Capt. Sterling Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 I still prefer Reel and Real... as the Reels are usually trying to follow the myth,Hollywood,Historical Fictions, and the Reals are usually trying to follow the real history side of it, the actual people from history. In some of the Wild West events Reel versus Real is done to show the differences, both are needed in order to just this and no one seems to take any offense from it. Reel versus Real also seems to work in numerous time frames as well... "I being shot through the left cheek, the bullet striking away great part of my upper jaw, and several teeth which dropt down the deck where I fell... I was forced to write what I would say to prevent the loss of blood, and because of the pain I suffered by speaking."~ Woodes Rogers Crewe of the Archangel http://jcsterlingcptarchang.wix.com/creweofthearchangel# http://creweofthearchangel.wordpress.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedJessi Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Sterling - I really like that as well! I had never heard it before you used it in the other Twill thread but it makes good sense and keeps things even handed. What are some of the ways the distinction is made in spoken word? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quartermaster James Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Oh Gawd, I can't believe you actually pulled that piece to the surface again. LOL Maybe I should have used a different example, and that thread would have stayed buried. But, really, it was like a pack of wolves on a wounded deer. In all honesty, I disagree. In all honesty, I am very glad to have an actual example with which to work. In all honesty, if that thread is an "extreme example" then I am not concerned with anybody having taken offense. Far from a pack of wolves on a wounded deer, I first see four positive and constructive posts before one person voices a harsh critique. This does side track the query, but then Blackjohn tries to steer it back on course. There are a few humorously snarky comments following that, but if this is the sort of thing that scares people away then perhaps pyracy is not their calling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. Sterling Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 (edited) For example... at a Wild West event the Reel cowboys would show how Hollywood shot Wild Bill and then the Real cowboys would show what history says about the event... say at a Middle Ages event Reel knights could show the legends of King Arthur and then compare that to what is know about Real knights ... or obviously folks like Frodo and Legolas would fall in the Reel category. Now off to an event... Edited October 9, 2009 by Capt. Sterling "I being shot through the left cheek, the bullet striking away great part of my upper jaw, and several teeth which dropt down the deck where I fell... I was forced to write what I would say to prevent the loss of blood, and because of the pain I suffered by speaking."~ Woodes Rogers Crewe of the Archangel http://jcsterlingcptarchang.wix.com/creweofthearchangel# http://creweofthearchangel.wordpress.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackjohn Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 In all honesty, if that thread is an "extreme example" then I am not concerned with anybody having taken offense. Far from a pack of wolves on a wounded deer, I first see four positive and constructive posts before one person voices a harsh critique. This does side track the query, but then Blackjohn tries to steer it back on course. There are a few humorously snarky comments following that, but if this is the sort of thing that scares people away then perhaps pyracy is not their calling. [/font][/size] The one that springs to my mind is one with bucket boots (as I recall). There was a woman who really got rather upset, and complained that the authentic types were being abusive. It went round and round for awhile. She left. Yada yada. And now, I'm going camping! My Home on the Web The Pirate Brethren Gallery Dreams are the glue that holds reality together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawkyns Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 [ And now, I'm going camping! I'm outa here too. Teaching backsword classes this weekend in Philly. Hawkyns Cannon add dignity to what otherwise would be merely an ugly brawl I do what I do for my own reasons. I do not require anyone to follow me. I do not require society's approval for my actions or beliefs. if I am to be judged, let me be judged in the pure light of history, not the harsh glare of modern trends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hurricane Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 A butterfly flaps its wings in Nepal and we get a hurricane in Palm Beach. Uh, actually I live in Melbourne, a couple hours north. :) -- Hurricane -- Hurricane ______________________________________________________________________ http://piratesofthecoast.com/images/pyracy-logo1.jpg Captain of The Pyrates of the Coast Author of "Memoirs of a Buccaneer: 30 Year Before the Mast" (Published in Fall 2011) Scurrilous Rogue Stirrer of Pots Fomenter of Mutiny Bon Vivant & Roustabout Part-time Carnival Barker Certified Ex-Wife Collector Experienced Drinking Companion "I was screwed. I readied my confession and the sobbing pleas not to tell my wife. But as I turned, no one was in the bed. The room was empty. The naked girl was gone, like magic." "Memoirs of a Buccaneer: 30 Years Before the Mast" - Amazon.