Ivan Henry aka Moose

Not the best idea ever thought up...

45 posts in this topic

Can we all agree to please stop pointing guns that can be fired, as well as sharp daggers and swords at people while posing for a picture? Please...

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And I've seen a few hand over their weapons to tourists so they could pose with them too.

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While I see the argument about firearms (not that I neccesarily agree with it as a blanket rule), what is the problem with steel? Seems just a little too PC to me. We actually hit each other with those weapons, and fire the guns at each other during reenactments. What makes posing for a picture different?

Hawkyns

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While I see the argument about firearms (not that I neccesarily agree with it as a blanket rule), what is the problem with steel? Seems just a little too PC to me. We actually hit each other with those weapons, and fire the guns at each other during reenactments. What makes posing for a picture different?

Hawkyns

Agreed. Posing for pictures is not the same thing as going around "pointing weapons at people". It is no different than acting in a movie.

Worrying about what "somebody might think" about it is a bit silly. I seldom do it, but sometimes it makes for an interesting picture.

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I don't believe that gun safety stops when you pose for a picture with folks. I've seen people put sharpened knives and such to peoples throats, stomachs etc. One slip, one bump and, well..... I just don't believe it is a good idea. Cascabel, I am surprised with your weapons background that you support people pointing functioning muskets and pistols at peoples faces, heads, bodies while posing for pictures. Think about this for a second - Pirate Pete has a few beers while hanging around camp, goes to the firing area and unloads a few rounds through his pirate pistols. Afterwards, it's back to camp for a few more beers. The Smith family makes their way through camp and sees Pirate Pete and decides that a group shot with him would be perfect for their Facebook. As Pirate Pete let's out an "aaaarrrrg" and points his pistol at Jimmy Smith's head, he struggles to remember if he left a load in or not.....

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I don't believe that gun safety stops when you pose for a picture with folks. I've seen people put sharpened knives and such to peoples throats, stomachs etc. One slip, one bump and, well..... I just don't believe it is a good idea. Cascabel, I am surprised with your weapons background that you support people pointing functioning muskets and pistols at peoples faces, heads, bodies while posing for pictures. Think about this for a second - Pirate Pete has a few beers while hanging around camp, goes to the firing area and unloads a few rounds through his pirate pistols. Afterwards, it's back to camp for a few more beers. The Smith family makes their way through camp and sees Pirate Pete and decides that a group shot with him would be perfect for their Facebook. As Pirate Pete let's out an "aaaarrrrg" and points his pistol at Jimmy Smith's head, he struggles to remember if he left a load in or not.....

See... the problem lies in that this "Pirate Pete" is drinking and then his crew or others in the camp let him go fire the gun... One of the biggest safety rules that I know the vast majority of us follow is that if you've been drinking... you don't get to shoot.... period.

As a safety officer for my crew, if you are at an event we host and pull such a stunt... I will bodily remove you from the encampment and you will NEVER be allowed at one of our events. More than likely after that... you'll be blacklisted from most events.

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I don't believe that gun safety stops when you pose for a picture with folks. I've seen people put sharpened knives and such to peoples throats, stomachs etc. One slip, one bump and, well..... I just don't believe it is a good idea. Cascabel, I am surprised with your weapons background that you support people pointing functioning muskets and pistols at peoples faces, heads, bodies while posing for pictures. Think about this for a second - Pirate Pete has a few beers while hanging around camp, goes to the firing area and unloads a few rounds through his pirate pistols. Afterwards, it's back to camp for a few more beers. The Smith family makes their way through camp and sees Pirate Pete and decides that a group shot with him would be perfect for their Facebook. As Pirate Pete let's out an "aaaarrrrg" and points his pistol at Jimmy Smith's head, he struggles to remember if he left a load in or not.....

You introduce another factor entirely with Pirate Pete being drunk. I am not a drinker, and have very little tolerance for those that cannot control their actions when drinking. There will always be people that act innapropriately when drinking, so we must police ourselves. There are already rules in place about guns and drinking, (which are routinely violated at some events, by the way).

As I said, I do NOT support randomly pointing weapons at people, and I advocate being aware of your surroundings at ALL times. Drawing a pointy weapon in a crowd is stupid, as you could get bumped while holding it. Again, being aware of your surroundings is important. I guess stupid people will always exist and will bear watching. I think a "one size fits all" rule is not very suitable.

The possibility of having to supervise or be responsible for others and their actions is one of the big reasons that I refuse to be part of a "crew" or group, and will not usually act as a "safety officer"

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As I said, I do NOT support randomly pointing weapons at people, and I advocate being aware of your surroundings at ALL times. Drawing a pointy weapon in a crowd is stupid, as you could get bumped while holding it. Again, being aware of your surroundings is important. I guess stupid people will always exist and will bear watching. I think a "one size fits all" rule is not very suitable.

Agreed. We have gone from a simple pointing weapons scenario to a drunk idiot with weapons scenario. Two very different things.

OK, I'm going to open a very large can of worms. It's been opened before, but somehow always manages to get closed with no resolution.

It is my opinion that we have way too many yahoos in the pirate community that think rules don't apply to piates, that drunken pirate is one word, and that weapons should always be handy and unsheathed. There are many of us who have been fighting with swords, muskets, and cannon for many years. (about 30 in my case) We work as safety officers, battle marshals, weapons inspectors and other jobs neccesary to safe reenactments. it is rare that we don't get hasseled by somebody who thinks that we are being too harsh, to uptight, or too 'safe'.

