D.man Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Hello mates can anyone help me out here i got this pistol but it does have any real markings on it. it looks like a english dragoon but im not sure, it doesnt have the makers name on it not even what the caliber it is, can anyone help me out thankie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascabel Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Hello mates can anyone help me out here i got this pistol but it does have any real markings on it. it looks like a english dragoon but im not sure, it doesnt have the makers name on it not even what the caliber it is, can anyone help me out thankie Its a modification of one of the Japanese-made "Tower" pistols that started in to production in the 1960's. This one has a shortened stock, and a different ramrod than the original steel one. It has also had what appears to be a brass musket type nose cap installed. They were about .69 caliber, but some were closer to .68. Quality control was pretty loose on them. Most were not reliable right out of the box. I have worked on a great many of these over the years to get them operational. >>>> Cascabel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Hand Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 My first though was a cut down Dixie Gun Works Tower pistol..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.man Posted February 21, 2009 Author Share Posted February 21, 2009 wow so thats what kind of pistol it is, Cascabel when you say that most were not reliable right out of the box, what problems did they have and is there anyway i can restore this one like having a longer stock made. i bought this pistol for only $80.00 it seems to work fine the half cock works and seems to fire fine. but if i can get a longer stock on it that would be great. D.man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascabel Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 wow so thats what kind of pistol it is, Cascabel when you say that most were not reliable right out of the box, what problems did they have and is there anyway i can restore this one like having a longer stock made. i bought this pistol for only $80.00 it seems to work fine the half cock works and seems to fire fine. but if i can get a longer stock on it that would be great. D.man A new stock is quite within the realm of possibility, but bear in mind that decent gunsmithing is expensive. When you say, "it seems to fire fine", are you meaning it actually sparks well and ignites the powder, or that it simply releases the cock when you pull the trigger ? The locks on these usually have springs that are not in balance, by that I mean that the frizzen spring is way too stiff for the mainspring strength. The frizzens usually need to be properly hardened to get a reliable spark, Other heat treat issues sometimes need to be dealt with in the lock internals. Lock geometry is very often incorrect for reliable sparking. I have seen an incredible number of problems on these guns, none of which is likely to be a safety issue, but all related to functionality. They vary considerably in quality from one individual example to the next. All that I have dealt with could be "put right", but some required more work than others. It's mostly a matter of what you are willing to pay for. Our own Stynky Tudor has one that I did a considerable amount of work on, including some re-styling to improve the over all appearance. >>>> Cascabel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.man Posted February 21, 2009 Author Share Posted February 21, 2009 Well at the moment i think im gonna try to get a good stock then the next step will be maybe change out the lock itself. but if you know where i can get a stock for a tower let me know and thanks fer the info Cascabel thankie D.man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.man Posted February 26, 2009 Author Share Posted February 26, 2009 (edited) What a piece of crap that pistol was you were right Cascabel. Those japanees pistols are junk everything on that gun was unsafe the lock kept firing it had no safty the the stock was cracked down the center of the stock that i didnt see. In all it was an unsafe pistol in my eyes so i ended up distroying it. I didnt want anyone else handleing that pistol what a waste of money oh Well live and learn next time i will just get a new flintlock and not a used piece of crap japaneese replica. Edited February 26, 2009 by D.man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Hand Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 so i ended up distroying it. I didnt want anyone else handleing that pistol Well a little late to post this than..... It can/could have been fixed.... just takes some work, time and minor research.... Oh well...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.man Posted February 26, 2009 Author Share Posted February 26, 2009 Hehehe thanks Patrick anyways i did save parts on it still i have the barrel and the lock still. but im just gonna get a new one instead do you know where i can pick up another pistol i was thinking of another Queen Anne from Dixie works or a light british dragoon from Middlesex Village trading co. I was also thinking of a Blunderbuss but i dont think i have the money for that one yet. at the moment i have two pistols my 69.cal Carville from Palmetto and my 50Cal Queen Anne. what do ye recommend Patrick or Cascabel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascabel Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 Hehehe thanks Patrick anyways i did save parts on it still i have the barrel and the lock still. but im just gonna get a new one instead do you know where i can pick up another pistol i was thinking of another Queen Anne from Dixie works or a light british dragoon from Middlesex Village trading co. I was also thinking of a Blunderbuss but i dont think i have the money for that one yet. at the moment i have two pistols my 69.cal Carville from Palmetto and