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ransom Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 Oh Gawd, I can't believe you actually pulled that piece to the surface again. LOL Maybe I should have used a different example, and that thread would have stayed buried. But, really, it was like a pack of wolves on a wounded deer. In all honesty, I disagree. In all honesty, I am very glad to have an actual example with which to work. In all honesty, if that thread is an "extreme example" then I am not concerned with anybody having taken offense. Far from a pack of wolves on a wounded deer, I first see four positive and constructive posts before one person voices a harsh critique. This does side track the query, but then Blackjohn tries to steer it back on course. There are a few humorously snarky comments following that, but if this is the sort of thing that scares people away then perhaps pyracy is not their calling. Okay, I know when I'm flogging a dead horse. I'm off to wash my hair. ...schooners, islands, and maroons and buccaneers and buried gold... You can do everything right, strictly according to procedure, on the ocean, and it'll still kill you. But if you're a good navigator, a least you'll know where you were when you died.......From The Ship Killer by Justin Scott. "Well, that's just maddeningly unhelpful."....Captain Jack Sparrow Found in the Ruins — Unique Jewelry Found in the Ruins — Personal Blog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedJessi Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 A butterfly flaps its wings in Nepal and we get a hurricane in Palm Beach. Uh, actually I live in Melbourne, a couple hours north. :) -- Hurricane I will happily attempt to divert the path away from my house toward your own if you wish! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 I started this thread outta frustration, as I'm trying to finish my Buccaneer stuff in time for PiP.... I'm still trying to make everything as authentic as I can, but there are a lot of parts that I can only guess at, and a few that are not period, but will "have to do" for now. I know what is "close" ... or a "guess"... or "not period correct" but if everything had to be 100% correct, I couldn't play at PiP this year.......(Hey... I'll upgrade/fix it later...) For example... I will be using some large spikes as tent pegs (gotta use something strong enough to get through the coral) I could make some wooden ones...but If I was a real Buccaneer/Hunter, I wouldn't carry them at all.... I'd just chop down that little tree right there and make them on the spot....I just can't do that at PiP Unfortunately, in TWILL, we would get into a three page debate about iron spikes vs. wooden tent pegs...(Hey.... it happened with the "where/how to carry a tankard ) OK...I still like TWILL. There is a lot of good information that gets posted here....But sometimes we (myself included) do get a little carried away...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hurricane Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 So true, so true. If the buccaneers were to properly boucan in period, you need green allspice trees for the deck to roast on. That's what gave the meat it's flavor. By the way, there was a great show on PBS I think about pirates (Global Traveler) = there is only one place you can still get period boucan and its just outside of Port Antonio in Jamaica. The Chief of the Maroons owns the place. The best part was, it showed exactly how to do it to period, right down to how the allspice wood is laid out and the pig split and cooked. Now I have to add that to my travels so I can see it down period style. But the problem here is that many would say, "well, that's a modern interpretation... where's the documentation. They are living history. The Maroons still live history. They don't need documentation. But many here insist on it and it has to be back then. Not a cook who was taught by his father who was taught by his father, etc. for 300 years there. I will always be fine with close enough. I am neither a degreed historian or archeologist. So I will let innovation and imagination kick in whenever original documentation isn't there. -- Hurricane -- Hurricane ______________________________________________________________________ http://piratesofthecoast.com/images/pyracy-logo1.jpg Captain of The Pyrates of the Coast Author of "Memoirs of a Buccaneer: 30 Year Before the Mast" (Published in Fall 2011) Scurrilous Rogue Stirrer of Pots Fomenter of Mutiny Bon Vivant & Roustabout Part-time Carnival Barker Certified Ex-Wife Collector Experienced Drinking Companion "I was screwed. I readied my confession and the sobbing pleas not to tell my wife. But as I turned, no one was in the bed. The room was empty. The naked girl was gone, like magic." "Memoirs of a Buccaneer: 30 Years Before the Mast" - Amazon.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jib Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 I fall into the realm of "Hollywood", "Reel", or "Farby" pirates on the forums. I call myself an entertainer, because that is what I do. My goal isn't always to educate you like a re-enactment or living history pirate (which can be very entertaining). My goal isn't to be 100% period (I wear bucket boots and have a mug on my belt). I sing, dance, engage in model ship battles, fight with rapier and dagger in a more Elizabethan or Stewart fashion. My goal is to make you happy and have a good time at the event I perform at. Even better if your a kid! I try and create a larger than life pirate, a lovable scallywag with a heart of gold. That said I think I have been treated pretty fair on the Twill forum. Had a rough run in with GOF way back when (no hard feelings, he set me straight and was a real Gent about it!). I like to ask questions on Twill to educate myself and for research. While I think most posters play nice I think a few folks do seem clique-ish and can get snotty on some replies. Lady Bower had it right, with no one in front of you