south texas who might know. I'll post again in the near future.

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Ok, thanks for your help, Morgan. I look forward to hearing what you are able to turn up. So far, I havn't been too lucky. I'd be interested in seeing photos of the 19th century knives as well, if you were able to post them. I'm sure they didn't make very drastic changes over the years... B)

"Now then, me bullies! Would you rather do the gallows dance, and hang in chains 'til the crows pluck your eyes from your rotten skulls? Or would you feel the roll of a stout ship beneath your feet again?"

---Captain William Kidd---

(1945)

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If you want some info and a picture of a sheath knife, William Gilkerson's book "Boarders Away" has a good section on knives, including sheath knives. My article I recently wrote in the Age of Sail and Piracy '101' project also includes a section on knives.

Privateer,

Do any of the pictures show a "sheeps foot" blade (down-sloping point) like modern rigging knives?

"Now then, me bullies! Would you rather do the gallows dance, and hang in chains 'til the crows pluck your eyes from your rotten skulls? Or would you feel the roll of a stout ship beneath your feet again?"

---Captain William Kidd---

(1945)

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  • 3 years later...
  • 3 weeks later...

http://www.knivesandtools.com/en/pt/-adola-sailors-knife.htm

I've found this knife, reputed to be relatively unchanged for centuries...

Looks like a common sailors sheath knife to me, alright...

Edit:

Same knife, more or less...

http://www.worldknives.com/products/linder-nautical-sailors-tool-knife-nr-167113-145.html

http://www.asmc.de/en/Knives-Tools/Daggers/Sailor-knife-p.html

Edited by Dorian Lasseter

Truly,

D. Lasseter

Captain, The Lucy

Propria Virtute Audax --- In Hoc Signo Vinces

LasseterSignatureNew.gif

Ni Feidir An Dubh A Chur Ina Bhan Air

"If I whet my glittering sword, and mine hand take hold on judgment; I will render vengeance to mine enemies, and will reward them that hate me." Deuteronomy 32:41

Envy and its evil twin - It crept in bed with slander - Idiots they gave advice - But Sloth it gave no answer - Anger kills the human soul - With butter tales of Lust - While Pavlov's Dogs keep chewin' - On the legs they never trust... The Seven Deadly Sins

http://www.colonialnavy.org

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med_gallery_11273_292_1552536.jpg now for a sheath

A bic lighter with a picture of a drinking glass on it, a rainbow pencil with the caption 'FOR THE BIBLE TELLS ME SO", and a broken blade fashioned into a sailor's knife. That picture speaks volumes and I want that knife.

 

image.jpeg.6e5f24495b9d06c08a6a4e051c2bcc99.jpeg

 

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No no you can't have it William I want it.and one of those others as well :)

Some days even my lucky rocketship underpants won't help....

Her reputation was her livelihood.

I'm a pirate, love. By nature and by choice!

My inner voice sometimes has an accent!

My wont? A delicious rip in time...

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hmm..

Some days even my lucky rocketship underpants won't help....

Her reputation was her livelihood.

I'm a pirate, love. By nature and by choice!

My inner voice sometimes has an accent!

My wont? A delicious rip in time...

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  • 3 weeks later...

I us a dexter russel "hammer knife" out of the McMaster Carr catalog they are cheap and efective, I haven't even broken one yet, I beat mine thru some heavy line with no ill effect. They are also one one of the few "sheeps foot patterns" that comes in a high carbon steel blades, they do sharpen extremely well!!!!!!! BUT THAT'S JUST MY HUMBLE OPINION.

Untill we meet again may you have fair winds and following seas.

Y.M.H.S.

C-

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I us a dexter russel "hammer knife" out of the McMaster Carr catalog they are cheap and efective, I haven't even broken one yet, I beat mine thru some heavy line with no ill effect. They are also one one of the few "sheeps foot patterns" that comes in a high carbon steel blades, they do sharpen extremely well!!!!!!! BUT THAT'S JUST MY HUMBLE OPINION.

It's not true without pictures!

 

image.jpeg.6e5f24495b9d06c08a6a4e051c2bcc99.jpeg

 

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I us a dexter russel "hammer knife" out of the McMaster Carr catalog they are cheap and efective, I haven't even broken one yet, I beat mine thru some heavy line with no ill effect. They are also one one of the few "sheeps foot patterns" that comes in a high carbon steel blades, they do sharpen extremely well!!!!!!! BUT THAT'S JUST MY HUMBLE OPINION.

It's not true without pictures!

near bottom of page....i think this is the one he's speakin of:

http://www.mcmaster.com/#shop-knives/=7kuxd1

th_SunsetSpyGlass_edited-1.jpg
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My son once had a rigging knife that was very similar to the one Adam has made here. It had the same shaped blade, but it had maple scales pinned with brass pins to its tang. At the pommel end, the tang extended past the scales and was bent into a loop to accept a lanyard. The whole knife had a definite hand forged look to it. Here is a quick sketch of its profile, except for the lanyard loop, which I forgot to sketch. My question is, would this style of knife have been used in the GAoP, or the 1700's at all? Just wondering.

RiggingKnife.jpg

I forgot to add that the knife was not large. It had a blade of about 4-1/4" and its overall length including the handle was 8".

Edited by Captain Midnight

"Now then, me bullies! Would you rather do the gallows dance, and hang in chains 'til the crows pluck your eyes from your rotten skulls? Or would you feel the roll of a stout ship beneath your feet again?"

---Captain William Kidd---

(1945)

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just giving my reasons for shaping the blade the way i did...1. the originial shape of the rasp it came from was closer to this than a leaf shape or drop point...2.it is a old rasp...im SURE its older but the latest i can confirm this off the top of my head is early 1800s.3.i have been a smith for about 5-6 years now...if a sailor came to me i feel this would have been the end result..especially adding what SMALL knowledge i have of seamanship.the only thing i would change is to put a chisel grind on it...i would have w/ this one but wasnt sure of master crosses specific knowledge of said edge.the next one which i am doing for dutch will have a chisel gring on it as it facilitates cutting the line off w/ a straight edge w/ mallet/marlinspike and the knife in the traditional way.just wanted to give my reasons ...any questions just ask...

Here at metal wackers forge.....um....well... we wack metal.

http://www.colonialseaport.org/

http://www.creweofthearchangel.com/

http://www.blackbeardscrew.org/

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just giving my reasons for shaping the blade the way i did...1. the originial shape of the rasp it came from was closer to this than a leaf shape or drop point...2.it is a old rasp...im SURE its older but the latest i can confirm this off the top of my head is early 1800s.3.i have been a smith for about 5-6 years now...if a sailor came to me i feel this would have been the end result..especially adding what SMALL knowledge i have of seamanship.the only thing i would change is to put a chisel grind on it...i would have w/ this one but wasnt sure of master crosses specific knowledge of said edge.the next one which i am doing for dutch will have a chisel gring on it as it facilitates cutting the line off w/ a straight edge w/ mallet/marlinspike and the knife in the traditional way.just wanted to give my reasons ...any questions just ask...

Oh no! I'm not questioning your design at all, Adam! I love that design, and I love this particular shape of blade. I am simply wanting to know if it is ok to use it for the 18th century, because I would like to use a knife like that for myself as well. :P

"Now then, me bullies! Would you rather do the gallows dance, and hang in chains 'til the crows pluck your eyes from your rotten skulls? Or would you feel the roll of a stout ship beneath your feet again?"

---Captain William Kidd---

(1945)

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