my 50Cal Queen Anne. what do ye recommend Patrick or Cascabel For over all consistant quality and reliability right out of the box, you can't beat the Queen Anne. >>>> Cascabel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentlemenScotty Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 (raises hand) good day gents :] like d.man i too am looking for a pistol(my first however) and ye mates looks ta know thing or two about em' might i ask for a recomendation.. my personal preference is the look of a short dragoon but the ones ive found are from later periods is the queene annes the way to go? and one more-kits..always wanted to build me own..are they easy or tricky?? i'm all ears and eager to learn (tips hat) :]GS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graydog Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 (raises hand)good day gents :] like d.man i too am looking for a pistol(my first however) and ye mates looks ta know thing or two about em' might i ask for a recomendation.. my personal preference is the look of a short dragoon but the ones ive found are from later periods is the queene annes the way to go? and one more-kits..always wanted to build me own..are they easy or tricky?? i'm all ears and eager to learn (tips hat) :]GS For a “cheap” pistol I’d recommend the Doglock pistol from Loyalist Arms in Canada, eh. A nice pistol that will get you from the late 1600’s through the 1700’s. As to kits, that can be real iffy. A number of years ago I bought a Navy Arms kit for an 1863 Springfield and it assembled and functioned flawlessly (even though it was Japanese) but the bands required more finishing than my limited ability could accomplish and the kit had zero instructions on how to finalize the kit. A number of years later (20!) I got a Dixie Gunworks kit for an 1863 Springfield and all the parts were finished perfect but this kit needed a gunsmith to finalize because the parts were all misaligned! It cost more than the kit to get it “fixed”. My point is that kits can be a real crap shoot. Beyond just the model of weapon choice, it’s very important to know who is making the kit and the quality of that kit. Why am I sharing my opinion? Because I am a special snowflake who has an opinion of such import that it must be shared and because people really care what I think! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelsbagley Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 I've heard lots of good things about the Pedersoli Queen Anne, I even tried to buy one once (the vendor did not respond to email or answer the phone or return phone calls so I changed my mind)... The one piece of modest criticism I have heard with the Pedersoli Queen Anne is that people unfamiliar with working with brass were accidentally breaking the trigger guard. Apparently it needs to be annealed (softenned) before it can be bent into proper fit, and some beginners were having trouble with this and snapping the trigger guard unintentially. Another good pistol that is better for earlier stuff, but not too out of place in a late period re-enactment is the English Lock Horse Pistol, I think Loyalist carries those as well, as does Middlesex Village trading Company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascabel Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 I've heard lots of good things about the Pedersoli Queen Anne, I even tried to buy one once (the vendor did not respond to email or answer the phone or return phone calls so I changed my mind)... The one piece of modest criticism I have heard with the Pedersoli Queen Anne is that people unfamiliar with working with brass were accidentally breaking the trigger guard. Apparently it needs to be annealed (softenned) before it can be bent into proper fit, and some beginners were having trouble with this and snapping the trigger guard unintentially.Another good pistol that is better for earlier stuff, but not too out of place in a late period re-enactment is the English Lock Horse Pistol, I think Loyalist carries those as well, as does Middlesex Village trading Company. Actually, the problem with people breaking the trigger guard on the Queen Anne kit is improper procedure. For future reference, you do NOT need to anneal and bend it in any fashion. The proper procedure for installation is to seat the REAR end of it in place FIRST. Then, all that is needed is to hold the pistol in the normal position, (as if firing it), and put your index finger around the front of the guard, and pull back on it, as if pulling the trigger. The guard will "spring" a bit, and the front will then snap neatly into place in it's inlet. About the only other things that need to be dealt with with the Queen Anne kits is that the rear most point of the lock inlet needs to be cut to a sharper point, (due to limitations of the stock making machine), and the bottom end of the trigger needs to be shortened by about 1/8 of an inch, as it drags against the inside of the guard bow even after removing the mold line on the inside of the bow. Most of the ones I have worked on benefit from deepening the flash pan a bit, to get it below the touch hole. This is easily done with a rat-tail file. Other than those things, the kit almost falls together on it's own. >>>> Cascabel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentlemenScotty Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 Maser Cascabel..that be the one from Pedersoli ye be talkin' bouts? :]GS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silkie McDonough Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 After not reading the rules of the game "Name that Flintlock" My entry for the flintlocks name is ... MINE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascabel Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 Maser Cascabel..that be the one from Pedersoli ye be talkin' bouts?:]GS It is indeed, suh !!! The Pedersoli is the only commonly available Queen Anne style pistol at this time. There are a couple of others, but they are not usually seen. One is available from Blackley in England, and another from 'The Rifle Shoppe' here in the U.S. Both are only available as parts sets, and both are quite pricey. >>>>> Cascabel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentlemenScotty Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 Maser Cascabel..that be the one from Pedersoli ye be talkin' bouts?:]GS It is indeed, suh !!! The Pedersoli is the only commonly available Queen Anne style pistol at this time. There are a couple of others, but they are not usually seen. One is available from Blackley in England, and another from 'The Rifle Shoppe' here in the U.S. Both are only available as parts sets, and both are quite pricey. >>>>> Cascabel aye! have ye any experience with middlesexvillagetrading's British Dragoon quite pleasin' to me eye it is! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascabel Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 Maser Cascabel..that be the one from Pedersoli ye be talkin' bouts?:]GS It is indeed, suh !!! The Pedersoli is the only commonly available Queen Anne style pistol at this time. There are a couple of others, but they are not usually seen. One is available from Blackley in England, and another from 'The Rifle Shoppe' here in the U.S. Both are only available as parts sets, and both are quite pricey. >>>>> Cascabel aye! have ye any experience with middlesexvillagetrading's British Dragoon quite pleasin' to me eye it is! That one is as good as any that they sell. A lot of people have had very satisfactory experiences with products from Middlesex Village. These guns are made in India, and Middlesex Village is better at standing behind what they sell than a lot of other sellers of India made pieces. Quality can vary considerably from one individual example to the next, although Middlesex seems to do a better job of screening out the bad pieces. However, I notice that India made guns are improving quite a bit over what they used to be. It all boils down to what you are willing to spend, and what styling you prefer. When it comes to guns, I tend to be rather biased on the side of high quality and reliability, but that leaves you with very few choices unless you get into hand made pieces, which can be expensive. >>>>> Cascabel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quartermaster James Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 However, I notice that India made guns are improving quite a bit over what they used to be. That's good news. What do you know about the barrels. For example, the stampings on mine seem to indicate it was made in the 70s! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascabel Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 However, I notice that India made guns are improving quite a bit over what they used to be. That's good news. What do you know about the barrels. For example, the stampings on mine seem to indicate it was made in the 70s! I have not closely examined the barrels of any of the India made guns other than a general external inspection with the gun assembled. Some of the earlier ones that I have looked at had the tang welded on to them, which also welded the breech plug in place. Hopefully the breech plugs were also screwed in, rather than just pressed in to the barrels. Being welded, the only good way to tell would be an X-ray of the breech area. It's stuff like this that makes me distrust the quality of guns made in Third World countries. Remember, unlike european countries, India has no "proof" laws regarding firearms. I could go on and on, but you asked about barrels. The barrels on these guns are generally quite thin walled, which is not necessarily a bad thing, as long as they are made of good quality steel. The old originals are all quite thin walled at the muzzle, and these are copied from them. The thickness is adequate at the breech, where the maximum pressure is. >>>> Cascabel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Hand Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 One.... I'm in me cups.... so take anything I post in that manner.... India made guns I figure are "kits in the white"..... you have to do a lot of work to make them fire right....but they are nicely inexpensive...... (and probably more period than the wax cast repos.... but that is a different argument...) SO ye have the choice.... they are inexpensive.... for a first gun, you may be able to fiddle with them to make them work.....(the frizzen springs are way too heavy)(an' some of the Frizzens ain't hardened right... so ye gotta re-do that...).... But I can't think of a basic kit, that just goes together without some fiddling with anyway (well Dixie does have some good outta the box "sparklin" locks.. and maybe other company's have them also...)..... It's kinda a learning thing.... but once ye know it... ye can fix any problem......but it does take some larnin'...... (well just fiddling with them to make them work...) luckily.... if ye have a problem.... just ask here... an someone can help ye along....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentlemenScotty Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 gents with the true pyrate spirit ye both be and i'll not forget ye offer prepare to have ye ears a bendin' :]GS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.man Posted February 27, 2009 Author Share Posted February 27, 2009 That goes fer me too mates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highlander Posted January 18, 2010 Share Posted January 18, 2010 aye! have ye any experience with middlesexvillagetrading's British Dragoon quite pleasin' to me eye it is! Yes Sir, I owned one of those and the only problem I had was the Pan would not flip open when the flint struck the Hammer. Turns out it was the tang (or whatever it's called) under the Hammer. Ground a bit of that away, and worked a charm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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