we loose the ability to judge how a comment is intended. I had the pleasure to meet Patrick Hand a few years back at PiP and he's a great guy. One of the people who when I read his posts I wish I was closer because he is such a interesting person that I am certain we would be good friends (Patrick can make just about anything and he's willing to try so much!). That said I enjoyed the Buccaneer Project posts and hope that this post might bring Patrick and others, back to Twill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mission Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 I think three page discussions about how to hang a tankard are pretty funny myself. (But again, I appear to have a strange approach to all this.) And Patrick is the prince of pyrate re-enactors in my book. We could all do a lot worse than to try to emulate his approach. He's open, helpful, non-judgmental, not easily offended and a nice guy. This is why I found it odd at first when some said they thought the point of of a thread he started is to bash re-enactors. Maybe they just had never met Patrick. He can talk authentic, he can talk stitches, he can talk fantasy wear, he can talk boucan, he can talk re-imagining, he can talk world politics, he can talk physics... And he seems to knows something about all these things. So I don't think he started this as a bashing thread in any way. Reel and real has great appeal. However, it might be a tad too broad. OTOH, being broad (and well stated) makes it the least offensive. OTOOH, where does this leave pirates with skulls and fairy wings? The sorta' fit in the Reel category, but not really. At an event, I think this would be an awesome way to explain it to the public as Sterling outlined, though. It's easy to grasp and better than any more complicated structure we'll come up with. (But let's don't let that stop us... ) The entertainment thing Jib brought up is interesting to me. I sort of hesitate to even attempt to establish categories because I seriously doubt the things we do here are going to have much universal impact. (Although you never know...) But I also love to make categories, so building on Jib's post for the fun of doing this (and focusing on something other than clothing, which I think is misleading everyone): The Entertainer - A swell rag by Scott Joplin. No...wait... Someone interested in amusing the public through popular conceptions of dress and behavior for the period. They rely on broad, popular characterizations, often based on movies and popular literature. (Mostly stolen from Jib.) The Edutainer - Someone interested in educating the public on previous ways of living through personally researched period dress and activities. They rely on characterizations, skits, displays and explanations designed to teach past customs. The Purist Someone interested in total period immersion through living in the manner of the people from a particular period through personally researched period dress and behaviors. They rely on complete re-creation of a period environment. (Because of the interest in personally gratifying immersion, the public may be viewed as interfering with their characterization.) Of course, folks will slide back and forth even in those broad categories based on what events they decide to attend. However, I am trying to get to the heart of the matter by describing motivation rather than surface things like what you have or wear or do at an event. So someone may attend a public re-enactment, but behave like a purist. (Which may lead them to appear critical to Edutainers.) Mycroft: "My brother has the brain of a scientist or a philosopher, yet he elects to be a detective. What might we deduce about his heart?" John: "I don't know." Mycroft: "Neither do I. But initially he wanted to be a pirate." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ransom Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 As I've said many times...Patrick is my hero. If I have a question about pretty much anything, I'll ask him. I've been lucky enough to hang out with him on several occasions, and...dang... he's just a great guy. ...schooners, islands, and maroons and buccaneers and buried gold... You can do everything right, strictly according to procedure, on the ocean, and it'll still kill you. But if you're a good navigator, a least you'll know where you were when you died.......From The Ship Killer by Justin Scott. "Well, that's just maddeningly unhelpful."....Captain Jack Sparrow Found in the Ruins — Unique Jewelry Found in the Ruins — Personal Blog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pirate Petee Posted October 12, 2009 Share Posted October 12, 2009 HAHAHAHA! Ok my two cents, I think that some people are taking themselves a little too serious. When it comes down to it we are all playing dress up, or most of us anyway. Twill can have a lot of useful information, but take it for what its worth. None of us have any first hand knowledge of the era, so most info here is an educated guess and nobody can be 100% period correct, because we live in the 21st century. So in my opinion, in anybody's quest for their own pirate persona, ask questions, do your own research and decide on what you think is right and if anyone tells you otherwise, tell them politely to go F themselves because who cares what the think and being free people we are entitled to our own opinions and beliefs. Again thats just my two cents, much love. Hugs and Kisses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jib Posted October 12, 2009 Share Posted October 12, 2009 Mission my brother of another mother, steal away! You are a pirate after all! And as a side note: I love reading Missions posts on Twill too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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