Therein lies the problem and the difference in our attitude, Ivan. If we take the attitude that everyone should be able to turn out with any weapons they wish, with no guarantee of training or skill, then I'd have to agree that your attitude makes sense. If, however, you take an attitude like my crew and other crews that I work with, that weapons safety comes first, that no alcohol comes out until the camp is closed and the weapons and powder secured (powder under lock and key), and that people are not allowed to draw weapons and play with each other until they have been trained and qualified, then you have a much safer scenario.

Elitist? Damn Right! Weapons are for people who know how to use them, not for anybody with 50 bucks o buy a cheap cutlass to wave around. Real pirates were professionals with their weapons. Read the various articles- weapons safety and maintainance were requirements.

Hawkyns

Master Gunner

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Ivan is referring to pictures of pirates posing with spectators, not pictures of battle reenactments or real (fencing for instance)/staged combat between pre approved reenactors, that have been properly trained and then past by safety officers. Or am I missing something here? As a safety officer, I do cringe when I see a photo of some pirate (can't say I've seen reenactors doing this although i bet some have) with the muzzle of his black powder pistol pressed against the head of some spectator or his kid. Growing up the first rule was never point yer gun at something ye did not intend to harm. Always be aware of where yer weapon is pointing. We don't aim/shoot point blank at people on the battle field, no one should be doing it at some spectators head.

I have to agree with Hawkyns though a properly set up photograph or stunt between trained reenactors is another matter.

Edited by Capt. Sterling

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YEs I am referring to the scenario where people want to be in a picture with some pirates and part of the pose for the picture includes said pirates pointing their real functioning pistol at the people's heads, bodies etc. I have also seen very large and sharp knives and swords pointed at people. I don't believe this is a good idea in any shape or form. If I understand some of the comments correctly, I think I am hearing that if one is a trained re-enactor it's okay to do this? I hope I am misunderstanding this.

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YEs I am referring to the scenario where people want to be in a picture with some pirates and part of the pose for the picture includes said pirates pointing their real functioning pistol at the people's heads, bodies etc. I have also seen very large and sharp knives and swords pointed at people. I don't believe this is a good idea in any shape or form. If I understand some of the comments correctly, I think I am hearing that if one is a trained re-enactor it's okay to do this? I hope I am misunderstanding this.

Ahhhhh....... That does make a difference, as opposed to posing for a shot of hostage taking, action scenes, etc. with other pirates for promotional purposes. Posing with the tourists is another matter entirely. I think there has been some misunderstanding.....

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I just saw a photo recently where the reenactor was pointing his pistol up at a spectator with a large leering grin while anther spectator was holding a second pistol on the same someone from the other side. My first thought was along the lines Ivan Henry has presented.

I have also seen people pointing knives at spectators stomachs and even necks. Yeah, it can make for a neat picture and you get to pose all piratey, but just make one slip-up...

If you think the people who launch cannonballs through their houses using home made guns stirs stuff up, image the kind of press you'd get for eviscerating a tourist while posing for a photo because your leather-soled boots/shoes slipped on the wet grass!

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. If I understand some of the comments correctly, I think I am hearing that if one is a trained re-enactor it's okay to do this? I hope I am misunderstanding this.

I think you are misunderstanding. I generally don't pose for pictures with the public, certainly not with weapons. The public I interact with are generally more interested in the history and the weapons, not getting a 'cute' picture with some guys dressed funny. What I'm talking about is vignettes staged between reenactors for informational, publicity, or educational purposes. My feeling is that If I'm actually going to swing a blade or fire a piece at them in reenactment, a static pose is no big deal in comparison.

Hawkyns

Master Gunner.

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Call me a stick-in-the-mud, but what is sharpened steel doing around spectators (historically-minded or Disney-minded) anyway? Maybe it is the old Boy Scout in me, but if I have a functioning tool unsheathed - knife or axe or sword - it is to perform a specific task. Anyone not directly involved in the completion of that task has no business within range of the tool, period.

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Of course, most of the people who will take the time to read through this are not the people who will be holding knives to tourist's throats.

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At it's core the problem is people who have "toys" that actually aren't toys and they have little notion of the real damage their "toys" can actually do. They see the toys, at the core, as props and not weapons.

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Of course, most of the people who will take the time to read through this are not the people who will be holding knives to tourist's throats.

Just for the record, I took the time to read this. :D

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Yes, but I don't recall seeing images of you holding a real knife to a tourist's throat for a photo. (I'd re-post the image I'm talking about, but it's not my place to defame anyone. Besides, it's not the only one I've seen - not by a long stretch.)

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Yes, but I don't recall seeing images of you holding a real knife to a tourist's throat for a photo. (I'd re-post the image I'm talking about, but it's not my place to defame anyone. Besides, it's not the only one I've seen - not by a long stretch.)

Color me confused mate, but ARE you saying there's a pic of me doing that?!? I do certainly protest this blatant and utter falsehood levied against me. Of course I would never engage in such nonsense.

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No, go back and read my first post.

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I'm going to agree with both sides. I generally walk the beach dressed up taking picture with tourists sometimes for tips... but publicly I dont have weapons on...

what I do is take my hat off and put it on who i'm takin the picture with instead. But when im with a group Im generally mean because when i think of pirates i think of sea-assholes. Unless the person is generally interested in the history of everything...

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Hey, that's a neat idea to put your hat on people. I may start doing that for all my reciprocal photos.

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@Mission little kids really love it. . It is not often a little boy or girl get to wear a real tricorn compared to a walmart one with a jolly roger on it..

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Tricorn. Feh. The Patrick Hand Originalâ„¢ Planter's Hat!

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